Keeping your games fresh.

[Epically]

Hey guys, been a LONG time since I posted here as I got stuck on the d&d train for a while, but looking to get back into the swign of things.

Quick question to me fellow GMs out there:

What do you do to keep your DR games fresh and exciting? One problem I've had in the past is the overall lack of an adventure. Sure, you could throw in some random encounters, a retro clan, reapers, new zombies, death cultists and what not, but after a while my players have come to know and expect all the stuff in DR.

Plus I've always had a difficult time thinking up a long term main story arc. The biggest ones I had was one which involved the group getting genetic super powers and tracking down the science team responsible for the out break one by one. (They also had super powers). Another was the military planning to nuke every major city. And one more which I won't mention because I have a big crossover with the Resident Evil series.

Apart from that, I really draw a blank.

[ZombieSlayer01]

you can try and intruduce the 4 horseman of the apocalypse. have them be raiders and your group has to take them down one by one and make them really tough with a certain specialization they each have.

[dargo83]

i myself have used rifts africa with the death cults being lead by the incarnations of Death himself i use the world book they are the highest level of necromancers in my game right now there are only a few of them but as the zpoc goes on the more imearge. i also use Heros unlimited for different and special kinds of zeds like jugs with bone armor and huge bone claws, or fast attack that run as fast as a sports car , good luck out running or driving from them, and they can run like that along walls on all fours like in the bus scene from the mummy returns. i use the Black Vault all the time.

[Thinyser]

This is the biggest problem of DR, after a while it just gets stale and there isn't much to be done unless you just want to grind out random encounters. I think the best solution is to make it a crossover to another Palladium game. Pluck the players out of DR and plop them into PF or HU or even into Rifts.

[flatline]

I have not played DR yet so this may be way off base, but I can't see DR being the main campaign setting for a group. It lends itself to one-shot games or "victim" games where everyone expects to die after just a few sessions. As such, I recommend you use DR to "cleanse the pallet" in between campaigns in other settings or systems.

A long campaign will necessarily get bogged down in the gritty details of staying alive. Most groups get bored with that pretty quickly.

--flatline

[Thinyser]

I have not played DR yet so this may be way off base, but I can't see DR being the main campaign setting for a group. It lends itself to one-shot games or "victim" games where everyone expects to die after just a few sessions. As such, I recommend you use DR to "cleanse the pallet" in between campaigns in other settings or systems.

A long campaign will necessarily get bogged down in the gritty details of staying alive. Most groups get bored with that pretty quickly.

--flatline

[dargo83]

i have been running the same game for almost 2 years now and the game hasent gotten stale. i also have made a lot of changes to my game and my players love the changes. this is not the first DR game i have ran and the first one was by the books and it ended with as my players put it (total party wipe out) then i turned around and throw out most of the rules and made my own.

[filo_clarke]

I have posted similar responses in this forum previously, so please feel free to ignore if it sounds like you’ve read this before.

The primary enemy in the Zombie Apocalypse isn’t zombies, it is the reality of civilization that has come undone. When running long-term Dead Reign games, the drive for the players to stay alive is only loosely connected to the threat posed by the undead. Ultimately the campaign revolves around the group coping in a world that is no longer comfortable or safe; where every one of their provisions might be the last they ever see, and the ordinarily mundane annoyances of everyday life become vicious hazards to overcome.

Surviving the zombie apocalypse means going without niceties, like toilet paper and band-aids. Every cut or scrape, or blister from using a tool can result in an infection. Each sip of water from an unknown source risks parasites. The day to day activities of life become back-breaking tasks full of sweat and the reminder to constantly be looking over one’s shoulder. The physical and psychological impacts on the characters should be a constant, displayed on the faces of the players.

Add to this psychological reality the choices that other groups around the players are making, and you have an endless source of adventure. I use the many, many resources provided in Palladium books to simulate the physicality and danger of a rustic or nomadic existence for people who otherwise were unprepared for it. Rules for disease, hygiene, exhaustion, and starvation are all to be found in various books. Rules for overland travel, extreme weather conditions and equipment deterioration are likewise available. I also recommend using the optional firearms rules, penetration rules, and shock/blood loss rules to heighten the danger of combat.

Now, once you have set the stage and the players are experiencing life in the game world you have made, complete with penalties and hardships, you can add substance to the campaign. What are they willing to do to get a taste of the past life again, even for a moment? Will they steal from another group? Will they rob a lone survivor, merely because their numbers are greater? Do they ignore the pleas of a trapped victim, because helping them would be more costly than simply walking by?
Their morality can get quickly changed because of their circumstances. After a handful of these incidents, have them, as a group, re-evaluate the alignments they originally wrote on the page. If the group was marginally sociopathic to begin with, have some friendly NPCs lend constant, but nagging, conscience to their actions.

When the group interacts with other parties, play the differences off one another. Show other groups’ actions as being morally reprehensible (like rape to reduce stress, or not helping a survivor because they have nothing valuable to offer) or being overtly noble (saving lives regardless of the cost, sharing supplies no matter how precious).
Try to make the dynamic of the two (or more) groups come into conflict.

Obviously, this can be a source of combat, if the game needs some violence. But remember the golden rule of hardship. Every time the character is stabbed by a knife, use the penetration value rules. When they are set to dress the wound, use the equipment deterioration rules. Stopping the flow of blood with a filthy gauze pad will likely make matters worse. Also remember that wounded PCs are more interesting than healthy ones.

Each time the PCs get comfortable in a “secure” location, introduce difficulties that make the location less than ideal. Running out of food or water makes for a quick one-shot; but running out of insulin, or antibiotics, or kerosene can make for much more in-depth and complicated sessions. The harder it is to find something, the better the adventure is going to be! Furthermore, weather and environmental effects can turn any base of operations into a well-secured tomb in a hurry. Heavy snow-fall, a nearby forest fire, a drought; anything out of the players’ control, can make for an exciting problem to overcome. If civilization were intact, the solution would be easy, but without infrastructure the group is left to their own devices.

Use NPCs as tools to influence the game, not as background. If an NPC has a skill or ability that becomes necessary to the group’s continued survival, then dangle that NPC over the chasm to move the story along. Someone that can maintain the party’s vehicle(s) can be morally opposed to stealing supplies, forcing the group to change their tactics. Maybe an excellent combatant has a habit of beating up the women in the group, and the PCs need to make a decision as to whether they need his ability or not. “Enemy” parties can be great combatants for a little stress relief, but can be better recurring villains, that challenge the PC group’s right to search for supplies in certain areas. These “enemies” are, of course, only acting in their own best interest, and maybe they have sick/wounded/young/elderly members that they are committed to protecting, making wiping them out a truly evil action.

Tailoring the campaign to the PCs skills and backgrounds is crucial, as it will ultimately test each of their convictions and morality. Making impossibly difficult choices and morally questionable decisions is the ongoing impetus for keeping the story compelling. Each one of them will be expected to grow and change (not necessarily for the better) in order to cope with the fall of humanity, and the ongoing story is about their journey.
Also there are Zombies.

[flatline]

I have posted similar responses in this forum previously, so please feel free to ignore if it sounds like you’ve read this before.

The primary enemy in the Zombie Apocalypse isn’t zombies, it is the reality of civilization that has come undone. When running long-term Dead Reign games, the drive for the players to stay alive is only loosely connected to the threat posed by the undead. Ultimately the campaign revolves around the group coping in a world that is no longer comfortable or safe; where every one of their provisions might be the last they ever see, and the ordinarily mundane annoyances of everyday life become vicious hazards to overcome.

Surviving the zombie apocalypse means going without niceties, like toilet paper and band-aids. Every cut or scrape, or blister from using a tool can result in an infection. Each sip of water from an unknown source risks parasites. The day to day activities of life become back-breaking tasks full of sweat and the reminder to constantly be looking over one’s shoulder. The physical and psychological impacts on the characters should be a constant, displayed on the faces of the players.

Add to this psychological reality the choices that other groups around the players are making, and you have an endless source of adventure. I use the many, many resources provided in Palladium books to simulate the physicality and danger of a rustic or nomadic existence for people who otherwise were unprepared for it. Rules for disease, hygiene, exhaustion, and starvation are all to be found in various books. Rules for overland travel, extreme weather conditions and equipment deterioration are likewise available. I also recommend using the optional firearms rules, penetration rules, and shock/blood loss rules to heighten the danger of combat.

Now, once you have set the stage and the players are experiencing life in the game world you have made, complete with penalties and hardships, you can add substance to the campaign. What are they willing to do to get a taste of the past life again, even for a moment? Will they steal from another group? Will they rob a lone survivor, merely because their numbers are greater? Do they ignore the pleas of a trapped victim, because helping them would be more costly than simply walking by?
Their morality can get quickly changed because of their circumstances. After a handful of these incidents, have them, as a group, re-evaluate the alignments they originally wrote on the page. If the group was marginally sociopathic to begin with, have some friendly NPCs lend constant, but nagging, conscience to their actions.

When the group interacts with other parties, play the differences off one another. Show other groups’ actions as being morally reprehensible (like rape to reduce stress, or not helping a survivor because they have nothing valuable to offer) or being overtly noble (saving lives regardless of the cost, sharing supplies no matter how precious).
Try to make the dynamic of the two (or more) groups come into conflict.

Obviously, this can be a source of combat, if the game needs some violence. But remember the golden rule of hardship. Every time the character is stabbed by a knife, use the penetration value rules. When they are set to dress the wound, use the equipment deterioration rules. Stopping the flow of blood with a filthy gauze pad will likely make matters worse. Also remember that wounded PCs are more interesting than healthy ones.

Each time the PCs get comfortable in a “secure” location, introduce difficulties that make the location less than ideal. Running out of food or water makes for a quick one-shot; but running out of insulin, or antibiotics, or kerosene can make for much more in-depth and complicated sessions. The harder it is to find something, the better the adventure is going to be! Furthermore, weather and environmental effects can turn any base of operations into a well-secured tomb in a hurry. Heavy snow-fall, a nearby forest fire, a drought; anything out of the players’ control, can make for an exciting problem to overcome. If civilization were intact, the solution would be easy, but without infrastructure the group is left to their own devices.

Use NPCs as tools to influence the game, not as background. If an NPC has a skill or ability that becomes necessary to the group’s continued survival, then dangle that NPC over the chasm to move the story along. Someone that can maintain the party’s vehicle(s) can be morally opposed to stealing supplies, forcing the group to change their tactics. Maybe an excellent combatant has a habit of beating up the women in the group, and the PCs need to make a decision as to whether they need his ability or not. “Enemy” parties can be great combatants for a little stress relief, but can be better recurring villains, that challenge the PC group’s right to search for supplies in certain areas. These “enemies” are, of course, only acting in their own best interest, and maybe they have sick/wounded/young/elderly members that they are committed to protecting, making wiping them out a truly evil action.

Tailoring the campaign to the PCs skills and backgrounds is crucial, as it will ultimately test each of their convictions and morality. Making impossibly difficult choices and morally questionable decisions is the ongoing impetus for keeping the story compelling. Each one of them will be expected to grow and change (not necessarily for the better) in order to cope with the fall of humanity, and the ongoing story is about their journey.
Also there are Zombies.

So if you want drama, DR is a great setting.

But I gotta say, what you've described holds very little interest for me beyond a session or two. The grittiness of survival gets old pretty quickly for most gaming groups.

--flatline

[filo_clarke]

I don't claim that Dead Reign is for everyone, but the GM usually knows what their players want. However, the playstyles of many types of groups can be accomodated in Dead Reign; though I'm clearly biased in my assessment of that.

[Icefalcon]

I have to agree with Filo here. Most of my players like Dead Reign just because it is hard for them to survive. They do not "automatically" succeed in everything they attempt and the failures are more remembered more fondly in that game than the successes.

If combat is what your players want, there are tons of enemy types (from zombies to death cults to retros) to throw at them. If it is drama they want, there are plenty of chances to create it (man vs supernatural, man vs man, man vs nature, man vs himself, etc.). If they want to build something lasting, there is that opportunity as well, they will just have to struggle to get it.

In the end, the old maxim applies. "Nothing ever comes to one, that is worth having, except as a result of hard work."

[filo_clarke]

I couldn't have put it better myself. And believe me, I tried.

[Epically]

i have been running the same game for almost 2 years now and the game hasent gotten stale. i also have made a lot of changes to my game and my players love the changes. this is not the first DR game i have ran and the first one was by the books and it ended with as my players put it (total party wipe out) then i turned around and throw out most of the rules and made my own.

I'm interested to hear about the changes you made.

[Epically]

So I had a cool idea for a game. At least, I think it's cool.....

I'm currently running a game of D&D. My plan is to invite all the regular players around and start playing our D&D session. About half hour into into it, I'm going to fake banging on the door. I'll get up and answer it, only to be "eaten by zombies". After my fake death, I'll come back to the table and say, "Epically's blood is pooling around him. The screaming stops as his throat is ripped out. The crazed people by his body look and stare at you. What do you do?".

And then Dead Reign for the rest of the session. What do you guys think?

[filo_clarke]

So I had a cool idea for a game. At least, I think it's cool.....

I'm currently running a game of D&D. My plan is to invite all the regular players around and start playing our D&D session. About half hour into into it, I'm going to fake banging on the door. I'll get up and answer it, only to be "eaten by zombies". After my fake death, I'll come back to the table and say, "Epically's blood is pooling around him. The screaming stops as his throat is ripped out. The crazed people by his body look and stare at you. What do you do?".

And then Dead Reign for the rest of the session. What do you guys think?

I admit, it sounds like a neat "hook". I certainly don't have that kind of flair for the dramatic. But what is the actual "game idea"? I have run a similar type of scenario, where the players were playing themselves as PCs. Everyone designed "themselves" as OCCs, and the process was overseen by the entire group to make it fair. But even there, the actual "game idea" was one of societal collapse, and the realization of being cast out into the world, without any preparation. Dealing with the fallout of loss of control.

Ask one player about "going back for the cat", and you will get an interresting and depressing tale of returning to an urban center, because her cat was locked in her apartment, and she couldn't stand to let it starve.

Preserving the vestiges of a former life, to the point of sacrificing oneself, just to have that feeling of comfort and joy again even if only for a short time.

So (I ask with bated breath), what is the "game idea" you have?

[dargo83]

So I had a cool idea for a game. At least, I think it's cool.....

I'm currently running a game of D&D. My plan is to invite all the regular players around and start playing our D&D session. About half hour into into it, I'm going to fake banging on the door. I'll get up and answer it, only to be "eaten by zombies". After my fake death, I'll come back to the table and say, "Epically's blood is pooling around him. The screaming stops as his throat is ripped out. The crazed people by his body look and stare at you. What do you do?".

And then Dead Reign for the rest of the session. What do you guys think?

I admit, it sounds like a neat "hook". I certainly don't have that kind of flair for the dramatic. But what is the actual "game idea"? I have run a similar type of scenario, where the players were playing themselves as PCs. Everyone designed "themselves" as OCCs, and the process was overseen by the entire group to make it fair. But even there, the actual "game idea" was one of societal collapse, and the realization of being cast out into the world, without any preparation. Dealing with the fallout of loss of control.

Ask one player about "going back for the cat", and you will get an interresting and depressing tale of returning to an urban center, because her cat was locked in her apartment, and she couldn't stand to let it starve.

Preserving the vestiges of a former life, to the point of sacrificing oneself, just to have that feeling of comfort and joy again even if only for a short time.

So (I ask with bated breath), what is the "game idea" you have?

my current game is just like that all of the PCs are themselves 25 years in the future all of there OCCs are based off of there real world jobs.i helped them make there OCCs turning there real world skills to skills in the game. my game started about a week or so before the Apoc and now they are 8 months almost 9 months and now there starting to gain the OCCs from the books. one is becoming a Zed hunter and the other a Zed researcher, but they way i work how they gain there new OCC in the first place is that they have to find a veteran in there chosen field and then they have meet certain regierments like kill a particular type of Zed or collect so many DNA samples from different kinds of Zeds.

[Epically]

I admit, it sounds like a neat "hook". I certainly don't have that kind of flair for the dramatic. But what is the actual "game idea"? I have run a similar type of scenario, where the players were playing themselves as PCs. Everyone designed "themselves" as OCCs, and the process was overseen by the entire group to make it fair. But even there, the actual "game idea" was one of societal collapse, and the realization of being cast out into the world, without any preparation. Dealing with the fallout of loss of control.

Ask one player about "going back for the cat", and you will get an interresting and depressing tale of returning to an urban center, because her cat was locked in her apartment, and she couldn't stand to let it starve.

Preserving the vestiges of a former life, to the point of sacrificing oneself, just to have that feeling of comfort and joy again even if only for a short time.

So (I ask with bated breath), what is the "game idea" you have?

That is the game idea. The transition from roleplaying to roleplaying real life. It's just a once off session for Christmas. As for the session, I just have a bunch of random encounters planned and whatever happens, happens.

As for a long term campaign, I still struggle with ideas that I haven't done before, or ones that aren't ripped and adapted from tv/movies.

[ScrapDaddy]

My group does two things- We co-GM, and we threw in a touch of Nightbane. The premise(known only by myself and the other GM) is that a Vampire Intelligence brought about the Wave to weaken the earth, like a first line attack. The Master Vamp under his control has convinced a major portion of the "true" death cults that he is the incarnation of Brulyx, and we through Were-creatures in to balance it out. One of our PC's actually wound up becoming the "queen mother" of a tribe of weres, and another is now a Wampyr. what started out as the Zombie Apocalypse slowly revealed itself to our heroes as something much more serious. You can rebuild a civilization, but you have to fight true evil to get there.

[ScrapDaddy]

My group does two things- We co-GM, and we threw in a touch of Nightbane. The premise(known only by myself and the other GM) is that a Vampire Intelligence brought about the Wave to weaken the earth, like a first line attack. The Master Vamp under his control has convinced a major portion of the "true" death cults that he is the incarnation of Brulyx, and we threw Were-creatures in to balance it out. One of our PC's actually wound up becoming the "queen mother" of a tribe of weres, and another is now a Wampyr. what started out as the Zombie Apocalypse slowly revealed itself to our heroes as something much more serious. You can rebuild a civilization, but you have to fight true evil to get there.

The co-gm thing helps us, but it takes a special group to do it without metagaming. we have a general plot, but we don't share our specifics with each other.

[Thinyser]

My group does two things- We co-GM, and we threw in a touch of Nightbane. The premise(known only by myself and the other GM) is that a Vampire Intelligence brought about the Wave to weaken the earth, like a first line attack. The Master Vamp under his control has convinced a major portion of the "true" death cults that he is the incarnation of Brulyx, and we threw Were-creatures in to balance it out. One of our PC's actually wound up becoming the "queen mother" of a tribe of weres, and another is now a Wampyr. what started out as the Zombie Apocalypse slowly revealed itself to our heroes as something much more serious. You can rebuild a civilization, but you have to fight true evil to get there.

The co-gm thing helps us, but it takes a special group to do it without metagaming. we have a general plot, but we don't share our specifics with each other.

Interesting idea.

[Tor]

I'd probably just mercilessly rip off plot twists from existing zombie media, like the Shane revelation in Walking Dead as to how people turn.

A big challenge in keeping this fresh compared to other games is the comparative lack of NPCs and locations. GMs basically have to invent a lot more, whereas in other games, while GMs can still invent, they can also fall back on the huge amount of established content.

If we look back to Rifts when it was just RMB, or Nightbane before it got fleshed out, they probably felt like DR does not even after inclusion of expansions in terms of what you're given to work with.