Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Talavar »

Archangel23 wrote:Ok so Splogroth knows about the Bugs but lets say that he Decides to Kill them off to "Protect His Investment" on Rifts Earth. Colud Atlantis Kill off the Bugs? and if so How long would it take?


Yes, Atlantis could destroy the bugs. It wouldn't take very long. Xiticix are not particularly powerful vs. magic, and not well-equipped to fight a high tech. battle, and Splugorth minions use both. The biggest advantage of the Xiticix is numbers, something that doesn't help a lot vs. the Splugorth, and the high degree of individual strength/toughness in melee, something that also doesn't compare favourably to Splurgorth minions.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Kagashi »

Atlantis could obliterate all life on Rifts Earth, so yes, they could wipe out the bugs should Splynn choose to. The only thing stopping him are other Splugorth who dont want to see Splynn conquering too much land on the most powerful dimensional portal laden planet known in the Megaverse. If Splynn actively moves against another faction on Rifts Earth, Klynn and dozens of of the Splugorth would come in to stop Splynn. Thats why Splynn uses covert options to move against his enemies, like supporting the Gargoyles in Europe, Horune Pirates in the Oceans, and New Phoenix Empire in Africa.

I give the bugs a week for Atlantis to exterminate them should the war be conventional. The bugs are just too dumb and predictable and technologically inferior to anything Atlantis can throw at the them. What do the bugs have? numbers you say? Splynn owns an equal number of slaves on Atlantis and (four?) other worlds...let alone the billions of Kydian, Kittani, and other minions who can be thrown at this threat. But Im sure Atlantis has more to offer then mere hive-to-hive conventional fighting...he would use rifts, magic, and NBC warfare to achieve his goal (if its even a goal in the first place).

The bugs have what? Resin short swords and goo-guns?
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

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Bugs have some psionics, I believe, but that's chump-change against a power that regularly enslaves psychics...
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

They could do it, but it would take a while.

Atlantis doesn't seem to have much in the way of heavy bombers, so they'd have to engage the bugs more directly, and just the sheer number of bugs would be a problem.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by rat_bastard »

All it would take is a few kinetic kill weapons. It would hardly take the Kittani an afternoon to destroy every hive.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Library Ogre »

Splynncrth and his minions would clean it up pretty quickly, depending on how many resources Splynncrth wanted to put on it. I won't say "they could do it in a weekend", but I wouldn't be surprised if there hasn't been one hive that never got started because Splynncrth sent a team after it to capture and examine.. IIRC, the Xit sludge is high PPE, and might make a good money supply for Splynn if he could domesticate some. If he wanted to direct a lot of resources towards it, I would say a day or two per hive to render them impotent... the fact that the bugs do not help each other will really aid the Splugorth War Machine.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Nekira Sudacne »

Killer Cyborg wrote:They could do it, but it would take a while.

Atlantis doesn't seem to have much in the way of heavy bombers, so they'd have to engage the bugs more directly, and just the sheer number of bugs would be a problem.


It says that Splynn has zillions of just one warrior race at his disposal.

He can fight them about a million to one.

If splyncryth wanted, he could wipe out every Xiticic inside of a week.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Lenwen »

As was stated previously by Mr. Hall I personally think it all depends on how many different resources Lord Splynncryth decided to put to use on the Xitixic .

Just to play with them I could easily see him sending in several hundred thousand Conservators .. prior to any "REAL" attempt since they would be outnumbered litterally 10-1 Xitixic to Conservator the conservators would proly LIKE the idea of "playing" in such a dangerous situation .

After a few days or when Lord Splynncryth decides he has had enough "fun" and again depending on how many resources he wishes to bare on the Xitixic I personally think it would take anywhere from as long as a week and a half to as little as a few days .. at max ..

The Xitixic's most powerful advantage is thier Numerical superiority (sp?)
Thier most powerful resource thier own numbers .. which are simply a days worth of slaves in Atlantis .. litterally .. which is hardly something of a war for Lord Splynncryth .

If you think about it .. that would be the perfect place for Atlantean forces to be "groomed" at . NEVER send in the killing blow simply send in a force that is outnumbered by 10-100 an simply start lvling up your military quick fast and in a hurry .. if you so needed to do such a thing .. and Lord Splynncryth would do that .. just to have fun with the bugs .
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:They could do it, but it would take a while.

Atlantis doesn't seem to have much in the way of heavy bombers, so they'd have to engage the bugs more directly, and just the sheer number of bugs would be a problem.


It says that Splynn has zillions of just one warrior race at his disposal.


As sloppy as Palladium is about math at times, I tend to doubt that any of the books actually say that.

He can fight them about a million to one.

If splyncryth wanted, he could wipe out every Xiticic inside of a week.


:roll:

Okay people, here it is:
The approximate population breakdown for Atlantis is (Atlantis, p. 19):
Lord Splynncryth
1d6 visiting Splugorth
3 million high lords
100,000 conservators
21 million overlords
6.6 million powerlords
1.1 million slavers
5.8 million Blind Warrior Women
10 million Kittani
3.2 million Metzla
1200 Dragons (only 2% are elders, only 10% are adults)
250,000 Maxi Men
1 million Tattooed Men (50% are slaves)
500,000 Gargoyles and kin
12,000 Sunag
8 million human slaves
20 million non-human slaves
1d6+2 million visiting travelers

Xiticix Invasion, p. 22-23:
When a xiticix colony reaches 300 million members, it splits into 1d6 new colonies, each of roughly the same size. Each of those colonies will keep growing until it exceeds 200 million in population.
The Duluth Hive is the largest hive colony on Rifts Earth, and it spawned the other five, which were each 4-6 years old in 105 PA.
This would imply that there are at least 300 million Xiticix on Rifts Earth, since the original Duluth colony got large enough to split into 6 equally populated hives, and then each hive had 4-6 years to grow.
Also, the Duluth Hive is once again large enough that it is still producing queens and seeking to establish new colonies (though the other colonies are still too small).
300 million originally, split 6 ways = 50 million per colony.
If the Duluth Hive is seeking to make new colonies because it's reached the 200 Million mark, then that's another +150 million bugs, not counting the growth the other colonies have achieved in that time (it's save to assume the Duluth Hive grew faster due to better infrastructure and resources).
So that's at least 450 million bugs.

P. 85 paints a much less chilling picture, estimating that there are (as of 105 PA) 3-4 million xiticix. The projected rate of growth would put their total population at 50 million by 110 PA.
These estimates, however, are in-game estimations made by the Coalition States; they only show what the CS believes to be the truth.
They do not over-ride the previous population numbers that come from the writers themselves.


Long story short, if every man, woman, and child in Atlantis, including all slaves and visitors, formed an army, they would have less than 70 million soldiers.
Yes, a lot of them would be individually more powerful than the xiticix soldiers, but a lot of them would be LESS powerful (human level of power or lower).
Either way, they wouldn't outnumber the Xiticix.

And remember that the 450 million Xiticix estimate is based on the information in Xiticix Invasion, which took place in 105 PA.
In Aftermath, set 109 PA, (p. 69), it mentions:
"Left unchecked for these past four or five years, the Xiticix population has continued to explode, not quite at a geometric rate, but close to it. Soon, swarms from each hive will go forth with a new, young queen to start their own hive and increase the current Hivelands range by 33%."
Which means that as of 109 PA, each of the six Xiticix colonies has reached at least the 200 million population mark, making their total numbers a minimum of 1.2 Billion.

Feel free to check my math on this, but it sounds like more than a couple of weeks work.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by rat_bastard »

KC, your doing it wrong...

Your math simply assumes Atlantis would do it with simply their earth forces, when you add the other planets Splynth has (I'm away from my books but the amount is staggering) the Bugs are outnumbered.

That said here's how I would do it if I was so inclined:

First off, I'd have a bunch of mages capable of controlling the weather surround the hivelands with windstorms blowing towards the hives and cap the hivelands with thick clouds. Then I'd have the Kittani pummel the hivelnads with "Rods from God".

Suddenly the Xitixix population goes from millions to dozens of queens that somehow survived. a good amount of the dust and ash that would be kicked up by the impacts would either collect water molecules in the clouds and become rain or be blown back over the blast zone by the weather so the environmental damage would be minimal. The Dimensional damage done by the mass death of a supernatural species is another thing entirely.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

rat_bastard wrote:KC, your doing it wrong...

Your math simply assumes Atlantis would do it with simply their earth forces, when you add the other planets Splynth has (I'm away from my books but the amount is staggering) the Bugs are outnumbered.


The question was whether Atlantis could take the Xiticix, not whether all of Splyncryth's personal forces pulled in from other worlds could.

But even if it WAS asking about the entirety of Splyncryth's resources, it would still take more than a week to get them all to Rifts Earth.

That said here's how I would do it if I was so inclined:

First off, I'd have a bunch of mages capable of controlling the weather surround the hivelands with windstorms blowing towards the hives and cap the hivelands with thick clouds. Then I'd have the Kittani pummel the hivelnads with "Rods from God".


Using which spaceships?

Suddenly the Xitixix population goes from millions to dozens of queens that somehow survived. a good amount of the dust and ash that would be kicked up by the impacts would either collect water molecules in the clouds and become rain or be blown back over the blast zone by the weather so the environmental damage would be minimal. The Dimensional damage done by the mass death of a supernatural species is another thing entirely.


Yeah... I tend to think that the side-effects of such an attack would spoil the overall goal of protecting Splyncryth's investment in Rifts Earth.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Nekira Sudacne »

Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:They could do it, but it would take a while.

Atlantis doesn't seem to have much in the way of heavy bombers, so they'd have to engage the bugs more directly, and just the sheer number of bugs would be a problem.


It says that Splynn has zillions of just one warrior race at his disposal.


As sloppy as Palladium is about math at times, I tend to doubt that any of the books actually say that.


Atlantis, page 47.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:They could do it, but it would take a while.

Atlantis doesn't seem to have much in the way of heavy bombers, so they'd have to engage the bugs more directly, and just the sheer number of bugs would be a problem.


It says that Splynn has zillions of just one warrior race at his disposal.


As sloppy as Palladium is about math at times, I tend to doubt that any of the books actually say that.


Atlantis, page 47.


What that actually says is that the Splugorth as a species use the Kydians as an army, and that they encourage the Kydians to breed frequently "in order to continue to amass a great army of zillions."
This differs from your claim in that:
-It is discussion the overall army numbers of the Splugorth race as as whole, not the resources that Splyncryth has at his disposal.
-It is discussing a vague overall goal for future numbers, not describing the "army" as it necessarily currently exists.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Nightbreed »

Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:They could do it, but it would take a while.

Atlantis doesn't seem to have much in the way of heavy bombers, so they'd have to engage the bugs more directly, and just the sheer number of bugs would be a problem.


It says that Splynn has zillions of just one warrior race at his disposal.


As sloppy as Palladium is about math at times, I tend to doubt that any of the books actually say that.


Atlantis, page 47.


What that actually says is that the Splugorth as a species use the Kydians as an army, and that they encourage the Kydians to breed frequently "in order to continue to amass a great army of zillions."
This differs from your claim in that:
-It is discussion the overall army numbers of the Splugorth race as as whole, not the resources that Splyncryth has at his disposal.
-It is discussing a vague overall goal for future numbers, not describing the "army" as it necessarily currently exists.


The problem in dealing with Atlantis dealing with the bugs is in HOW they deal with them. If they go all genicidal and bring in a huge extermination squad, the CS WILL GET INVOLVED complicating things for everyone as the CS would flip out and think that Atlantis finally decided to invade. That's not good for business.

I see Splyncryth taking some bugs prisoner and using them for bio-experiments. This way something can be developed so they can be dealt with properly. Maybe even pacified or harvested. I like the idea for bio-bug warriors Would be great fodder.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Nightbreed »

Ajax wrote:Lord Splynncryth couldn't kill of the bugs simply because he doesn't have the ability to utilize the force nessacary to do it at current. There are to many other major players in the multiverse that would mobilize against him should he muster the forces needed to wipe out the bugs.

Top 5 Entities that wouldn't allow Lord Spynncryth a free hand to do as he pleases on Rifts Earth,

Naruni enterprises
The Gods of Light
Most of the Gods of Darkness (because they're bitter)
Vampire Intelligences
The demons of China


The Naruni might be able to do something and that's a BIG if, since the CS drove them out and though they're tricking back in (or trying to anyway) they would be a minor factor at best.

The Gods of light and darkness also MIGHT be a factor, i'm sure they got other things to worry about, but you never know. Again a minor factor at best.

The Vamps are more concerned about their territory and as they don't have any influence in that part of the continent won't be a factor at all.

Do you really believe the Demon Lords of China really care about anything outside of their sphere of influence? I doubt they're even AWARE of Atlantis, much less care about them.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by kevarin »

if splynncryth ever really wanted to take out anything on rifts earth i think all he would have
to do is send in his dragon dreadnoughts with enough support and it wouldn't be a problem
i think 4 or 5 of those with support could take a hive np
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

kevarin wrote:if splynncryth ever really wanted to take out anything on rifts earth i think all he would have
to do is send in his dragon dreadnoughts with enough support and it wouldn't be a problem
i think 4 or 5 of those with support could take a hive np


The Dragon Dreadnoughts would be powerful weapons, but they're not all that.
An average TK rifle inflicts 4d6 MD, for an average of 14 MD per attack, and has a range of 4,000'.
Say you have only 1,000 xiticix firing their weapons at the same target. On average, maybe 15% will miss, meaning that 850 of them will hit the target for a total average of 8120 MD per attack.
A Dragon Dreadnought has 2100 MDC in its main body, and a total of 7340 if you add up the individual MDC of each part.
There are at least 200,000,000 xiticix in each hive complex.

Of course, not all of those bugs are going to be warriors, and not all are going to have TK rifles, but the point is that there are more than enough to wipe out a Dragon Dreadnought in pretty short order in a straight-up fight.
The DDs would last longer if there was a lot of cannon fodder going with it to soak up attacks, but it would still be a long, bloody battle, one that the DDs wouldn't be certain to win.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Kagashi »

Killer Cyborg wrote:
rat_bastard wrote:KC, your doing it wrong...

Your math simply assumes Atlantis would do it with simply their earth forces, when you add the other planets Splynth has (I'm away from my books but the amount is staggering) the Bugs are outnumbered.


The question was whether Atlantis could take the Xiticix, not whether all of Splyncryth's personal forces pulled in from other worlds could.

But even if it WAS asking about the entirety of Splyncryth's resources, it would still take more than a week to get them all to Rifts Earth.


I think that using the 3 other worlds that Splynn owns still counts as "Atlantis" for the purposes of this discussion because Splynn has access to them (Despite the fact we dont have any numbers on these planets). Even if it were just Atlantis, 450 million bugs vs 70 million Splugorth minions (assuming all of Atlantis leaves their island on this crusade) would still be in the favor of the Splugorth since Kittani Serpent Power Armor is vastly superior to a Xiticix resin short sword... It comes down to equipment and technology (magic included). Atlantis has it all. the 1:6.4 odds tilt in favor of Atlantis when you consider technology.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

Kagashi wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
rat_bastard wrote:KC, your doing it wrong...

Your math simply assumes Atlantis would do it with simply their earth forces, when you add the other planets Splynth has (I'm away from my books but the amount is staggering) the Bugs are outnumbered.


The question was whether Atlantis could take the Xiticix, not whether all of Splyncryth's personal forces pulled in from other worlds could.

But even if it WAS asking about the entirety of Splyncryth's resources, it would still take more than a week to get them all to Rifts Earth.


I think that using the 3 other worlds that Splynn owns still counts as "Atlantis" for the purposes of this discussion because Splynn has access to them (Despite the fact we dont have any numbers on these planets).


I disagree, because then the question is pointless; of course three planets worth of resources can take out one some killer insects taking up part of one continent on a lone planet.

Even if it were just Atlantis, 450 million bugs vs 70 million Splugorth minions (assuming all of Atlantis leaves their island on this crusade) would still be in the favor of the Splugorth since Kittani Serpent Power Armor is vastly superior to a Xiticix resin short sword... It comes down to equipment and technology (magic included). Atlantis has it all. the 1:6.4 odds tilt in favor of Atlantis when you consider technology.


450 million bugs was the estimate for 4-5 years ago in the Rifts Timeline.
"Currently" the bugs have at least 1.2 billion.

The Kittani weapons are impressive, including the Serpent Power Armor, but not enough to make victory certain.
For one thing, there are presumably limited numbers of such armor. It's not for general sale, so they'd only have enough on Atlantis for the Kittani to use, and there are only 10 million Kittani on Atlantis.
If it gets down to melee combat, the Serpent Armor will have an advantage over a xiticix warrior, but until it gets down to melee the power armor is at a disadvantage; the plasma axe's blasts only have a range of 200', vs. the 4,000' range of a TK rifle.
It has 4 mini-missiles, but those would get used up pretty quickly.
It has auto-dodge at +3, but would still be at -6 to dodge the TK rifle blasts, for a total of -3 without applying other bonuses.
Of course, they can carry a rifle instead of the axe, but then they're giving up the advantage in melee.

And the bugs are pretty darned GOOD at melee.
An average warrior has a supernatural PS of 31, so his punch does 3d6 MD, plus another 2d6 if they have a Xiticix Long Sword, for a total of 5d6 MD, almost as good as the Plasma axe's 1d4x10.
And because of their four arms, they can attack with two weapons at once without losing their parry, so the damage would commonly up to 10d6 MD- better than the Plasma Axe.
And they can make simo-attacks without giving up their own option to parry (though they do lose normal parry bonuses).

Also, the Xiticix like to gang-pile their enemies and grapple them. A suit of Serpent power armor can lift 1150 lbs, but Xiticix Warriors weigh 500 lbs each; three warrors tackling the same Serpent are going to drag him to the ground and slowly pick him apart.
A Xiticix Super Warrior weighs 700-1000 lbs, so even just one warrior and one Super Warrior could drag down Serpent Power armor.


One thing I noticed this time through though, was that only 30% of Xiticix Warriors carry TK Rifles, so that makes them less deadly in ranged combat than I previously thought.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Lenwen »

Killer Cyborg wrote: But even if it WAS asking about the entirety of Splyncryth's resources, it would still take more than a week to get them all to Rifts Earth.


I personally Highly doubt it would . Advanced Tech , More numbers then the Bugs have , Magic , Psionics ... The Bugs are outmatched in every concievable way possible ..

I think that using the 3 other worlds that Splynn owns still counts as "Atlantis" for the purposes of this discussion because Splynn has access to them (Despite the fact we dont have any numbers on these planets).


That is a fact . Lord Splynn could easily bring in an military of tens of Billions .. squash the bugs an have them billions out minus the casualties in a matter of a week easily ..

Killer Cyborg wrote: I disagree, because then the question is pointless; of course three planets worth of resources can take out one some killer insects taking up part of one continent on a lone planet.


Yep . And do it with a blood lust not seen ever on Rifts earth .. to date ..

Killer Cyborg wrote: The Kittani weapons are impressive, including the Serpent Power Armor, but not enough to make victory certain.
For one thing, there are presumably limited numbers of such armor. It's not for general sale, so they'd only have enough on Atlantis for the Kittani to use, and there are only 10 million Kittani on Atlantis.


Where do you get that thier "presumably" in limited numbers .. the only thing that Lord Splynn does not allow the Kittani to make are the Dragon Dreadnaughts .. everything is .. is open game for them to make in mass quantities . And Using Kittani based Power Armors for his own military would not be considered "for general use" .. General use means anything sold or anything of that nature .. not something that you yourself use ..

Killer Cyborg wrote: If it gets down to melee combat, the Serpent Armor will have an advantage over a xiticix warrior, but until it gets down to melee the power armor is at a disadvantage; the plasma axe's blasts only have a range of 200', vs. the 4,000' range of a TK rifle.


If it gets down to melee combat .. the Conservators would litterally take out squads at a time of the Xitixic Superbugs . thats not even counting the Conservators that have had the "works" in terms of the superabilities granted them threw atlantis bio-Tech stuffs . So a squad is equal to no less then 12 and sometimes up to 18 . 1 -18 ratio in kills .. I'd take that any day of the week . 100,000 Conservators = 1.8million + bugs dead and gone .

Thats not even counting the 21million Powerlords each having supernatural strenth that can be boosted further as well as thier Armor's which also grant various powers and what not . And all thier Rune Weaponry they carry thier staffs an other what nots .. those 21 million Kydians how many of them carry a Staff of Command or something similar to that which they could easily take command of several Xit super warriors an turn them on thier own kind .. as a force multiplier ...

Killer Cyborg wrote: And the bugs are pretty darned GOOD at melee.
An average warrior has a supernatural PS of 31, so his punch does 3d6 MD, plus another 2d6 if they have a Xiticix Long Sword, for a total of 5d6 MD, almost as good as the Plasma axe's 1d4x10.


Not as good as a Conservator ... run a single combat scenario 10 times ... who is going to win ?

Killer Cyborg wrote: Also, the Xiticix like to gang-pile their enemies and grapple them. A suit of Serpent power armor can lift 1150 lbs, but Xiticix Warriors weigh 500 lbs each; three warrors tackling the same Serpent are going to drag him to the ground and slowly pick him apart.
A Xiticix Super Warrior weighs 700-1000 lbs, so even just one warrior and one Super Warrior could drag down Serpent Power armor.


The Kydians and conservators will both rip those Xit apart with thier bear hands . The Kittani Serpant Power armors will be there as a support unit to those two forces . Thats how it would happen . Why send in the Kittani when you have 21 million powerlords EACH capable of handling SEVERAL Xit superwarriors at a time .. or even the mighty Conservators .. able to hand at LEAST 3 Xits at a time EASILY ....

Killer Cyborg wrote: One thing I noticed this time through though, was that only 30% of Xiticix Warriors carry TK Rifles, so that makes them less deadly in ranged combat than I previously thought.


That means 70% of the Xit military has ZERO range outside of Hand to Hand combat .. and that means loss's of up to 70% within a few days .. easily .. due just to that simple fact .
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by kevarin »

ok i did say 4 to 5 dragon dreadnoughts with support
but im thinking say 5 dreadnoughts thats 16 long range
multi warhead missiles each for a total of 80 missiles
doing 2D4x100 each to a 50FT area thats a very
painful opening volley now add in the medium range
missiles and you have another 40 missiles doing 5D6x10
each to a 40 ft area ouch

now what i would do is shoot one missile from each dreadnought
then a few seconds later release the rest the first ones hit rile up the
nest and others come rushing out and i could be wrong should swarm
to the point of attack then the rest hit and take out god knows how
many more bugs

now i did say with support so im going to say one million assault troops
per dreadnought sounds good now that coud lay a hurting on most powers
in rifts earth


you could actually reduce there numbers by a large margin if you think out
the attack


just my thoughts on it
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

Lenwen wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote: But even if it WAS asking about the entirety of Splyncryth's resources, it would still take more than a week to get them all to Rifts Earth.


I personally Highly doubt it would.


You obviously have a lot more faith in the organizational ability of the Splugorth and supporting races than I do. Not to mention the size and number of interdimensional Rifts that they're capable of opening on demand.

Lord Splynn could easily bring in an military of tens of Billions .. squash the bugs an have them billions out minus the casualties in a matter of a week easily ..

Source?

And do it with a blood lust not seen ever on Rifts earth .. to date ..

:erm:

Where do you get that thier "presumably" in limited numbers .. the only thing that Lord Splynn does not allow the Kittani to make are the Dragon Dreadnaughts .. everything is .. is open game for them to make in mass quantities.


There are only 10 million Kittani on Atlantis. How many suits do you think each one needs?
I'm guessing less than one, considering there are other kinds of armor, robots, and vehicles that the Kittani also use.

And Using Kittani based Power Armors for his own military would not be considered "for general use" .. General use means anything sold or anything of that nature .. not something that you yourself use ..


Certainly.
But other than the Kittani, and the small percentage of human-sized slaves who are trained in power armor combat, who do you envision wearing these suits of Serpent armor?

Killer Cyborg wrote: If it gets down to melee combat, the Serpent Armor will have an advantage over a xiticix warrior, but until it gets down to melee the power armor is at a disadvantage; the plasma axe's blasts only have a range of 200', vs. the 4,000' range of a TK rifle.


If it gets down to melee combat .. the Conservators would litterally take out squads at a time of the Xitixic Superbugs.


Odd, considering that 5-6 Super Warriors would dogpile a Conservator to the ground by weighing more than he could lift.
The Conservators are tough, but there's only 100,00 of them.
They're individually stronger than Xiticix, and they have more MDC than the bugs, but they're hardly invincible- they'd still fall to the sheer number of bugs if one of them tried to take on patrol single-handed.

So a squad is equal to no less then 12 and sometimes up to 18 . 1 -18 ratio in kills .. I'd take that any day of the week . 100,000 Conservators = 1.8million + bugs dead and gone.


Congratulations. Going with your estimates, you can manage to take out nearly 1/100th of a hive before your Conservators are all dead.

Thats not even counting the 21million Powerlords each having supernatural strenth that can be boosted further as well as thier Armor's which also grant various powers and what not . And all thier Rune Weaponry they carry thier staffs an other what nots .. those 21 million Kydians how many of them carry a Staff of Command or something similar to that which they could easily take command of several Xit super warriors an turn them on thier own kind .. as a force multiplier ...


Only 6.6 million Powerlords.

Anyway, yeah, there's a lot of powerful warriors in Atlantis.
But they're not likely to average an 18:1 kill ratio, and in order to win in just a stand-up invasion, that's what they'd have to do.

Killer Cyborg wrote: And the bugs are pretty darned GOOD at melee.
An average warrior has a supernatural PS of 31, so his punch does 3d6 MD, plus another 2d6 if they have a Xiticix Long Sword, for a total of 5d6 MD, almost as good as the Plasma axe's 1d4x10.


Not as good as a Conservator ... run a single combat scenario 10 times ... who is going to win?


One on one?
An unwounded, fully armed and armored Conservator will beat an unwounded, fully armed and armored Xiticix Warrior pretty much every time as far as I can tell.
But his armor will get damaged in the process each time he fights one.
And eventually his armor will get torn away and he'll get wounded.
And unless he has time to fully rest up before each battle, he'll get slowly worn down and killed.

But that's in one-on-one combat.
The more likely scenario is that he's going to be fighting more than one bug.
If he's fighting 10+ at once, they can dog-pile him and drag him down to the ground.

And face it, one-on-one combat isn't going to happen unless the Atlantean forces take their time and choose their battles. If they're wanting to rush in and win in a weak, they're going to have the odd against them far more often than not.

ALSO, I'll point out that Conservators are insane.
Each conservator rolls twice on their insanity table, and each roll gives them:
-A 2% chance of being obsessed with avoiding combat.
-A 4% chance of having an affective disorder (with a 75%+ chance of having a disorder that renders him pretty useless in a war against the xiticix)
-a 6% chance of having a random neurosis (18% chance of being afraid of the dark to the point of total collapse, 14% chance of paranoia against other species- not great when working for Splugorth, 20% chance of having a fear of heights, and a 15% chance of having a fear of success that provides combat penalties in important combats).
-A 6% of having a psychosis (15% chance of having an 89% chance of going blind under pressure, 12% chance of having psychotic paranoia, 20% chance of being manic/depressive, 23% chance of schizophrenia with a 50% chance of alcohol/drug addiction, 16% chance of psychotic mindless aggression, and a 15% chance of thinking that he's a psychiatrist).

So of the 100,000 Conservators, a lot are going to be unfit for combat duty, and of those that ARE fit for combat, they're often still going to be unreliable and/or unfit to work with teams.
And that's not counting the ones who are so obsessed with combat that they take unnecessary risks (like attacking more bugs than they can swat).

The Kydians and conservators will both rip those Xit apart with thier bear hands.

Unlikely, since kydians are slightly weaker than Xiticix Warriors on average.
Powerlords are stronger than the average Warrior, but not by a whole lot, and they're only 5 points stronger than the average Super-Warrior (some Super Warriors are going to be stronger than the Powerlords).
The Conservators we've already addressed.

The Kittani Serpant Power armors will be there as a support unit to those two forces . Thats how it would happen. Why send in the Kittani when you have 21 million powerlords EACH capable of handling SEVERAL Xit superwarriors at a time .. or even the mighty Conservators .. able to hand at LEAST 3 Xits at a time EASILY ....


Hell, man... why do ANY of that when you can take your time about things and missile the Xiticix for a few months to soften them up first?

For that matter, if it were ME, I'd send in the Sunaj and/or other hit squads to take out the queens directly, and try to bypass a big war in the first place.

In any case, you're once again wrong about the number of powerlords, as well as their capabilities vs. the Super-Warriors.

Killer Cyborg wrote: One thing I noticed this time through though, was that only 30% of Xiticix Warriors carry TK Rifles, so that makes them less deadly in ranged combat than I previously thought.


That means 70% of the Xit military has ZERO range outside of Hand to Hand combat .. and that means loss's of up to 70% within a few days .. easily .. due just to that simple fact .


No, that means that 70% of the Xiticix Warriors carries no TK rifle.
The books don't say how many of the Hunters carry TK Rifles, but it does say that Hunters "like" them. Same applies to Leapers.
As for the Warriors, 25% carry Resin Spike Guns, and 5% carry a Resin Gun.
25% of the Super-Warriors carry TK Rifles, and 5% carry TK Pistols or Resin Rifles.
And the greater percentage of most Xiticix breeds carry a spear (or two), which has a range of 300'.
And I'm not sure how many bugs use them, but they also have Shooting Shoulder Spikes they can wear that have a range of 60'

Also, I tend to think that they'd start carrying more guns if they needed to go to actual war with somebody, especially if the opposition used a lot of ranged weapons.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

kevarin wrote:ok i did say 4 to 5 dragon dreadnoughts with support
but im thinking say 5 dreadnoughts thats 16 long range
multi warhead missiles each for a total of 80 missiles
doing 2D4x100 each to a 50FT area thats a very
painful opening volley now add in the medium range
missiles and you have another 40 missiles doing 5D6x10
each to a 40 ft area ouch


If you use them against swarms of incoming bugs, yeah... but they got plenty more bugs where that came from.
Against the structures, it wouldn't be that great, although you could knock over a few towers.

now what i would do is shoot one missile from each dreadnought
then a few seconds later release the rest the first ones hit rile up the
nest and others come rushing out and i could be wrong should swarm
to the point of attack then the rest hit and take out god knows how
many more bugs

now i did say with support so im going to say one million assault troops
per dreadnought sounds good now that coud lay a hurting on most powers
in rifts earth


you could actually reduce there numbers by a large margin if you think out
the attack

just my thoughts on it


That's certainly better than I was picturing.

Still, the 5 million man cannon fodder would still be outnumbered by about 40 to 1. That's not great odds.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by kevarin »

ok maybe 2 mill troops per dreadnought sounds better
but im not sure what craft and weapons the splugorth
and kittani have i just have an old atlantis book
not sure if there equipment was expanded in other books
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Lenwen »

killgore wrote:
Ajax wrote:Naruni enterprises

They would sell their arms to everyone nearby: "To defend against the Splugorth aggression."
The Gods of Light

Might actually help the Spluggies on this one.
Most of the Gods of Darkness (because they're bitter)

Splynncrift would give them a 10% discount on any purchases in Splynn for 50 years if thet ignored the situation, or utterly destroy them (again with the assistance of the gods of light if they didn't.
Vampire Intelligences

They might pick off a few stragglers hear and there, but ultimately, it'd be over before the vamps got anything close to a plan in gear.
The demons of China

I personally would assume they are very aware of Atlantis (unlike other posters), I just don't think they care if the spluggies go after another invader. As long as Atlantis doesn't actually try and conquer North America.

As far as the other world under Splynns control; if he can use them, then the Xitcix queens can open rifts to other Xitcix worlds. :-D


ya had me agree'ing with you on most things except the whole Xitixic queen an rift opening .. since its clearly not a power they posses according to thier write ups in the Invasion book .

Good try tho heh.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Talavar »

killgore wrote:
Lenwen wrote:ya had me agree'ing with you on most things except the whole Xitixic queen an rift opening .. since its clearly not a power they posses according to thier write ups in the Invasion book .

Good try tho heh.

Don't have the book in front of me, and never really used them much in game. How do they consistently show up on Earth. Not all of the hives are break away from the first hive, I know that. Is there a permanent or dependable rift (the name I gave rifts that open on a regular basis to the same location) to the Xitcix home world?


I believe all the Xiticix on Earth are the result of one group rifted in. They breed crazy fast, and can be grown to adulthood crazy fast as well.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Nightbreed »

killgore wrote:
Ajax wrote:Naruni enterprises

They would sell their arms to everyone nearby: "To defend against the Splugorth aggression."
The Gods of Light

Might actually help the Spluggies on this one.
Most of the Gods of Darkness (because they're bitter)

Splynncrift would give them a 10% discount on any purchases in Splynn for 50 years if thet ignored the situation, or utterly destroy them (again with the assistance of the gods of light if they didn't.
Vampire Intelligences

They might pick off a few stragglers hear and there, but ultimately, it'd be over before the vamps got anything close to a plan in gear.
The demons of China

I personally would assume they are very aware of Atlantis (unlike other posters), I just don't think they care if the spluggies go after another invader. As long as Atlantis doesn't actually try and conquer North America.

As far as the other world under Splynns control; if he can use them, then the Xitcix queens can open rifts to other Xitcix worlds. :-D


You tell me the exact source that says that the Demon Lords of China actually know about Atlantis and that they would possibly take any action to stop them taking on anyone but them and i'll happily admit i'm wrong. ;)

Till then i stand by what i said.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Library Ogre »

Really, I think the solution for the Splugorth is pretty similar to the solution for the CS: Get the Kittani to put some high-altitude transport/bombers up there and trash the place. Do this for a while, mixing in some chemical warfare, and possibly a rerouted river (an advantage the splugorth have is they might simply find a way to open an environmentally permeable rift the bottom of the ocean and flood the place) then go in with automatons and crazy people to clean out any remaining resistance. If Splynncrth wants to dump TONS of resources on this, he can do a hive every day or two... more likely, he'll do one every month, with a much lower intensity of combat.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Nightbreed »

killgore wrote:
Mark Hall wrote:Really, I think the solution for the Splugorth is pretty similar to the solution for the CS: Get the Kittani to put some high-altitude transport/bombers up there and trash the place. Do this for a while, mixing in some chemical warfare, and possibly a rerouted river (an advantage the splugorth have is they might simply find a way to open an environmentally permeable rift the bottom of the ocean and flood the place) then go in with automatons and crazy people to clean out any remaining resistance. If Splynncrth wants to dump TONS of resources on this, he can do a hive every day or two... more likely, he'll do one every month, with a much lower intensity of combat.


Heh... I still think he'd just turn it into a tourist attraction. Get people to pay him to allow them to kill the bugs for him seems much more his speed. :twisted:


Great, Xiticix Park. :lol: That would seem like something Splynncryth would do.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Lenwen »

Every Xitixic bug on the planet ( so far that is in print ) has been a direct descendent of the Duluth hive . One massive swarm was rifted to the earth at some time durring the dark ages . And they had not yet become a "global" power as of the opening scenes ( 102P.A.) in North America . But they can reproduce on a goemetric rate if givin the right "circumstances" and they can grow to adults when pushed or at war within 1/10th the normal time .

That is what part of makes them a seriously underestimated powerblock ..

Being able to replenish millions in a matter of months .. as well as building everything they need with out the need of anything other then resin .

The Xit is a nasty bug an 1 I dont think many on rifts earth could really push into extinction outside of Atlantis I really cant see any .. course I do not have several books as of this post .. so I very well could be wrong .
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

Lenwen wrote:Every Xitixic bug on the planet ( so far that is in print ) has been a direct descendent of the Duluth hive . One massive swarm was rifted to the earth at some time durring the dark ages . And they had not yet become a "global" power as of the opening scenes ( 102P.A.) in North America . But they can reproduce on a goemetric rate if givin the right "circumstances" and they can grow to adults when pushed or at war within 1/10th the normal time .

That is what part of makes them a seriously underestimated powerblock ..

Being able to replenish millions in a matter of months .. as well as building everything they need with out the need of anything other then resin .

The Xit is a nasty bug an 1 I dont think many on rifts earth could really push into extinction outside of Atlantis I really cant see any .. course I do not have several books as of this post .. so I very well could be wrong .


I pretty much agree with you here.
The CS is in over their heads, unless they can come up with some kind of super-weapon against the bugs.

Also, I tend to think that there is (or should be) some xiticix stuff we haven't seen yet; different weapons, and other uses for the resin.
I'd bet that they can build ships with the stuff, they just haven't needed to yet.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Kagashi »

Killer Cyborg wrote:
Kagashi wrote:I think that using the 3 other worlds that Splynn owns still counts as "Atlantis" for the purposes of this discussion because Splynn has access to them (Despite the fact we dont have any numbers on these planets).


I disagree, because then the question is pointless; of course three planets worth of resources can take out one some killer insects taking up part of one continent on a lone planet.


So, Atlantis wins then. :P

Seriously, without the numbers, it would be hard to say one way or the other though. These could be small planets the size of Mercury...or sparsely populated (no need to put lots of troops in a planet entirely conquered or has no threats to face). We have no idea at this point. Personally, I just use the Atlantis stats and multiply by 4 to determine Splynn's forces at his disposal (completely non-canon, just my personal fix). And if Splynn were faced with being responsible for eradication the bugs on Rifts Earth, Im sure he would tap into these sources.

One more point to consider is, the last update we have had on Atlantis was in 99 PA (WB2). Although we have seen some specific additions in Splynn Dimensional Market like new minions, slave stock, and Kittani gear, we have not seen updated numbers in any of the recent books concerning the population of Atlantis. Neither Aftermath nor RUE gave any new numbers. Its completely likely the population has increased, just as the bugs have over the past 10 years. And with Atlantis being the center of dimensional trading, there is no reason why that couldn't have increased (although it suggests it could have decreased as well).

Killer Cyborg wrote:
Kagashi wrote: Even if it were just Atlantis, 450 million bugs vs 70 million Splugorth minions (assuming all of Atlantis leaves their island on this crusade) would still be in the favor of the Splugorth since Kittani Serpent Power Armor is vastly superior to a Xiticix resin short sword... It comes down to equipment and technology (magic included). Atlantis has it all. the 1:6.4 odds tilt in favor of Atlantis when you consider technology.


450 million bugs was the estimate for 4-5 years ago in the Rifts Timeline.
"Currently" the bugs have at least 1.2 billion.


Right right. I missed that. Point taken.

That leaves the odds at 1:17.1. If you consider the "3 other planets" in the manner as I have above, that brings the odds to 1:4.2 which means every one minion has to be able to take out 4.2 bugs each before dying themselves to create a draw. I think with their magic and technology (and appropriate tactics), Atlantis can still do that.

To further help the Atlantien numbers game, Splynn employs traditional magic users as well (in the form of high lords, dragons, and other similar RCCs). Many of them may be Warlocks, Shifters, Summoners, and Necromancers who can summon/create their own personal armies of demons, elementals, and undead to be used as cannon fodder.

However, without the 3 other planets, it might get hairy for the minions. Even if armed with their most impressive energy rifle, the K-4, that one lone minion foot soldier only has 3000 feet to pop off shots before getting swarmed by 17.1 bugs. Xiticix Warriors have a flying speed of 82 MPH, which means they could cover 3000 feet in 1.6 melee rounds.

Lets say that minion has 6 attack per melee (random "average" i pulled out from a pocket dimension), and every strike hits (with an average damage of 41 with the 3 round burst option), he could only drop 3 warriors and injuring 1 (lets assume 70 MDC) before being overrun by 14 angry, well versed in H2H, Warriors. This could indeed be a problem for the average foot soldier.

Killer Cyborg wrote:The Kittani weapons are impressive, including the Serpent Power Armor, but not enough to make victory certain.
For one thing, there are presumably limited numbers of such armor. It's not for general sale, so they'd only have enough on Atlantis for the Kittani to use, and there are only 10 million Kittani on Atlantis.
If it gets down to melee combat, the Serpent Armor will have an advantage over a xiticix warrior, but until it gets down to melee the power armor is at a disadvantage; the plasma axe's blasts only have a range of 200', vs. the 4,000' range of a TK rifle.
It has 4 mini-missiles, but those would get used up pretty quickly.
It has auto-dodge at +3, but would still be at -6 to dodge the TK rifle blasts, for a total of -3 without applying other bonuses.
Of course, they can carry a rifle instead of the axe, but then they're giving up the advantage in melee.

And the bugs are pretty darned GOOD at melee.
An average warrior has a supernatural PS of 31, so his punch does 3d6 MD, plus another 2d6 if they have a Xiticix Long Sword, for a total of 5d6 MD, almost as good as the Plasma axe's 1d4x10.
And because of their four arms, they can attack with two weapons at once without losing their parry, so the damage would commonly up to 10d6 MD- better than the Plasma Axe.
And they can make simo-attacks without giving up their own option to parry (though they do lose normal parry bonuses).

Also, the Xiticix like to gang-pile their enemies and grapple them. A suit of Serpent power armor can lift 1150 lbs, but Xiticix Warriors weigh 500 lbs each; three warrors tackling the same Serpent are going to drag him to the ground and slowly pick him apart.
A Xiticix Super Warrior weighs 700-1000 lbs, so even just one warrior and one Super Warrior could drag down Serpent Power armor.


One thing I noticed this time through though, was that only 30% of Xiticix Warriors carry TK Rifles, so that makes them less deadly in ranged combat than I previously thought.


Well, my point wasn't the Serpent PA specifically, rather all the equipment Atlantis has at her disposal (to include magic as well).

But absolutely, Atlantian war planners would be idiots to plan to conduct warfare against the bugs using H2H tactics. They should rely on their superior ranged weapons first (similar to how others had suggested long ranged bombing/missiles). Using the example of the Serpent PA, I agree that they should take away the plasma axe, and issue an energy rifle instead.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

Kagashi wrote:But absolutely, Atlantian war planners would be idiots to plan to conduct warfare against the bugs using H2H tactics. They should rely on their superior ranged weapons first (similar to how others had suggested long ranged bombing/missiles). Using the example of the Serpent PA, I agree that they should take away the plasma axe, and issue an energy rifle instead.


That's all I'm saying, really; Atlantis can (and almost definitely would win) if they take their time and use strategy.
But it would take time, and it would take strategy, and they'd still suffer some losses.

Magic might really be their best way to go; summon elementals and other disposable minions and just send them at the bugs from a distance.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Library Ogre »

I think Splynncrth would only use his other planets if his holdings on Earth came to jeopardy.

If I had Splynncrth's resources, and was thinking about going after the bugs, the first thing I'd do is capture a few. I'd use them for bio-wizardry research into their weaknesses, seeking a parasite, microbe, or similar method of destroying (or controlling) them. If that works, great. If not (for some reason, we were unable to find any chemical or magical method of efficiently killing them), I go to the harder option. I'd want a large weapons platform with a 10,000-20,000 foot ceiling... higher would not be objectionable. I'd want some heavy Particle Beam cannons, pointed downward; the kind you mount on starships for planetary bombardment. I'd want a fair number of kinetic weapons, and some good point lasers. And I'd want a big platform for summoning.

The physical aspects of the platform would be run by Kittani engineers, with Kydian Powerlord Marines for station defense. One or two High Lords would be there for oversight and, more importantly, summoning magics. PBC barrages would be interspersed with missile and railgun attacks while the PBC cool off.

Once the surface is reduced, start using Kittani Basic Security robots. Using even standard load-outs, these are pretty effective Xiticix fighters... while on the low end in terms of damage and MDC, their ability to broadcast a constant ultrasonic sound, mixed with a tear gas loadout, will confuse most basic Xiticix communication. They go in and map the place, frequently getting killed in the process, but likewise causing massive damage. Supplement them with a rune statue or two... indestructible butt-kickers who can keep going for 2 hours a day. The High Lords summon elementals and unintelligent minions to do even more. A fire elemental to take out their food supplies. A water elemental to flood the place. An earth elemental to attack from below, possibly destabilizing the structure. An air elemental to keep the Xits DOWN (aided by point lasers).

A day or two of constant fighting should enable them to get the egg beds and the queen... and that's if they don't want to use some of their more powerful slaves against the Xits.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Kagashi »

Yeah those numbers assume every living being on Atlantis leaves the Island and attack the bugs, which would never happen. If Splynn did that, he would be in control of a destroyed hive land and Atlantis would be overrun by some other force (Naruni? Lord Klynn? Another Splugorth?). Hence why he would pull resources from the other planets should he go on the offensive.

One thing is for sure...something needs to be done NOW because as we have fleshed out...the bugs may be manageable as of 109 PA, but in 111 PA...we may see the natural enemies of Atlantis, Lazlo and the CS having to become allies (ala WWII Russia and US) to defeat the common enemy (Germany).
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Nightbreed »

Kagashi wrote:Yeah those numbers assume every living being on Atlantis leaves the Island and attack the bugs, which would never happen. If Splynn did that, he would be in control of a destroyed hive land and Atlantis would be overrun by some other force (Naruni? Lord Klynn? Another Splugorth?). Hence why he would pull resources from the other planets should he go on the offensive.

One thing is for sure...something needs to be done NOW because as we have fleshed out...the bugs may be manageable as of 109 PA, but in 111 PA...we may see the natural enemies of Atlantis, Lazlo and the CS having to become allies (ala WWII Russia and US) to defeat the common enemy (Germany).


This would be the best and most logical solution, but i don't see how the CS would go along with this as they would never ally with any magic wielding or nation that has d-bees. The CS would just as well blast them with the bugs.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Shadyslug »

Splynn can do it and do it easily.

It's been said many times in the books that Splynncryth could conquer the Earth if he wanted to. However holding the earth would be a pain, and a resource pig.

He could also take out the Bugs...but he's cheap and doesn't want to. It would take a lot of resources and it would ALERT THE REST OF THE EARTH as to how POWERFUL he really is...

He doesn't want that...it's not in his best interests. So he'll sit back and wait to see if the CS and others will do it for him.

If necessary, he'll do it. But he won't do it directly if he can help it...
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by The Beast »

What book are these three planets of Splynncryth's are detailed in?
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by rat_bastard »

Killer Cyborg wrote:
rat_bastard wrote:KC, your doing it wrong...

Your math simply assumes Atlantis would do it with simply their earth forces, when you add the other planets Splynth has (I'm away from my books but the amount is staggering) the Bugs are outnumbered.


The question was whether Atlantis could take the Xiticix, not whether all of Splyncryth's personal forces pulled in from other worlds could.

But even if it WAS asking about the entirety of Splyncryth's resources, it would still take more than a week to get them all to Rifts Earth.
I guess thats fair.
That said here's how I would do it if I was so inclined:

First off, I'd have a bunch of mages capable of controlling the weather surround the hivelands with windstorms blowing towards the hives and cap the hivelands with thick clouds. Then I'd have the Kittani pummel the hivelnads with "Rods from God".


Using which spaceships?
I'll start with the Kittani ones, but really the splugorith are multi dimensional beings with more money than most gods, so the question is what ships don't they have.
Suddenly the Xitixix population goes from millions to dozens of queens that somehow survived. a good amount of the dust and ash that would be kicked up by the impacts would either collect water molecules in the clouds and become rain or be blown back over the blast zone by the weather so the environmental damage would be minimal. The Dimensional damage done by the mass death of a supernatural species is another thing entirely.


Yeah... I tend to think that the side-effects of such an attack would spoil the overall goal of protecting Splyncryth's investment in Rifts Earth.


yes, but inaction also kills their investment.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Shadyslug »

The Beast wrote:What book are these three planets of Splynncryth's are detailed in?

They're not detailed anywhere. I think they're actually only mentioned once or twice in Atlantis.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Shadyslug »

Voran wrote:I think the Spolgs would use biowizardry approaches, and if necessary some related bioweapon. I think biowiz would be first, plus proper dissecetion and analysis of what makes the bugs tick, then they'd warp in a couple Black Flag/Raid bug bombs and poof.

Now there's a thought...

Just like Lone Star created the Bug Hunters, Atlantis might come up with a Biowizardry version that's just plain crazy...then unleash them into North America where they wreck havoc, not only on the Bugs, but the CS and every other stronghold.

Maybe even ARCHIE does something along these lines, only mechanical...
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by The Beast »

Shadyslug wrote:
The Beast wrote:What book are these three planets of Splynncryth's are detailed in?

They're not detailed anywhere. I think they're actually only mentioned once or twice in Atlantis.


So as far as we know the planets could be the size of Pluto (which was considered a planet when the book was written), and Atlantis could be Splynncryth's big break....

Personally I say we stick to what we know, and wait for an author to create The Splynncryth Empire or something like that before we say "Well he can just pull a zillion troops from these planets right here..."

EDIT: Pluto is the size of the continental US, IIRC.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Kagashi »

The Beast wrote:
Shadyslug wrote:
The Beast wrote:What book are these three planets of Splynncryth's are detailed in?

They're not detailed anywhere. I think they're actually only mentioned once or twice in Atlantis.


So as far as we know the planets could be the size of Pluto (which was considered a planet when the book was written), and Atlantis could be Splynncryth's big break....

Personally I say we stick to what we know, and wait for an author to create The Splynncryth Empire or something like that before we say "Well he can just pull a zillion troops from these planets right here..."


If that were the case, we shouldn't be using hypothetical numbers for the Xiticix. If you are not going to explore options on one side, you cant do it for the other.

The planets are mentioned pages 18 and 39 if you want to see the reference to them.

When Atlantis was written, "The Splugorth" was the only named Splugorth and pretty much considered one and the same as Splynn himself (For example, it was Splynn who actually found the Kittani and saved them from the Mechanoids. After his intervention the Kittani became minions for ALL Splugorth. The same for the Sunaji.). Not till Phase World did we see other named Splugorth (Lord Klynn) come to light. There is a good chance that the planets described in Atlantis are actually under the control of Splynn specifically (like the home world of the Zembahk and Hawrk-family or the home world), although it does only say "Splugorth", so I'm prolly just be blowing smoke up your donkey. Other than that, there is no description of these planets, but it would be a same not to consider them in a hypothetical discussion.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by csbioborg »

Kagashi wrote:
The Beast wrote:
Shadyslug wrote:
The Beast wrote:What book are these three planets of Splynncryth's are detailed in?

They're not detailed anywhere. I think they're actually only mentioned once or twice in Atlantis.


So as far as we know the planets could be the size of Pluto (which was considered a planet when the book was written), and Atlantis could be Splynncryth's big break....

Personally I say we stick to what we know, and wait for an author to create The Splynncryth Empire or something like that before we say "Well he can just pull a zillion troops from these planets right here..."


If that were the case, we shouldn't be using hypothetical numbers for the Xiticix. If you are not going to explore options on one side, you cant do it for the other.


actually I think Billy Bob Blyncryth the Slugorth Tourist was introduced before him :P
The planets are mentioned pages 18 and 39 if you want to see the reference to them.

When Atlantis was written, "The Splugorth" was the only named Splugorth and pretty much considered one and the same as Splynn himself (For example, it was Splynn who actually found the Kittani and saved them from the Mechanoids. After his intervention the Kittani became minions for ALL Splugorth. The same for the Sunaji.). Not till Phase World did we see other named Splugorth (Lord Klynn) come to light. There is a good chance that the planets described in Atlantis are actually under the control of Splynn specifically (like the home world of the Zembahk and Hawrk-family or the home world), although it does only say "Splugorth", so I'm prolly just be blowing smoke up your donkey. Other than that, there is no description of these planets, but it would be a same not to consider them in a hypothetical discussion.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by The Beast »

Kagashi wrote:If that were the case, we shouldn't be using hypothetical numbers for the Xiticix. If you are not going to explore options on one side, you cant do it for the other.


I must disagree here. We have some numbers for the hives that one can make an educated guesstimate for the total numbers of Xiticix on Rifts Earth. We have nothing detailing anything for Splynncryth other than he has 3 planets under his control, and he has troops on those planets, and his army is large enough to handle any other power currently on Rifts Earth within a month.

My opinion is that he doesn't do that because he doesn't feel like dealing with the rivals & enemies that would start laying into him should he begin attempting to take over Rifts Earth.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Shadyslug »

It is mentioned that Splynncryth is a youngish Splugorth...which I would also take to mean that he's probably a less powerful one, with Atlantis being a big break...

Then again...to have built what he has in Atlantis would've required some serious power and resources.

I would argue that Splynncryth is probably one of the more powerful Splugorth...if he wasn't, he'd probably have had to give up Atlantis, or have been taken out by another more powerful Splugorth.

So...one thing that one should probably assume is that Splynncryth's forces in Atlantis probably represents no more than 25% of his overall power...with 75% being split up between the other three planets. Sure the figures would fluctuate, but that would probably be a safe assumption of the general split...
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Lenwen »

Shadyslug wrote:It is mentioned that Splynncryth is a youngish Splugorth...which I would also take to mean that he's probably a less powerful one, with Atlantis being a big break...

Then again...to have built what he has in Atlantis would've required some serious power and resources.

I would argue that Splynncryth is probably one of the more powerful Splugorth...if he wasn't, he'd probably have had to give up Atlantis, or have been taken out by another more powerful Splugorth.

So...one thing that one should probably assume is that Splynncryth's forces in Atlantis probably represents no more than 25% of his overall power...with 75% being split up between the other three planets. Sure the figures would fluctuate, but that would probably be a safe assumption of the general split...

But it wouldent fit in his description .. Just off the Kittani he has several billion minions .. considering he has saved the entire race .. not just a little bit an that was 32,000 years ago ..

Then there are the Kydians .. Every Splugg's out in the megaverse has litterally Billions of them ... as per thier write up ..
I'm going to hazard a guess an say that Lord Splynncryths Atlantean forces are perhaps at MOST not more then 10% of his TOTAL population ..

While at the LEAST I'd go as far down as 2% of his overall population .. minion population wise ..

I'm going to say even Lord Splynn has no less then several Billion Minions .. at the very LEAST ... Think about it .. Look at Earth right now .. over 6 Billion people on our planet alone .. and Lord Splynn controls an owns SEVERAL .. all of which are a militaristic sociaty .. based on the concept of Conquest and War .. That is the life of a Splugorthian sociaty
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by rat_bastard »

So here is an idea, we make a bunch of light MDC high altitude dirigibles, mount the longest range lasers we can buy on them and fly them over Xitixix territory with orders to shoot every bug they can.

if you can get something with a 8000ft-2 mile range and something in the area of 6d6-1d6x10 damage you can probably kill something like four bugs a minute per turret, as long as your range is a coupla thousand feet past the Xitixix ability to perceive things you could kill tons of the bastards.
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Lenwen »

rat_bastard wrote:So here is an idea, we make a bunch of light MDC high altitude dirigibles, mount the longest range lasers we can buy on them and fly them over Xitixix territory with orders to shoot every bug they can.

if you can get something with a 8000ft-2 mile range and something in the area of 6d6-1d6x10 damage you can probably kill something like four bugs a minute per turret, as long as your range is a coupla thousand feet past the Xitixix ability to perceive things you could kill tons of the bastards.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

OMFG I AM TEARING UP HAHAHAHA
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Re: Splogroth Vs. Xiticix

Unread post by Shadyslug »

Lenwen wrote:I'm going to say even Lord Splynn has no less then several Billion Minions .. at the very LEAST ... Think about it .. Look at Earth right now .. over 6 Billion people on our planet alone .. and Lord Splynn controls an owns SEVERAL .. all of which are a militaristic sociaty .. based on the concept of Conquest and War .. That is the life of a Splugorthian sociaty


I think your a bit high on your figures...

Not that I'm going to argue that Splynny can't knock off the Bugs...I'm sure he can and that he can do it with ease...

I just know that he doesn't want to...it would be bad for business.

If the bugs somehow destroyed the CS and FoM and Lazlo...Splynny would wipe the earth clean of the bugs...

And let's face it...Splynny WILL do something...it's just a matter of what will he do and how much will be commit to doing it. I'm sure he'll find a way to supply the group that does take down the bugs...it would be in his best interests and also be highly profitable.

First and foremost, Splynncryth is a business man...err...thing...
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