Supes has the strength, though Surfer is no slouch and is as strong as the Hulk at least. Surfer has the Power Cosmic, which took out the Green Lantern in one shot, but Supes can fly through a star. Supes can't hang in space with Surfer without a breathing device, so we'll drop them on Marvel's Blue zone. Both are considered basically indestructible. Both have taken on gods and are capable of personally destroying worlds. Both are geniuses, though Supes leans toward mechanical and science while surfer's intellect is more bent toward the philosophical. In a no-holds barred contest who would win and why?
To be fair: Surfer wins.
The Power Cosmic gives the Surfer the power to transmute elements. Although he finds this exhausting, he could use this ability to turn Superman's costume into green Kryptonite.
Surfer also has the ability to absorb massive amounts of energy: he could use this ability to cut Superman off from the solar radiation he needs to sustain his powers (this would also refresh the Surf).
And, while the Surf may spend a lot of time waxing poetic and philosophical, let's not forget, he does know his way around the advanced technology of Galactus, and before becoming the Big G's Herald, he was a student of science like his father before him.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
Here's a more important question - how would you get these two to fight each other when they would probably rather team up and kick the ass of every cosmic villain in existence?
Comment: Remember also that the smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights, cannot claim to be defenders of minorities Ayn Rand
As preachy and iratating as silver surfer is he would win
it would take awhile but he would win
Svartalf- if Cherico were a character created in a point game system, he'd have all his scores in geeky skills and his youtube and weird net stuff schticks all paid through a a Terminal Bad Luck (with more nasty GM intervention) disadvantage, and probably an Uncouth (can not have social skills) disad as well... In an RPG with deadly situations that character would have had to be replaced a dozen times over[
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300 Movie Geek Points
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Comment: Listen very carefully, human...the fact that I even allow you to speak directly to me is a gift I bestow upon you. You do not order me. You beg for my appreciation and then wait to see if I choose to bestow it upon you.
Location: At the forefront of the War between Evil & Good.
Jefffar wrote:Here's a more important question - how would you get these two to fight each other when they would probably rather team up and kick the ass of every cosmic villain in existence?
You set it during a period of time when Surfer was still Galactus' Herald.
Or you set it during the FF/Superman crossover (nice big graphic novel) where Superman is actually Galactus' Herald.
If you want them both to fight it out while they're both good, you bring in a manipulative third party like Darkseid or Metron to put it together.
Or you steal a page from JLAvengers and simply have a REALLY POWERFUL guy put them both in a room and say "ok fight to the death or I blow up both your universes." Even if they don't go all out they'll fight to stall while they try to think of a way around it.
Prolly a half dozen other ways to do it, but it's late and so I'll let someone else step in.
Supes has the strength, though Surfer is no slouch and is as strong as the Hulk at least. Surfer has the Power Cosmic, which took out the Green Lantern in one shot, but Supes can fly through a star. Supes can't hang in space with Surfer without a breathing device, so we'll drop them on Marvel's Blue zone. Both are considered basically indestructible. Both have taken on gods and are capable of personally destroying worlds. Both are geniuses, though Supes leans toward mechanical and science while surfer's intellect is more bent toward the philosophical. In a no-holds barred contest who would win and why?
Gah!!! Silver Surfer, but you had to bring up that GL beat down. First of all it was implied that the battle had been going on for a while when you see GL and SS clashing. And, even then it was a close one. I still think GL should have one that one.
My dragon juicer died because of magical sock puppets. - ash_wednesday
hell id go on spectors pods- Cherico
keep Specter's ass out of my general area when he fells naked- Rayven
Hmm.....in the end I have to go with the Surfer. Not saying it's be a cakewalk, but I think Surfer has several advantages over Supes.
By the way; Just before the big DC/MArvel Amalgam crossover series there was an independent GL and SS crossover comic. I still remember Silver Surfer taking on Cyborg, getting hit by one of his blasts and thinking "Sufficient might to stagger me. An opponent to be reckoned with then..."
"In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own" - Thomas Jefferson
"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same god who has endowed us with senses, reason and intellect has intended us to forgo their use." - Galileo
Even with al the sentinal brought up(which are very good points) their is still a way for Superman to win, and that's his speed. Simply put this is a guy who can challenge the Flash(notice I didn't say beat but challenge).
He used to be fast enough to time travel.
And even now he coul duse his speed and strength to get enough blow to perhaps end things before the Silver Surfer could react.
Damn ICE/BCP/BorderPatrol! Damn everyone who won’t damn ICE/BCP/Border Patrol!! Damn everyone that won’t put lights in his windows and sit up all night damning CE/BCP/BorderPatrol!!! If you support ICE/BCP/BorderPatrol at this point, you would have called the Gestapo on the people surreptitiously moving into your neighbor's attic and huffed that you were only following the law.
And I've since learned that the SS vs. GL match was decided by the companies and I disagree with it.
Damn ICE/BCP/BorderPatrol! Damn everyone who won’t damn ICE/BCP/Border Patrol!! Damn everyone that won’t put lights in his windows and sit up all night damning CE/BCP/BorderPatrol!!! If you support ICE/BCP/BorderPatrol at this point, you would have called the Gestapo on the people surreptitiously moving into your neighbor's attic and huffed that you were only following the law.
Sir_Spirit wrote:Even with al the sentinal brought up(which are very good points) their is still a way for Superman to win, and that's his speed. Simply put this is a guy who can challenge the Flash(notice I didn't say beat but challenge). He used to be fast enough to time travel. And even now he coul duse his speed and strength to get enough blow to perhaps end things before the Silver Surfer could react.
The Surfer is used to routinely traveling at light and supra-light speeds. It's the only way he could hope to get around the cosmos without it taking millions of years.
The Power Cosmic also allows him to keep track of possible hazards also traveling at light speeds, in order to evade them.
And yes, while Superman could fly into a sun to boost his powers, Silver Surfer can still leach off those energies. He too can fly into the surface of a star unscathed.
Galactus builds 'em tough.
As far as GL vs. SS goes: if all else is equal in terms of their energy powers, Surfer has GL beat on all enhanced physical abilities.Kyle has to divert ring power to increase his strength beyond human levels, and he has to concentrate: Surfer does not.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
As annoying as Supes can be, he beat the Surfer. Jason's rule of coolness applies... riding a surfboard as your main "catch" is so far up the lameness meter that he just explodes at the initiation of a battle with just about anybody out there.
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Comment: The very existence of flamethrowers proves that some time, somewhere, someone said to themselves, "You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I'm just not close enough to get the job done." - George Carlin
"Can you kill me?! With those feeble arms?!" - Ogami Itto
"Bodycount's in the house!" - Ice T
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Nekira Sudacne wrote:Sorry, the Anime genre and the Furry genre don't usually mix, except where Catgirls are concerned
Comment: The very existence of flamethrowers proves that some time, somewhere, someone said to themselves, "You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I'm just not close enough to get the job done." - George Carlin
Jason Richards wrote:As annoying as Supes can be, he beat the Surfer. Jason's rule of coolness applies... riding a surfboard as your main "catch" is so far up the lameness meter that he just explodes at the initiation of a battle with just about anybody out there.
This might be true, but let's not forget that Supes is someone that has yet to be told that the underwear goes inside the pants.
"Can you kill me?! With those feeble arms?!" - Ogami Itto
"Bodycount's in the house!" - Ice T
"The Great Destroyer is back again!" - Duo Maxwell
"It's mine you hear? Mine ALL MINE Get back in there. Down Down Down! Go Go Go! MINE MINE MINE!!!" --Daffy Duck
Nekira Sudacne wrote:Sorry, the Anime genre and the Furry genre don't usually mix, except where Catgirls are concerned
Jason Richards wrote:As annoying as Supes can be, he beat the Surfer. Jason's rule of coolness applies... riding a surfboard as your main "catch" is so far up the lameness meter that he just explodes at the initiation of a battle with just about anybody out there.
Having lived in Hawaii for several years as a kid, I always thought surfing was rather cool.
I can't do it myself, but it is very cool...
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
Jason Richards wrote:As annoying as Supes can be, he beat the Surfer. Jason's rule of coolness applies... riding a surfboard as your main "catch" is so far up the lameness meter that he just explodes at the initiation of a battle with just about anybody out there.
This might be true, but let's not forget that Supes is someone that has yet to be told that the underwear goes inside the pants.
Superman's corporate endorsement from Underoos specifically states that his underwear must be visible at all times.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
Jason Richards wrote:As annoying as Supes can be, he beat the Surfer. Jason's rule of coolness applies... riding a surfboard as your main "catch" is so far up the lameness meter that he just explodes at the initiation of a battle with just about anybody out there.
This might be true, but let's not forget that Supes is someone that has yet to be told that the underwear goes inside the pants.
Superman's corporate endorsement from Underoos specifically states that his underwear must be visible at all times.
"Why is it that when Clark Kent wears his underwear outside of his pants he's a superhero but when grandpa does it, he's senile?" - Some comedian
GP: 16,019.8 / JP: 30 / MZP: 75 "Overlord Rikonius is the Roland Deschain of Bad Puns, he fires them off that fast" - CornholioPrime "Rik is a deep and abundant reservoir of cool..." - Yisterwald Party hydrants strive when they have a sorority backed by beige regurgitations.
Jason Richards wrote:As annoying as Supes can be, he beat the Surfer. Jason's rule of coolness applies... riding a surfboard as your main "catch" is so far up the lameness meter that he just explodes at the initiation of a battle with just about anybody out there.
This might be true, but let's not forget that Supes is someone that has yet to be told that the underwear goes inside the pants.
Superman's corporate endorsement from Underoos specifically states that his underwear must be visible at all times.
"Why is it that when Clark Kent wears his underwear outside of his pants he's a superhero but when grandpa does it, he's senile?" - Some comedian
Bullets don't bounce off of Grandpa, son.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
The rule of coolness ALWAYS applies, people! This is how Batman would decidedly defeat Superman in anything from an all-out battle to thumb wrestling. It's why Plastic Man would be destroyed by any other hero in the DC universe, Silver Surfer included.
He has a SURFBOARD!!! It's like a bad prop for an 80's action figure.
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Comment: Listen very carefully, human...the fact that I even allow you to speak directly to me is a gift I bestow upon you. You do not order me. You beg for my appreciation and then wait to see if I choose to bestow it upon you.
Location: At the forefront of the War between Evil & Good.
Comment: Listen very carefully, human...the fact that I even allow you to speak directly to me is a gift I bestow upon you. You do not order me. You beg for my appreciation and then wait to see if I choose to bestow it upon you.
Location: At the forefront of the War between Evil & Good.
Marrowlight wrote:So if the surfboard bugs you so much would you have been happier if he was just the silver soarer? Could've given him this nice hang glider.
And yeah, I'm aware of what a simile is...but thanks for telling me just in case, y'know, I wasn't.
the silver soarer..... it's toytastic!
look up in the sky, it's a bird, it's a plane, it's Airman, *****, and i'm bringin' the pain! i got a fan installed in my grill, no lie, i'm gonna blow your *** straight off the map, goodbye!
Jason Richards wrote:As annoying as Supes can be, he beat the Surfer. Jason's rule of coolness applies... riding a surfboard as your main "catch" is so far up the lameness meter that he just explodes at the initiation of a battle with just about anybody out there.
Jason Richards wrote:As annoying as Supes can be, he beat the Surfer. Jason's rule of coolness applies... riding a surfboard as your main "catch" is so far up the lameness meter that he just explodes at the initiation of a battle with just about anybody out there.
Plastic Man Vs Silver surfer. now there's the real Contest..
(note, Plastic Man Is surrounded by a supernatural Aura of dumb luck, which SEVERELY throws this in his favor)
Gomen_Nagai wrote:Plastic Man Vs Silver surfer. now there's the real Contest.. (note, Plastic Man Is surrounded by a supernatural Aura of dumb luck, which SEVERELY throws this in his favor)
A better confrontation would be Plastic man VS. Ambush Bug.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
Silver Surfer is in a different league. it is like saying Batman vs Superman. Superman wins all the day long. Power should play a part somewhere in these things.
Hyperion wrote:Surfer would bore Supes to death with his constant and bewildering inward thinking. That is if Supes' chooses to use his Supervision to read the massive bubbles that fill all of Surfers panels.
This isn't a Kieth Giffen JLA, nor a John Byrne She-Hulk, dude.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
Silver Surfer is in a different league. it is like saying Batman vs Superman. Superman wins all the day long. Power should play a part somewhere in these things.
You know, when they face off, Bats tends to win...
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Jason Richards wrote:The rule of coolness ALWAYS applies, people! This is how Batman would decidedly defeat Superman in anything from an all-out battle to thumb wrestling. It's why Plastic Man would be destroyed by any other hero in the DC universe, Silver Surfer included.
He has a SURFBOARD!!! It's like a bad prop for an 80's action figure.
Plastic Man not cool??
I am shocked!
(This is my shocked face )
You are aware that not only can Plastic Man assume pretty much any form he likes he is also effectively immortal (JLA: Obsidian Age)
If only he could do something about his pigmentation... sigh
Oh yeah.. Surfer for the win
Again, it's the Jason cool scale. He stretches. It's stupid. He dies.
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Silver Surfer is in a different league. it is like saying Batman vs Superman. Superman wins all the day long. Power should play a part somewhere in these things.
You know, when they face off, Bats tends to win...
And you find that cool? Batman wins because Superman doesn't go all out, or because he has access to Kryptonite, because otherwise, Batman is a little pile of bloody goo before he has a chance to blink. There is a reason that Superman fights god-like beings and Bats fights Riddler...
By the way, in case you haven't noticed, your 'cool-o-meter' is not considered universal, and thankfully your opinion does not equate into reality.
Gosh, you people take yourselves seriously here on the HU board. Save it for Sound Off!
And Bats being prepared and playing on Sup's weaknesses, frailties, and sensibilities is why it's cool.
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Silver Surfer is in a different league. it is like saying Batman vs Superman. Superman wins all the day long. Power should play a part somewhere in these things.
You know, when they face off, Bats tends to win...
When a Kryptonian goes full out, like the Phantom Zone villains, Batman is toast.
I'd like to see him go one-on-one with General Zod. Or, how about Ultraman from the Crime Syndicate.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
Silver Surfer is in a different league. it is like saying Batman vs Superman. Superman wins all the day long. Power should play a part somewhere in these things.
The Surfer isn't in a League: He's a Defender.
Superman is in a League, dude...
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
Silver Surfer is in a different league. it is like saying Batman vs Superman. Superman wins all the day long. Power should play a part somewhere in these things.
You know, when they face off, Bats tends to win...
When a Kryptonian goes full out, like the Phantom Zone villains, Batman is toast.
I'd like to see him go one-on-one with General Zod. Or, how about Ultraman from the Crime Syndicate.
Fortunately, we're talking about Superman.
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I was thinking a bit more on this, and realized in a comic book fight Superman would have to win. Why? DC would likely not allow Superman in a crossover comic without either him winning or being strong enough to be a stalemate.
It is kind of the coolness factor that Jason has mentioned. Supes just would be written to win; he's an iconic figure and Silver Surfer is much less so.
But without regards to popularity and just due to sheer power, it's somewhat of a tough call. Both would likely hold back due to their personalities and most likely it would be a standstill. If for some reason they both let loose, then Surfer would win. Superman has various advantages over other super-powered folks, but Surfer isn't the typical super-powered guy. I wish I still had my marvel handbooks, but I remember the whole 'Power Cosmic' stuff wasn't small potatos. I thought he could do just about whatever he wanted with it, within certain power limits. And turning Superman into a just-born whale falling to earth is within the scope of his power, if I remember correctly.
"Do you even know what the word theory means? You must think it means '**** that you make up'."
---Penn Jillette
MrTwist wrote:I was thinking a bit more on this, and realized in a comic book fight Superman would have to win. Why? DC would likely not allow Superman in a crossover comic without either him winning or being strong enough to be a stalemate.
It is kind of the coolness factor that Jason has mentioned. Supes just would be written to win; he's an iconic figure and Silver Surfer is much less so.
But without regards to popularity and just due to sheer power, it's somewhat of a tough call. Both would likely hold back due to their personalities and most likely it would be a standstill. If for some reason they both let loose, then Surfer would win. Superman has various advantages over other super-powered folks, but Surfer isn't the typical super-powered guy. I wish I still had my marvel handbooks, but I remember the whole 'Power Cosmic' stuff wasn't small potatos. I thought he could do just about whatever he wanted with it, within certain power limits. And turning Superman into a just-born whale falling to earth is within the scope of his power, if I remember correctly.
That's just a little outside of Surf's ability (but, maybe Molecule Man...).
Still, doing the whole energy absoption trick would allow Surfer to weaken Superman to the point that it would be unnecessary to kill him, thus satisfying Surfers' moral compunctions.
For Superman, the only way to defeat the Surfer would be to kill him, so Superman is hamstrung from the get-go.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
MrTwist wrote:I was thinking a bit more on this, and realized in a comic book fight Superman would have to win. Why? DC would likely not allow Superman in a crossover comic without either him winning or being strong enough to be a stalemate.
It is kind of the coolness factor that Jason has mentioned. Supes just would be written to win; he's an iconic figure and Silver Surfer is much less so.
But without regards to popularity and just due to sheer power, it's somewhat of a tough call. Both would likely hold back due to their personalities and most likely it would be a standstill. If for some reason they both let loose, then Surfer would win. Superman has various advantages over other super-powered folks, but Surfer isn't the typical super-powered guy. I wish I still had my marvel handbooks, but I remember the whole 'Power Cosmic' stuff wasn't small potatos. I thought he could do just about whatever he wanted with it, within certain power limits. And turning Superman into a just-born whale falling to earth is within the scope of his power, if I remember correctly.
That's just a little outside of Surf's ability (but, maybe Molecule Man...). Still, doing the whole energy absoption trick would allow Surfer to weaken Superman to the point that it would be unnecessary to kill him, thus satisfying Surfers' moral compunctions. For Superman, the only way to defeat the Surfer would be to kill him, so Superman is hamstrung from the get-go.
It is? I thought the Power Cosmic allowed for molecular alteration(oh, and Molecule Man is one of my Marvel favs. Just got all the issues of New Avengers. Hope they give the guy who can destroy galaxies with a thought some thought in his capture). So what were the limitations on the 'Power Cosmic'?
"Do you even know what the word theory means? You must think it means '**** that you make up'."
---Penn Jillette
Surfer can alter molecular structures, but he can not transmute elements (he cannot turn pure lead into pure gold, but he can draw elements together to form complex molecular structures, or break down existing molecular structures into something simple. He can also reduce objects to pure energy, which he can then absorb for sustenance), nor can he create living organics. He can heal organic life, but cannot raise the dead (The Grandmaster could do this with his Power Cosmic, so I believe that Surfer simply never received this ability from Galactus).
Sufer (according the Deluxe Official Handbook) can project blasts of energy capable of "leveling a large city". Galactus can do things with Power Cosmic that the Surfer can't (like empower other beings with the same power, or transmute elements), and individuals with the Power Cosmic (Like the Elders) have abilities unique to them as well.
After achieving .99 the speed of light, Surfer enters hyperspace. The Power Cosmic grants him Cosmic Awareness, and enables him to navigate through hyperspace.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
GP: 16,019.8 / JP: 30 / MZP: 75 "Overlord Rikonius is the Roland Deschain of Bad Puns, he fires them off that fast" - CornholioPrime "Rik is a deep and abundant reservoir of cool..." - Yisterwald Party hydrants strive when they have a sorority backed by beige regurgitations.
Preacher wrote:The only reason Silver Surfer could beat Superman is because of the cheesy way that he can turn off energy that powers Superman.
If there were a way to make it a slugfest only then Mr. Shiney goes down hard.
Surfer can also pump up his strength via the Power Cosmic beyond the Class 100 level: no one knows what the upper limit is, although it may depend on how much energy Surf is drawing in at the time.
when you get right down to it, Sentinel's right.~Uncle Servo.
Sentinel. you'll be always loved by the German Princess.~Nelly
That's twice in one day Sentinel has cleaned up my mess.~The Galactus Kid.
That's the best place to start. Otherwise, listen to Sentinel~lather
Listen to the Sentinel...he speaks truth.~ Shadyslug
Sentinel you have the biggest sig I've ever seen~Natasha
Preacher wrote:The only reason Silver Surfer could beat Superman is because of the cheesy way that he can turn off energy that powers Superman.
If there were a way to make it a slugfest only then Mr. Shiney goes down hard.
Surfer can also pump up his strength via the Power Cosmic beyond the Class 100 level: no one knows what the upper limit is, although it may depend on how much energy Surf is drawing in at the time.
Yep it says in the last Marvel Universe I read that he can do that, pump his energy up to over the class 100 range which is well over a hundred tons I believe?
The last Whos Who for DC says if it could be lifted without falling apart then Superman could easily lift the Great Pyramid which is what like 6-10 million tons?
Yeah I like guns. I pledge allegiance to this flag, if that bothers you well that's too bad!!!
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Yeah I like guns. 
