How awesome can you make a non-super in a supers campaign

[slade the sniper]

Kind of a challenge/thought experiment I guess...what is the best mundane NPC can be made in Heroes Unlimited (or other megaversal settings like Chaos Earth or Nightbane or Beyond the Supernatural)?

I am looking for any NPCs or advice on making some NPCs that can threaten or even challenge supernatural/superpowered PCs while remaining clearly non-powered in any way...

I was thinking sort of like normal people that instead of cowering in fear when supervillains attack, decide (for whatever reason) that they don't need some weirdo in tights to save them, they don't want some superpowered egomanial "hero" telling them what to do and they are perfectly capable of dealing with threats to their physical well being just fine by themselves and they are not going to knell before some trumped up thug even if she does shoot death rays from her eyes.

Are these types of NPCs possible without just using GM fiat?

I am thinking that a normal NPC with no PC class type stuff could do so via background information such as:
Old mountain man living in Appalachia that just doesn't give a crap
"Hollywood style PTSD" sufferer with a deathwish
A soccer mom whose children died as a result of a superpowered brawl in downtown and now seeks revenge
a grizzled homicide detective that has seen way too much and thinks that with a bit of extra-judicial killing, he might actually make a difference
a corporate executive who has always been successful can't stand the thought of costumed cretins being better than him at anything

Are they even viable ideas to be built using "normal humans" or would they all be better off as some type of GM created/modified PC class?

-STS

[eliakon]

Kind of a challenge/thought experiment I guess...what is the best mundane NPC can be made in Heroes Unlimited (or other megaversal settings like Chaos Earth or Nightbane or Beyond the Supernatural)?

I am looking for any NPCs or advice on making some NPCs that can threaten or even challenge supernatural/superpowered PCs while remaining clearly non-powered in any way...

I was thinking sort of like normal people that instead of cowering in fear when supervillains attack, decide (for whatever reason) that they don't need some weirdo in tights to save them, they don't want some superpowered egomanial "hero" telling them what to do and they are perfectly capable of dealing with threats to their physical well being just fine by themselves and they are not going to knell before some trumped up thug even if she does shoot death rays from her eyes.

Are these types of NPCs possible without just using GM fiat?

I am thinking that a normal NPC with no PC class type stuff could do so via background information such as:
Old mountain man living in Appalachia that just doesn't give a crap
"Hollywood style PTSD" sufferer with a deathwish
A soccer mom whose children died as a result of a superpowered brawl in downtown and now seeks revenge
a grizzled homicide detective that has seen way too much and thinks that with a bit of extra-judicial killing, he might actually make a difference
a corporate executive who has always been successful can't stand the thought of costumed cretins being better than him at anything

Are they even viable ideas to be built using "normal humans" or would they all be better off as some type of GM created/modified PC class?

-STS

Dead Reign, BTS 1 and 2, and Systems Failure are centered around this premise. Many of the 'classes' there are just mundane people with 'realistic' skills. As for danger, you would be amazed at what can happen. I am reminded of an episode of the Highlander TV show. Some guy was killing immortals in swordfights....of course he was cheating and using nightvision goggles while attacking them in the dark...but the same idea can work anywhere.

[Regularguy]

I've said before that, as written, the Hunter/Vigilante can swiftly work his way up to an 88% chance of successfully trapping/snaring his prey -- which explicitly includes humans -- and applies regardless of whether he's thereby capturing it unharmed or killing it outright.

[Rimmerdal]

Stage magician and a good inventor team might put super glue (no pun intended) to good use. as well metal on certain power is still magnetic so an a large magnet that lifts cars will still mess them up good. A set of electro-stunners and nice metal surface with glue or a lot of water to carry the charge can be quite effective.

Both could have had bad experiences with Meta-humans..or be ones captured by shock and had powers taken from them.

[Nightmask]

I've said before that, as written, the Hunter/Vigilante can swiftly work his way up to an 88% chance of successfully trapping/snaring his prey -- which explicitly includes humans -- and applies regardless of whether he's thereby capturing it unharmed or killing it outright.

And has been pointed out often enough that ability isn't going to let them capture or insta-kill anyone that they can't actually acquire what's needed to do either, since that percentage is all about successfully setting up the trap it doesn't even remotely mean 'I rolled this percentage so the trap is infallible and contains everything needed to make it successful'. They are after all people who spent their time learning to hunt and trap normal, non-powered creatures NOT super-humans.

[Stone Gargoyle]

Any NPC has the potential to be a threat. It all comes down to how you play them and how the dice roll. As others have said, there are many sources where you can find ordinary people OCCs and categories.

[Regularguy]

And has been pointed out often enough that ability isn't going to let them capture or insta-kill anyone that they can't actually acquire what's needed to do either, since that percentage is all about successfully setting up the trap it doesn't even remotely mean 'I rolled this percentage so the trap is infallible and contains everything needed to make it successful'. They are after all people who spent their time learning to hunt and trap normal, non-powered creatures NOT super-humans.

Hey, I took the time to specify "as written". I fully recognize that you think it shouldn't be written that way -- and you're certainly welcome to house-rule that Hunter/Vigilantes who spent their time learning about A and B face whatever penalties you'd like to make up when the prey is C -- but "as written," no, I just don't see it.

[arouetta]

Practically speaking, I think you would have to go with GM's fiat. Every OCC that can be imported in that's "typical" would be squashed like a bug by someone with a decent rollup of superpowers, unless they got something spiffy in return to level the playing field. At which point they are no longer "typical", they are something like the Hardware Category or Special Training Category. Once your character has graduated from "average person" to fitting in a HU Category, they have capabilities that are above and beyond your average person, and cannot be considered mundane. So you either stick them in a special Category and deal with the fact that it takes someone special to cross swords with someone superpowered, or you roll them up using only basic stats and education table (mundane wouldn't fall into a HU Category) and use GM's fiat for why they win when they shouldn't be able to.

[Stone Gargoyle]

It depends on what the players are playing, also. If you have a character who is good and won't harm the NPC on the principle that since the NPC has no powers, it would be an unfair fight, you have the chance of the NPC with no qualms about attacking someone able to win the encounter.
Also, not all powers are designed to stand up to heavy weaponry. If you have an NPC fully loaded for a fight, he might take down a superpowered character if the character does not have enough SDC and Hit Points.

[Nightmask]

And has been pointed out often enough that ability isn't going to let them capture or insta-kill anyone that they can't actually acquire what's needed to do either, since that percentage is all about successfully setting up the trap it doesn't even remotely mean 'I rolled this percentage so the trap is infallible and contains everything needed to make it successful'. They are after all people who spent their time learning to hunt and trap normal, non-powered creatures NOT super-humans.

Hey, I took the time to specify "as written". I fully recognize that you think it shouldn't be written that way -- and you're certainly welcome to house-rule that Hunter/Vigilantes who spent their time learning about A and B face whatever penalties you'd like to make up when the prey is C -- but "as written," no, I just don't see it.

You may house rule that that's how it's written, but since that's not actually how it's written it was important to point out that how you think it's written isn't actually so. Wouldn't want people confused and think you could just pass a roll and *poof* take out anything from a tiger to Galactus, which clearly no one should think is how the Hunter/Vigilante is written and would clearly be wrong in thinking so.

[Stone Gargoyle]

The point about the Hunter/Vigilante has already been argued previously in other threads. Can we kindly drop it from the conversation here and go back to answering the OP's question?

[eliakon]

Some great threats to supers from mundanes
Grenades
Gas attacks
Tranquilizer darts
Stun Grenades
Missiles
Snipers
poisoning food/drink/etc
Revealing secret identities
hostages
set a trap
wage a PR campaign
frame them for a crime

[slade the sniper]

Some great threats to supers from mundanes
Grenades
Gas attacks
Tranquilizer darts
Stun Grenades
Missiles
Snipers
poisoning food/drink/etc
Revealing secret identities
hostages
set a trap
wage a PR campaign
frame them for a crime

Looking at some other threats:
Seduction
Financial attacks
blackmail (sort of already covered with PR/framing)

-STS

[zerombr]

PU2 Weapon master, you can parry bullets with a wooden sword, you cannot possibly be more badass.

[Incriptus]

Also, not all powers are designed to stand up to heavy weaponry. If you have an NPC fully loaded for a fight, he might take down a superpowered character if the character does not have enough SDC and Hit Points.

I would say that the majority of the randomly rolled characters in the mutant/alien threads below would be vulnerable to my super power "getting together 10 or 20 guys with assault rifles who are willing to see you dead. "

[ShadowLogan]

Kind of a challenge/thought experiment I guess...what is the best mundane NPC can be made in Heroes Unlimited (or other megaversal settings like Chaos Earth or Nightbane or Beyond the Supernatural)?

Pretty close to some of the classes by skills with the right rolls and such depending on what you want to compare them to IMHO. 2 Skill Programs and 10 Secondary skills allows for a lot of options for High School given how many skills you can actually select. Higher education levels have fewer secondary skills, but make up for it with additional skill program availability and better bonuses)