Gen Con Indy – we leave it up to our Kickstarter backers

[Kevin]

First, let me state that all of us at Palladium Books appreciate our Robotech® RPG Tactics™ Kickstarter backers more than words can ever express. I meant it with all my heart when I wrote that, “we could not have done this product without YOU.” I meant it when I said, “ALL of us at Palladium Books, Ninja Division, Harmony Gold USA, and every Robotech® fan who enjoys this product owes you – our Kickstarter backers – a debt of gratitude, and that you should take a bow.”

I also meant it when I said I hope you stop by the Palladium booth at Gen Con so we can shake your hand and thank you personally for making this outstanding product possible.

We completely understand being frustrated and disappointed about the long time it has taken to make and release Robotech® RPG Tactics™. You want this product so bad you can taste it. You wanted it last year! You want it now!!

Us too.

If we could have made and shipped Robotech® RPG Tactics™ last Fall as we originally intended, we most certainly would have done so. I have NEVER lied about anticipated release dates. We were working with the limited knowledge and information we had at each announcement. We honestly and completely believed the release dates ourselves. We spent money advertising them because we believed them. That was our intention.

Time and time again, there have been unavoidable delays we did not anticipate.

As I have stated repeatedly, the creation of a product line such as this is new to us. There has been a lot of new territory to navigate. The learning curve has been steep. As this was a highly publicized and successful Kickstarter, that means all 5,000+ of you have been dragged along with us on that turbulent journey.

You are feeling the agony of the delays, the waiting, the unexpected problems that, normally, only we quietly endure behind the scenes ourselves.

We know how frustrated and upset you feel about everything. We feel the same, many times over. There have been many moments when we have felt like tearing our hair out and screaming to the heavens. We all deal with it as best we can.

Some people say there is no way this should have taken so long. Perhaps they could have done all of this faster and without the bumps Palladium has encountered. I don’t know. What I do know is that Palladium Books and Ninja Division could NOT. That is the simple reality. You don’t have to like that answer. I sure don’t. You don’t have to believe it, either. But it is the truth. We have worked tirelessly and diligently to get Robotech® RPG Tactics™ manufactured as fast as we could. Robotech® RPG Tactics™ has been Palladium’s top priority. We have been doing our best and have learned a lot. Wave One is coming off the production line now and will start shipping soon.

Gen Con Indy

Gen Con Indy is on the horizon. It is the largest gaming convention for this hobby in the country. I announced we are planning to bring some Robotech® RPG Tactics™ product to sell. A few hundred of six items: the main box game, four of the expansion packs (Tomahawk/Defender Destroids, Regult Battlepods, Artillery Battlepods, and Glaug Command) and the rule book. That would mean a few hundred people will get these items before most of the 5,200+ Kickstarter backers, and around the same time as the first backers are receiving theirs in the mail.

That was a tough decision for me to make. Here is how and why I made it:

* We will begin shipping Robotech® RPG Tactics™ to Kickstarter backers before we leave for Gen Con Indy.

* We will have people continuing to prep, package and ship Robotech® RPG Tactics™ to Kickstarter backers while the rest of us are at Gen Con.

* Bringing or not bringing Robotech® RPG Tactics™ to sell at Gen Con will NOT make any difference to shipping to Kickstarter backers. If we were to leave that product at our warehouse instead of taking it to Gen Con, not one single Kickstarter backer would get his or her rewards any sooner.

* Shipping to our Kickstarter backers will take what we estimate to be 3-4 weeks, maybe longer. We are NOT Amazon.com. We can’t ship what we estimate will be 7,000-9,000 packages (those add-ons and exclusives add up) in a few days, even with the upgrades we are making to our shipping system.

* Palladium is NOT shipping to distributors or to retail stores until after all the Wave One Kickstarter backer rewards have left our warehouse.

* We are not selling any Kickstarter exclusives, just the basic items listed above. Only a few hundred people will be able to buy them, as quantities will be limited.

* We have been promising for months that we would have Robotech® RPG Tactics™ product to sell at Gen Con. People have made travel plans, hotel reservations, bought tickets to Gen Con, etc., counting on it being available at Gen Con. We thought we’d have plenty of time to ship to backers before Gen Con, but the product is coming months later than we thought it would. If we could push back Gen Con, we would, but obviously we can’t.

* Gen Con Indy is critical to a successful product launch in the Fall. Having a major game like Robotech® RPG Tactics™ to show, demo and sell is HUGE. It creates buzz, attracts media attention, and is vital to the upcoming big, full scale retail push this Fall. We NEED to do this for the good of the product line. And there is so much more we want to release: more mecha, aircraft and combat vehicles, additional eras of Robotech® and their mecha, and so much more. Isn’t this what we all want?

Though I feared making product available to even just a few hundred gamers at Gen Con, I believe the vast majority of you, our backers, will understand why this is a necessity and be okay with it.

Here’s why. The entire purpose of a Kickstarter is to help fund a product that you, yourself, would love to see made and brought to market. It’s about more than getting cool swag before anyone else. It is about funding something YOU want and believe in. To make a shared dream into reality. That’s why it’s called crowdfunding.

Together, we are making the game we have always wanted. And for other people than just ourselves to enjoy. Making and bringing Robotech® RPG Tactics™ to market is the whole point of the Kickstarter, and having it available at Gen Con is a critical part of that effort.

You, our Kickstarter backers, are still getting special rewards for your funding, including those same retail products at below retail prices, plus Kickstarter exclusives that nobody else will ever get, and add-ons that won’t hit retail stores for some time to come. We would only be letting a few hundred people buy (at full retail price) a few items at Gen Con.

I believe we are all working toward the same goal and that most of our Kickstarter backers understand how important Gen Con Indy really is. That our backers might not be thrilled we’re selling a small selection of Robotech® RPG Tactics™ items at Gen Con Indy – but would understand the importance of doing so, and be okay with that. After all, only a few hundred people will join the ELITE Kickstarter backers in getting the product before it hits store shelves. And none of them are getting the goodies and exclusives going to our backers.

Maybe I’m wrong. I’m very sorry if our Gen Con announcement upset, angered or made you feel unappreciated in any way.

You are important to us.

We do respect and appreciate you.

So we are asking for YOUR permission.

We humbly ask, may we please sell some Robotech® RPG Tactics™ at Gen Con Indy? It’s only a few hundred of six items: the main box game, four of the expansion packs (Tomahawk/Defender Destroids, Regult Battlepods, Artillery Battlepods, and Glaug Command) and the rule book.

Post your “Yes” or “No” in the comments on Kickstarter Update #149 by Monday, July 21st. Please try to restrict your comments on that Update to “yes” or “no” votes, so that we can count them more accurately. There are plenty of other places to discuss your opinions about this voting process, the lateness of the rewards, or anything else.

If the majority of you say “no,” we will NOT bring Robotech® RPG Tactics™ to Gen Con Indy, except for the purpose of display and demos.

I implore you to say “yes.” Please give us your permission. We believe it would be disastrous not to have the small selection of items I’ve listed available for sale. Not having them will hurt the launch of Robotech® RPG Tactics™ and Palladium Books.

Please make your voices heard. If you are totally opposed to us selling Robotech® RPG Tactics™ at Gen Con, tell us. Do NOT sit back and be silent. Spread the word that we want every backer to make their voices heard.

Anyone who does NOT respond by July 21st, we will consider to be a “yes.”

Some may say that it is not fair to count non-responses as “yes” votes. After all, it may well be that more than half of the 5,000+ Kickstarter backers won’t respond at all. But that would say something, too: That the majority of backers aren’t that worried or upset about this. If you are, please let us know. We need to know. All the more reason you need to spread the word and make sure every backer reads Kickstarter Update #149 and makes their opinion known.

But we sincerely want your clear permission, so if it is okay with you, please vote “yes.”

How to vote. Since this really only impacts the Robotech® RPG Tactics™ Kickstarter backers, only you get a say. That means we need YOU to reply via comments on Kickstarter Update #149, where only you backers can post.

* Please vote once.
* Keep it simple. All you need to say is “Yes.” or “No.” If you have more to say, please put it after your “yes” or “no” vote, but please keep it to a minimum to make counting the votes easier.
* Robotech® RPG Tactics™ Kickstarter backers only.

DEADLINE: July 21, 2014. We need your response by July 21, 2014, so we can adjust our travel plans accordingly. If we’re not bringing Robotech® RPG Tactics™, we need a smaller truck, fewer people at the booth, fewer hotel rooms, some of our volunteers will need to cancel their travel plans, etc. PLEASE vote pronto. Thank you.

I don’t know what else to say. I am very sorry for the long delays despite our best efforts. I apologize for any anguish our plan to sell Robotech® RPG Tactics™ product at Gen Con may have caused you.

All we have ever wanted is to create a great Robotech® battle game and figures that Robotech fans like ourselves would love. I think you’ll find Robotech® RPG Tactics™ to be that product. It is an honor and a privilege to be in a position to bring you that game line. And we have plans for much more. Getting that great game into your hands has been a challenge. We are almost there. Please vote how you think is best. Thank so very much for your support.

With sincere appreciation,

Kevin Siembieda
Publisher and Fan Boy

[Jorel]

I just saw the bit about only posting yes or no on the KS Update. Oops. Already commented twice. I'm wondering why Palladium cannot just do pre-orders, even possibly at a discounted GenCon rate instead of selling the product that was supposed to go to a few hundred backers.

[Jorel]

For reference here is what Games & Gears is doing at GenCon for their Battle Boards. They were damaged by a flood in China, a natural disaster and not just late because of poor planning.

[Randomfist]

Apologies for "not knowing the release dates because this was new to us". No apology for breaking a PROMISE that backers would get their stuff first. With that promise there were no ifs, ands or buts attached. It was a promise. There should be an apology for breaking the promise, not a " this is new to us, we didn't know manufacturing would happen right before gen Con " excuse.

[Prince Artemis]

Can I ask a few qestions Randomfist? And I mean this respectfully. Did you back this KS and if so, why?

I ask because selling these at GenCon and sending the clear message that this is an available product and not just one that 'might come' is a pretty big deal at GenCon. This very well could be what makes distributors decide if they will carry the product or not. So, if you backed it because you wanted one, I can understand your anger. However, if you backed it because you wanted it to be a game you can actually play, your anger is kind of cutting off your nose to spite your face honestly. Because if they can't get the distrubitors and carriers on board? You're going to be sitting with a game box you can't play because no one else has one and can't easily get access to one.

It would be different if they weren't shipping any to backers until after Gencon, but they're not. Not taking it to Gencon does a lot of harm and no actual good. It's not like those 100 packages would get delivered to KS backers any faster.

And to answer my own question: Yes I backed it (Battle cry and the Macross), and I backed it because it's a game I want to see take off so I can actually try it out with people and not just as a collectable for my shelf.

[Jorel]

Anyone who does NOT respond by July 21st, we will consider to be a “yes.”

Some may say that it is not fair to count non-responses as “yes” votes. After all, it may well be that more than half of the 5,000+ Kickstarter backers won’t respond at all. But that would say something, too: That the majority of backers aren’t that worried or upset about this. If you are, please let us know. We need to know. All the more reason you need to spread the word and make sure every backer reads Kickstarter Update #149 and makes their opinion known.


Kevin Siembieda
Publisher and Fan Boy

This part negates anything good I've said. Expecting 2500+ people to say no is ludicrous. most don't ever comment on that page and may not read it. that does mean it isn't insulting to them as well. Palladium just gave themselves an excuse to ignore any and all no votes unless they total 2,500+. That isn't being respectful, it is slanting the scale so you win no matter when except if the whole world is aligned against them. Or at least more than 2,500 backers. That is terrible to do to them.

[Killer Cyborg]

I just saw the bit about only posting yes or no on the KS Update. Oops. Already commented twice. I'm wondering why Palladium cannot just do pre-orders, even possibly at a discounted GenCon rate instead of selling the product that was supposed to go to a few hundred backers.

I can't speak for everyone, but it don't go to conventions just to mail-order stuff.
I go there to see the products, feel them in my hand, see them up close, and to play with them in the hotel, on the way home, and as soon as I get home.
Just like I wouldn't go to the mall to order stuff from Amazon.

[Killer Cyborg]

Anyone who does NOT respond by July 21st, we will consider to be a “yes.”

Some may say that it is not fair to count non-responses as “yes” votes. After all, it may well be that more than half of the 5,000+ Kickstarter backers won’t respond at all. But that would say something, too: That the majority of backers aren’t that worried or upset about this. If you are, please let us know. We need to know. All the more reason you need to spread the word and make sure every backer reads Kickstarter Update #149 and makes their opinion known.


Kevin Siembieda
Publisher and Fan Boy

This part negates anything good I've said. Expecting 2500+ people to say no is ludicrous. most don't ever comment on that page and may not read it. that does mean it isn't insulting to them as well. Palladium just gave themselves an excuse to ignore any and all no votes unless they total 2,500+. That isn't being respectful, it is slanting the scale so you win no matter when except if the whole world is aligned against them. Or at least more than 2,500 backers. That is terrible to do to them.

If they don't care enough to vote, then they don't really care enough for it to matter.
Just like in politics.

[Killer Cyborg]

Apologies for "not knowing the release dates because this was new to us". No apology for breaking a PROMISE that backers would get their stuff first. With that promise there were no ifs, ands or buts attached. It was a promise. There should be an apology for breaking the promise, not a " this is new to us, we didn't know manufacturing would happen right before gen Con " excuse.

Is there a place where I can read the exact wording of that promise?

[Jorel]

it would have been better to use the votes only on the KS page and try spread word about the vote as opposed to slanting the scale to make it look fair when it is clearly not.

[Jorel]

Anyone who does NOT respond by July 21st, we will consider to be a “yes.”

Some may say that it is not fair to count non-responses as “yes” votes. After all, it may well be that more than half of the 5,000+ Kickstarter backers won’t respond at all. But that would say something, too: That the majority of backers aren’t that worried or upset about this. If you are, please let us know. We need to know. All the more reason you need to spread the word and make sure every backer reads Kickstarter Update #149 and makes their opinion known.


Kevin Siembieda
Publisher and Fan Boy

This part negates anything good I've said. Expecting 2500+ people to say no is ludicrous. most don't ever comment on that page and may not read it. that does mean it isn't insulting to them as well. Palladium just gave themselves an excuse to ignore any and all no votes unless they total 2,500+. That isn't being respectful, it is slanting the scale so you win no matter when except if the whole world is aligned against them. Or at least more than 2,500 backers. That is terrible to do to them.

If they don't care enough to vote, then they don't really care enough for it to matter.
Just like in politics.

If they don't know about this limited time vote, but find out at GenCon, they won't be pleased if it does matter to them.

[Prince Artemis]

Ok, reposting from what I posted on KS:

"Dinomight and others that think the poll is dishonest: they're giving 11 days for this poll, they have advertised it everywhere that they have advertised the kick starter itself, and sent an email to every kick starter supporter. That is not dishonesty, that's an honest assumption.

The internet has never been a place where people hold back on the negative comments, so it is a fair assumption that the people that don't vote are fine with the decision. If it really was dishonest, they would have had the poll open for a much shorter duration and they would not have advertised it. There are limits on what they are able to do."

Jorel, your claim would have a leg to stand on if Palladium wasn't advertising this poll on twitter, facebook, their forums, their site and oh yeah, an email sent to EVERY SINGLE BACKER. They're even giving it more than a week, so even the people on vacations will have time to see it.

What are you honestly expecting them to do? Call every single backer for a vote? Besides, based on the current voting, the backers saying yes are drastically outnumbering the nos.

[Rimmer]

Kevin S, and Palladium by extension, really are the modern day version of "The Boy who cried Wolf"

Warning: User warned for insulting a forum user/entity. -NMI

[jreece06]

Killer cyborg- please show me where in any political election not voting is counted as anything besides not voting

[jreece06]

I expect them to count the votes they get, not assume silence is consent... Did they not take grade 9 health class?

[Killer Cyborg]

it would have been better to use the votes only on the KS page and try spread word about the vote as opposed to slanting the scale to make it look fair when it is clearly not.

If it is clearly not fair, how did they slant thing to make it look fair...?

[Killer Cyborg]

Killer cyborg- please show me where in any political election not voting is counted as anything besides not voting

It's not counted as anything else here.
"Not voting" means that you don't care if Palladium brings the product to GenCon.

[Killer Cyborg]

I expect them to count the votes they get, not assume silence is consent... Did they not take grade 9 health class?

They're not doing anything to anybody else, to that method doesn't work.

[Ysabiau]

If Kevin and PB had asked us for permission to sell at GenCon *before* announcing they'd sell despite not having everything shipped out to backers? I'd probably have said yes. Now? No. And yes, I know where to vote...and I'll be doing that, even though it doesn't matter since there's no way even half the backers will wind up voting, which means PB will declare victory by default even though they say our voices matter.

This was (and is) not an acceptable way to treat fans who supported this effort and paid to get it off the ground. I love the game and I sincerely hope it takes off, but this is a poor start to its life.

[jreece06]

Killer cyborg- please show me where in any political election not voting is counted as anything besides not voting

It's not counted as anything else here.
"Not voting" means that you don't care if Palladium brings the product to GenCon.

Or it or could mean I lost my kick starter password, or that I don't think they will hold there word, as this is all based on them lying about it in the first place, or I could feel like some are saying... That a no vote will get my name blacklisted and shipped dead last...

You are assuming no vote means they are OK with selling... That's counting it as something

[Killer Cyborg]

Killer cyborg- please show me where in any political election not voting is counted as anything besides not voting

It's not counted as anything else here.
"Not voting" means that you don't care if Palladium brings the product to GenCon.

Or it or could mean I lost my kick starter password, or that I don't think they will hold there word, as this is all based on them lying about it in the first place, or I could feel like some are saying... That a no vote will get my name blacklisted and shipped dead last...

You are assuming no vote means they are OK with selling... That's counting it as something

Yeah, that stuff is possible. But it seems unlikely to matter unless there kind if stuff happens to one heck of a lot of people.
How close do you expect this vote to get?

[jreece06]

I expect less than 2500 votes cast, which means the vote doesn't matter, because the assumption is all non votes are votes for what Kevin wants to do.

Do you think government should cast all abstentions in favor of any given Motion?

[Killer Cyborg]

If Kevin and PB had asked us for permission to sell at GenCon *before* announcing they'd sell despite not having everything shipped out to backers? I'd probably have said yes. Now? No. And yes, I know where to vote...and I'll be doing that, even though it doesn't matter since there's no way even half the backers will wind up voting, which means PB will declare victory by default even though they say our voices matter.

This was (and is) not an acceptable way to treat fans who supported this effort and paid to get it off the ground. I love the game and I sincerely hope it takes off, but this is a poor start to its life.

Good post.

[Killer Cyborg]

I expect less than 2500 votes cast, which means the vote doesn't matter, because the assumption is all non votes are votes for what Kevin wants to do.

Why do you expect so few votes?

Do you think government should cast all abstentions in favor of any given Motion?

If the motion is "does this bother you?", then yes.

[jreece06]

Less than 50℅ of people vote. In anything.

No, you don't get to decide someone else's mind for them. Abstention is an option, and it's wrong to put words in someone else's mouth

[jreece06]

Especially when there is fear of reprisal

[Mech-Viper Prime]

Let's if I got this right of 5,342 backers

2000 backers vote no
300 backers vote yes
3042 backers don't vote but their votes are counted as yes anyways

[Killer Cyborg]

Less than 50℅ of people vote. In anything.

Right.
Because it doesn't really matter to them.

No, you don't get to decide someone else's mind for them. Abstention is an option, and it's wrong to put words in someone else's mouth

It's not putting words in their mouth. It's exactly describing the situation: they don't care enough to vote.
Which means that they don't care.

[Killer Cyborg]

Especially when there is fear of reprisal

[The Beast]

What are you honestly expecting them to do? Call every single backer for a vote? Besides, based on the current voting, the backers saying yes are drastically outnumbering the nos.

That's only because backers have to vote no. The poll automaticlly started at 100% for "Yes."

[13eowulf]

Especially when there is fear of reprisal

To expand this point, many have expressed fear, in other venues, that if they vote 'no', as Palladium already has their info as a Backer, that their order will be delayed/placed at the bottom of the list, or in some other way penalized for such.

For the record I do not believe Palladium would do such, I am just providing the info on what is being referred to when speaking of fear of reprisal.

[13eowulf]

What are you honestly expecting them to do? Call every single backer for a vote? Besides, based on the current voting, the backers saying yes are drastically outnumbering the nos.

That's only because backers have to vote no. The poll automaticlly started at 100% for "Yes."

Incorrect, Prince Artemis is referring to ongoing counts, as the votes are all public (at least for backers, I dont know for non backers). Only Explicit Yes and No votes being counted, and the Yes are 'winning' in excess of 2 to 1 when last I checked.

EDIT: I BELIEVE that is what the good Prince is referring to, I do not speak for him, and I am not telepathic nor precognitive (so the doctors keep telling me). However the count estimate is there for people to see, I am not making that up.

[jreece06]

As wulf says, some fear their vote would be held against them.

[Killer Cyborg]

Especially when there is fear of reprisal

To expand this point, many have expressed fear, in other venues, that if they vote 'no', as Palladium already has their info as a Backer, that their order will be delayed/placed at the bottom of the list, or in some other way penalized for such.

For the record I do not believe Palladium would do such, I am just providing the info on what is being referred to when speaking of fear of reprisal.

[Steve Dubya]

Doesn't this all hinge on whether or not the initial shipment arrives when is hoped?

[jreece06]

Killer, while I don't think PB would do it, there is a reason most voting is done confidentially

[Kryptt]

Especially when there is fear of reprisal

To expand this point, many have expressed fear, in other venues, that if they vote 'no', as Palladium already has their info as a Backer, that their order will be delayed/placed at the bottom of the list, or in some other way penalized for such.

For the record I do not believe Palladium would do such, I am just providing the info on what is being referred to when speaking of fear of reprisal.

That would be very poor form if Kevin allowed for this. The man made a promise and I and many backers expect him to keep his word. I certainly hope that I don't get penalized for voting no. It would suck if I got my stuff after the international orders or get broken or melted models. I gave a few hundred and I expect to be compensated with my willingness to part with my money.

@Kevin S
I still would like to know the status of wave two. Did PB run out of money to complete the second wave? Will we backers still get it this year? Please don't jerk us around and make us wait till GC 2015.

[Jorel]

Ok, reposting from what I posted on KS:

"Dinomight and others that think the poll is dishonest: they're giving 11 days for this poll, they have advertised it everywhere that they have advertised the kick starter itself, and sent an email to every kick starter supporter. That is not dishonesty, that's an honest assumption.

The internet has never been a place where people hold back on the negative comments, so it is a fair assumption that the people that don't vote are fine with the decision. If it really was dishonest, they would have had the poll open for a much shorter duration and they would not have advertised it. There are limits on what they are able to do."

Jorel, your claim would have a leg to stand on if Palladium wasn't advertising this poll on twitter, facebook, their forums, their site and oh yeah, an email sent to EVERY SINGLE BACKER. They're even giving it more than a week, so even the people on vacations will have time to see it.

What are you honestly expecting them to do? Call every single backer for a vote? Besides, based on the current voting, the backers saying yes are drastically outnumbering the nos.

there is no way that 2500+ people voting no would ever happen anyone that pays attention to those kinds of comments knows that. They should base it on those that choose to respond and give every backer one vote and not count the ones that don't vote.

[Killer Cyborg]

If the majority of backers don't care enough to vote, then how is it important enough for Palladium to screw themselves over financially in order to make the backers feel better?

[Prince Artemis]

What are you honestly expecting them to do? Call every single backer for a vote? Besides, based on the current voting, the backers saying yes are drastically outnumbering the nos.

That's only because backers have to vote no. The poll automaticlly started at 100% for "Yes."

No, of the posted votes the Yes's are currently winning 6 to 1 if not more. I was not factoring in any of the non-responders, only the ones posted. Each page of 50 replies has maybe 10-15 nos at most (many are less than that) and the rest are yes's. Hell, I started doing a master list and only got 3 pages in before it became clear that the site is too busy and votes would be easy to miss. But here's what I got:
tinomen - Yes
Tim Doyle - Yes
Roy Kubicek - Yes
Brad Kane - Yes
Michael - Yes
James Douglas - No
Gerry Havey - Yes

Kimberly Burgess - Yes
James Lofshult((Solav)) - Yes
David Gerhart - Yes
Joshua Franklin - No
Jonathan King - Yes
Peter Porcaro Jr - Yes
Ben Laurence - Yes
Jr - Yes
Christopher Smith - Yes
Alex - Yes

Patrick Ciraco - No
Ryan Rawlings - Yes
dackery - Yes
Jeremy Govier - Yes
jason phillips - Yes
Thaine Hepler - No
Rick Hewitt - Yes
Curtis Yost - Yes
John Hollar - Yes
John D - Yeah

Jason Garber - Yes
Shamar - Yes
Robert Phanelson - No
Matt kenny - Yes
Justin booth - Yes
Pete Mackay - Yes
Dinomight - Yes
Bradley Morgan - YEs
Kain - No
Brian Fowler - Yes

Thoth - Yes
Andre M - Yes
Shawn Gordon - Yes
Jason - Yes
Matt - Yes
Brian Pitts - Yes
Adam McLaughlin - Yes
Roger Rexroad - Yes
John McHugh - Yes
Stuart Lace - Yes

Brian Botzan - Yes
Chuck Mays - Yes
Walter Spivak - Yes
Alex Ramos - Yes
Kevin Szuminski - Yes
Simon Mayes - Yes
Theodore bender - Yes
Geoffrey Oakley - Yes
Pedro Barrenechea - Yes
Rudy wittmer - Yes

Ken Whitehurst - Yes
Thomas Einhellig - Yes
Nicholas Broady - Yes
Minstrel Cottini - Yes
Sprack - Yes
Brownell Combs - Yes
Simon6825 - No
Laney - Yes
Brian Reed- Yes
WaaarghPug - Yes

Scott Synowiez - Yes
May Tran - Yes
Andrew Brown - Yes
Matthew s. Tomczak - Yes
KitSAllGoode - Yes
Phillop Anastas - Yes
Josua Russell - Yes
Francisco vasquez - yes
Andrew Deignan - Yes
Matthew Daye - Yes

(grouped into 10's for counting convenience)

So, of 150 votes, 22 were no.

That's the first 3 pages and while I haven't recorded it, the trend does hold in the other pages. So yes, while the No's certainly seem more angry/emotional than the Yes's , the Yes's are grossely outnumbering them. So what now? Do we not count the people that voted yes because that's unfair to the no's too?

Also, the one's saying they're fearing reprisal are no voters that are trying to use fallacies to sway people. They are effectively the birther movement of this vote. Making baseless accusations to try and sew doubt.

[jreece06]

Prince, if the yeses win, that's one thing. It's another if they lose, and the nonvoting let's pb do this anyway...

Similarly, if my political party loses, is not the same as losing because the they guy counted non votes as votes for him

[jreece06]

I may not agree that there would be reprisals, but most voting is confidential for a reason

[Mech-Viper Prime]

What are you honestly expecting them to do? Call every single backer for a vote? Besides, based on the current voting, the backers saying yes are drastically outnumbering the nos.

That's only because backers have to vote no. The poll automaticlly started at 100% for "Yes."

No, of the posted votes the Yes's are currently winning 6 to 1 if not more. I was not factoring in any of the non-responders, only the ones posted. Each page of 50 replies has maybe 10-15 nos at most (many are less than that) and the rest are yes's. Hell, I started doing a master list and only got 3 pages in before it became clear that the site is too busy and votes would be easy to miss. But here's what I got:
tinomen - Yes
Tim Doyle - Yes
Roy Kubicek - Yes
Brad Kane - Yes
Michael - Yes
James Douglas - No
Gerry Havey - Yes

Kimberly Burgess - Yes
James Lofshult((Solav)) - Yes
David Gerhart - Yes
Joshua Franklin - No
Jonathan King - Yes
Peter Porcaro Jr - Yes
Ben Laurence - Yes
Jr - Yes
Christopher Smith - Yes
Alex - Yes

Patrick Ciraco - No
Ryan Rawlings - Yes
dackery - Yes
Jeremy Govier - Yes
jason phillips - Yes
Thaine Hepler - No
Rick Hewitt - Yes
Curtis Yost - Yes
John Hollar - Yes
John D - Yeah

Jason Garber - Yes
Shamar - Yes
Robert Phanelson - No
Matt kenny - Yes
Justin booth - Yes
Pete Mackay - Yes
Dinomight - Yes
Bradley Morgan - YEs
Kain - No
Brian Fowler - Yes

Thoth - Yes
Andre M - Yes
Shawn Gordon - Yes
Jason - Yes
Matt - Yes
Brian Pitts - Yes
Adam McLaughlin - Yes
Roger Rexroad - Yes
John McHugh - Yes
Stuart Lace - Yes

Brian Botzan - Yes
Chuck Mays - Yes
Walter Spivak - Yes
Alex Ramos - Yes
Kevin Szuminski - Yes
Simon Mayes - Yes
Theodore bender - Yes
Geoffrey Oakley - Yes
Pedro Barrenechea - Yes
Rudy wittmer - Yes

Ken Whitehurst - Yes
Thomas Einhellig - Yes
Nicholas Broady - Yes
Minstrel Cottini - Yes
Sprack - Yes
Brownell Combs - Yes
Simon6825 - No
Laney - Yes
Brian Reed- Yes
WaaarghPug - Yes

Scott Synowiez - Yes
May Tran - Yes
Andrew Brown - Yes
Matthew s. Tomczak - Yes
KitSAllGoode - Yes
Phillop Anastas - Yes
Josua Russell - Yes
Francisco vasquez - yes
Andrew Deignan - Yes
Matthew Daye - Yes

(grouped into 10's for counting convenience)

So, of 150 votes, 22 were no.

That's the first 3 pages and while I haven't recorded it, the trend does hold in the other pages. So yes, while the No's certainly seem more angry/emotional than the Yes's , the Yes's are grossely outnumbering them. So what now? Do we not count the people that voted yes because that's unfair to the no's too?

Also, the one's saying they're fearing reprisal are no voters that are trying to use fallacies to sway people. They are effectively the birther movement of this vote. Making baseless accusations to try and sew doubt.

So 172 backers Of 5,342 backers that leaves what 5000 silence.

[Jorel]

the way they are doing the tally they could have just told all the "Yes" people to not vote...and only the "No" people to vote and if the No's can get more than 50% of the backers to respond they would consider not selling at GenCon. So if 2,672 people say "No", then maybe. But otherwise they will do as they please as usual.

[NMI]

Especially when there is fear of reprisal

Do you have verifiable proof that there will be some form of reprisal? No? Didn't think so.

[Jorel]

Does Palladium have verifiable proof that everyone who doesn't respond is cool with them selling at GenCon? I thought not.

[jreece06]

Especially when there is fear of reprisal

Do you have verifiable proof that there will be some form of reprisal? No? Didn't think so.

Do you understand what a fear is? I've stated multiple times that I DON'T think this fear is justified. I also don't think a 3 year old being afraid of monsters in their closet is justified... it doesn't change how "real" the fear FEELS to those who feel it.

Will their be reprisals? I am 99.9999% sure there will not be.

Do SOME people BELIEVE there will be reprisals? yes, and they have said as much.

[popscythe]

I think it's time that the members of this desperate vocal minority smear campaign are removed from the forums.

[NMI]

I think it's time that the members of this desperate vocal minority smear campaign are removed from the forums.

As long as they remain within the rules, no one needs to be "removed" from the forums.

[Giant2005]

Apologies for "not knowing the release dates because this was new to us". No apology for breaking a PROMISE that backers would get their stuff first. With that promise there were no ifs, ands or buts attached. It was a promise. There should be an apology for breaking the promise, not a " this is new to us, we didn't know manufacturing would happen right before gen Con " excuse.

Is there a place where I can read the exact wording of that promise?

This is what is being quoted as the "promise" "In the end, you, our Kickstarter supporters, will be the first to receive a wonderful product that we hope will make you grin and provide endless hours of enjoyment. Thank you for sharing our dream. You, your pledges of support and unbridled enthusiasm are very much appreciated."
Worth mentioning is that it was said within update number 125 which occurred almost 8 months after the Kickstarter was over and people had made their pledges without knowing whether or not they would be the first to receive the product.