Battle Fury Wilk's Laser Sword?

[Aermas]

Where does the extra damage come from when enchanting a sword to be a Battle Fury Blade? Could something like a Wilk's Laser Sword gain the same or better benefit?

[taalismn]

Okay, first off where does Battle Fury come from? I find no spell matching that name.

[Curbludgeon]

Battle Fury Blades are found in WB16 Federation of Magic revised pp 119-120, or Rifts Book of Magic pg 317. The spells involved in their creation are Ensorcel, Speed Weapon, Power Weapon, Invincible Armor, and Enchant Weapon.

The extra damage comes from the Power Weapon spell, made permanent via the 1000 PPE version of Enchant Weapon. Note that spell's 2d4 permanent PPE expense. Also see the Deathbringer weapon in either text for an example of when such a weapon is made without Power Weapon. The Ensorcel spell is arguably a more awkward fit in these weapons, and perhaps represents something akin to a minor variant of rune magic.

[Orin J.]

Since the bonus pain is coming form an enchantment to the weapon and a Wilk's laser sword is, technically, not the weapon itself but simply emiting the beam that that functions as the weapon, i don't think this'd work.

At least, i wouldn't allow it, sine it opens up the "i wanna enchant my boom gun!" door by making modern projectiles and directed energy blasts "weapons" in the same logical path as swords and clubs for magicin' purposes

[Jefffar]

Is a bow or crossbow eligible for enchantment?

[taalismn]

Is a bow or crossbow eligible for enchantment?

Nope; Power Weapon doesn't work on projectile types, Speed Weapon doesn't work on anything other than melee weaponry.
Enchant Weapon can be cast on a limited number of arrows/bolts, though.

[Jefffar]

Okay, so some here are trying to define the laser sword as a very short ranged, ranged weapon while others are saying it should be a melee weapon.

[Orin J.]

Okay, so some here are trying to define the laser sword as a very short ranged, ranged weapon while others are saying it should be a melee weapon.

I am not defining it as a ranged weapon, i am defining it as an energy emitting device instead of a blade.

A Wilk's laser sword is a melee weapon in the same way a blowtorch is a melee weapon, the damage is not coming from the part you'd be enchanting but from the energy emitted by it when turned on. I want to be careful the enchantment is not read as "improves damage from the weapon regardless of the nature of how it causes said damage" here because that's a big ol' an of annoying worms.

[Curbludgeon]

To muddy things a bit further could a Vibro Weapon be eligible? There is a physical "blade" but any damage comes from a very short range field surrounding it. Arguably the physical blade never touches a target when the field is engaged, but that makes things like Vibro Chainsaws even more silly.

[Aermas]

Okay, so some here are trying to define the laser sword as a very short ranged, ranged weapon while others are saying it should be a melee weapon.

The books list it as a melee weapon.

[ShadowLogan]

Where does the extra damage come from when enchanting a sword to be a Battle Fury Blade? Could something like a Wilk's Laser Sword gain the same or better benefit?

An energy blade like a Wilk's Laser Sword/Knife or TW Flaming Sword/Lightblade (etc). I'd say no, they don't have a physical blade to enchant, even though they have physical hilts the blade is not physical. I think this is important since we don't know the "modifications" they TW has to make in order to turn the ordinary weapon into a BFB, there just may not be room on a "hilt" to do it (ex, what if you need to put mystical markings on the blade, how do you do that with a non-physical blade like a laser sword?)

You could do it with a Vibro-blade, though likely are "destroying" the Vibro-technology to install the TW modifications. Something like the natural MDC metals (like Kissenette, sp?, or similar materials). Could work though I don't think they'd result in a better damage output than using ordinary materials.

[Orin J.]

To muddy things a bit further could a Vibro Weapon be eligible? There is a physical "blade" but any damage comes from a very short range field surrounding it. Arguably the physical blade never touches a target when the field is engaged, but that makes things like Vibro Chainsaws even more silly.

it'd probably work, but on the knifeblade itself and not the vibrofield that does the damage. although that'd be a funny weapon, and MDC weapon that's magical only when it's turned off and acts as a "normal" knife.

[Aermas]

You have the physical hilt & magic weapons come in all shapes & sizes so physical space isn't the limiter, we also see all kinds of magic devices/weapons with a projection effect.

[ShadowLogan]

You have the physical hilt & magic weapons come in all shapes & sizes so physical space isn't the limiter, we also see all kinds of magic devices/weapons with a projection effect.

In general I would agree with this, but there can be specific use cases creates an exception.

The BFB entry in WB16o (pg119-20) are "usually Claymore swords, but on occasion, a weapon of this type is made as a Flamberge, polearm or large battle axe." It also mentions specifically "with designs etched into the blade."

The text specifically indicates alterations are made to the physical blade itself, something the wilk's laser sword lacks given it is only a hilt. The text also seems to indicate you need a lot of physical space given the only known examples are large weapons, which again a hilt-only weapon lacks.

Now a TW can create an hilt-only sword with a "projected blade" (Flaming Sword, Lightblade, IIRC even an Iceblade), but I don't think they can combine it with BFB proper given the description. That doesn't mean they could not give the device additional functions to give it SIMILAR abilities (x2 attack rate, increase damage, etc), and we know they can install multiple functions in a device.

[Aermas]

So if it walks like a duck, quacks like & duck & does extra damage & attacks like a duck I'm comfortable saying it's a duck

[taalismn]

What is this constant obsession with ducks? You have some unnatural attraction to waterfowl or something?
Leave the poor amphibious birds alone, willya?

[Aermas]

Not til they pay for their crimes

[taalismn]

Not til they pay for their crimes

Was it Donald, Scrooge, or Howard who did you dirt?

[Jefffar]

This is getting Daffy.

[taalismn]

You're despicable.

[Curbludgeon]

I'm thinking a possible way to deal with TW modifications potentially reducing the volume of a melee weapon's business end is to start with a larger weapon and incorporate a Mystic Fulcrum and\or Featherlight effect. With that even something which might be bulky like a two handed axe made of NYC mutant bone could be wielded easily, natively inflicts MDC damage, and there's enough space for a little wiring and crystals.

[Grazzik]

I'm thinking a possible way to deal with TW modifications potentially reducing the volume of a melee weapon's business end is to start with a larger weapon and incorporate a Mystic Fulcrum and\or Featherlight effect. With that even something which might be bulky like a two handed axe made of NYC mutant bone could be wielded easily, natively inflicts MDC damage, and there's enough space for a little wiring and crystals.

Take it one step further and put a TW switch on the hilt. This switch would be tied to size manipulation spells like reduce self or giant, but customized using the rules in Nightbane TtGD to only affect the business end of the weapon - shrink it, expand it or return to normal size. That way, it doesn't get in the way if in a tight space, or gives reach when out in the open. Similar type switch could be put on a shield.

PS. Thank you for no duck puns... it was driving me quackers ...

[Curbludgeon]

Both of those spells are of fairly high cost and short duration, so I don't know. There are published items using Mystic Fulcrum (Magus Automata) and Featherlight (Deathbringer swords, even though the latter spell is described as making a target useless as a weapon. A possible workaround is to put a long term Dimensional Pocket spell on a pseudo sheath from which a weapon could be drawn. There's a Shadow Magic spell which has a similar effect, but that's even less commonly available.

[ShadowLogan]

Getting back to the OP's question of where the extra damage comes from a BFB?

Which extra damage?:
-when energized in BFB mode. That's coming from the magic involved, I don't recall a strength modifier so it's likely an aura thing (which might not be extendable to non-physical blades). It might also be the result of the TW magic function interacting with other magic properties of the weapon (see below)
-when un-energized, a typical Claymore sword is supposed to do 3d6 SDC damage in RUE (more than in RMB era where its 2d6, though the Flamberge is 3d6), which means its already doing x2 damage for some reason when it becomes "enchanted" for MD combat (its doing 2:1 instead of 1:1), which could be the purpose of the markings etched into the blade mentioned in the text. There are probably a few ways to up the damage, like a TW duplicating the PF Alchemists ability to increase damage magically (upto x3 magical properties can be instilled), manufacture methods (Dwarves and Kobalds can improve damage), and material(s) involved (silver is mentioned IIRC), or some combination of these.

Both of those spells are of fairly high cost and short duration, so I don't know. There are published items using Mystic Fulcrum (Magus Automata) and Featherlight (Deathbringer swords, even though the latter spell is described as making a target useless as a weapon. A possible workaround is to put a long term Dimensional Pocket spell on a pseudo sheath from which a weapon could be drawn. There's a Shadow Magic spell which has a similar effect, but that's even less commonly available.

While I'm not going to argue about what the spells state there are two caveats to keep in mind in regard to TW per text in RUE:
1. Spell Chains can modify aspects of the primary spell (this is seen with the classic TW Flaming Sword where Firebolt's instant effect is modified by other spells in the chain to have a longer duration than instant. This means if one can work out what spells could be justified in modifying the primary spell (MF or FL in this case) effect(s) you can get around limitations of the primary spell
2. TWs can "tweak" Spells without the use of a spell chain (they have an example of using Carpet of Adhesion for super traction tires, they traded strength of the adhesive property for greater duration. So maybe in this case FL for example is tweaked to not reduce the weight/mass as much in exchange for greater duration (or property).

[Aermas]

Which extra damage?

Jumping from 6d6 to 2d4x10 when in Battle Fury mode. Stuff like the Deathbringer sword also has high melee damage without any definite reason for it. I just want a tw laser sword that can do 2d4 & double attacks/the properties of a Battle Fury Blade.

[taalismn]

Build yourself a two-blade laser sword then; though your two attacks will have to be on the same target. If you're especially strong, TRIPLE or Quadruple the number of laser-projectors. Expect to pay lots for the crystal-gem elements to bring the PPE costs down to sustainable levels.

[ShadowLogan]

Which extra damage?

Jumping from 6d6 to 2d4x10 when in Battle Fury mode. Stuff like the Deathbringer sword also has high melee damage without any definite reason for it. I just want a tw laser sword that can do 2d4 & double attacks/the properties of a Battle Fury Blade.

The Damage output you are looking for is pretty easy...

Construct a TW Lightblade with a Damage intensity setting option that must be set when activated/cast, this will alter the duration. Example of two settings:
1. 2d4MD (desired) means it would function x5 as long (or 25minutes) since that is 1/5 the base (max) damage
2. 2d4x10MD (desired) means it would function 1/2 as long (or 2.5minutes) since that is x2 the base (max) damage
3. (optional) base.
4. (optional) any other combinations of altered damage traded for by inverse time duration.

Note this should increase the cost and complexity of the device for this feature, in what ways I am not sure off hand. A GM could in theory rule each "setting" as a separate device function built into the hilt (limit of 4 per device IINM). A GM could also in theory rule the simple "settings" are a single device function and increase the cost/complexity (or they might not). This approach is based on the "Carpet of Adhesion" tire example in RUE (pg129) altering the primary spell's output.

The non-damage BFB enhancements would have to come via another device function, and should include some modification to the base. If you're just after the BFB speed enhancement, just doing a "Speed Weapon" TW enchantment should work (can likely also get the suit of magical force with secondary spells). Now the TW Lightblade likely will need something to indicate it can move faster as part of the extra device function here (the blade could be altered to a "faster" type of blade, counter weight in the Pommel of the hilt, a concealed hypodermic that deploys adding the Spell "Fleet Feet" or "Magical Adrenaline Rush" into the mix, etc).

[taalismn]

Build a whole arm sleeve/gauntlet with the physical performance enhancers built into it. More versatile, since you can use other melee weapons with it as well.

[ShadowLogan]

I agree with the gauntlet suggestion that would be a better option, you could combine Speed Weapon with a spell granting SN PS (and use the SN PS rules for weapons which might push the damage output).

Still the OP desires it all built into a hilt.

[taalismn]

Still the OP desires it all built into a hilt.

Then OP should just say. "Hey, unique TW weapon; can't be duplicated by anyone less than a god-level artificer that can bend the rules as they see fit."
Because anything less in creation power, I'd GM rule the weapon has to have some drawbacks. such as 'The ensorcelled entity inside the hilt that grants the extra attacks is ornery and disruptive; before engaging the extra attacks feature, roll versus magic; on a successful save you may use the extra attacks as you see fit, having overridden the hilt-spirit's willpower. On a fail, the hilt-spirit uses those extra attack-actions to either hinder(as a parry) your own attacks, or attacks you directly...get in a fight with your own laser sword trying to cut your head off."

Also, a laser sword with the properties wanted? Word gets out; other people want it to analyze or use. PC with super laser sword now gets targeted by bounty hunters.

[Curbludgeon]

What are some examples of items with a particularly clear duration\effect slider?

Jumping from 6d6 to 2d4x10 when in Battle Fury mode.

That's a use-activated Power Weapon(doubles, here with some rounding up) on an previously enchanted Enchant Weapon(doubled standard damage as MDC) performed on a large sword (3d6), empowered by an Ensorcel.

Stuff like the Deathbringer sword also has high melee damage without any definite reason for it.

That's a permanent Power Weapon on an Enchant Weapon large sword (here rounded down).[/quote]

I just want a tw laser sword that can do 2d4 & double attacks/the properties of a Battle Fury Blade.

The other effects are pretty straightforward, unless one wants to play with spell chains or the Ensorcel. Getting 6d6+ damage on a base weapon that's just a hilt can be a Lightblade with miniaturized runes or something.

Alternatively one can start jumping through hoops. Wormwood Battle Crystals double damage to whatever while on Wormwood. The Symbiotic Warrior "optional" take from the Rifter can make that work anywhere. Also from Wormood Apoks, as well as Underseas' Sea Inquisitor, can double damage to supernatural evil, which also converts SDC to MDC. I feel like Galaxy Unlimited may have had a 6d6 laser sword. Two fetishes work to increase damage, with one less hindered with regard to more technological weapons. Soulcraft could swing it, but would be benefitted by offloading BFB effects like the MDC to a source other than the weapon, which might lead to Fleet Feet being more appropriate than Speed Weapon. Blade Magic from the Rifter can make a pretty strong sword. Several of these things aren't mutually exclusive.

[Aermas]

There's no mention of real-estate being a factor in enchanting anything. A throwing knife can have the same enchantments as a giant power armor sized Dragonslayer. So I still don't see why a hilt would be limiting. I don't really care if it was the size of a Juicer combat bracer or whatever. Maybe I'm not reading the books close enough

@Curblugeon

Works for me. I think any TW should be able to spellchain something close enough to the same thing then, I'm happy enough knowing that it should work

[Curbludgeon]

I wouldn't make claims about if things should or shouldn't work. This is taking the strongest bespoke melee weapon made by a technowizard consortium operating unopposed from an intangible teleporting factory fortress, and making it able to fit in a pocket. It's necessarily cheesy. At a minimum making the blade's generation an effect reduces the total number of effects available on the weapon. To the extent that a character could just have another device it's somewhat obviated. Taking some Splugorth Techno-Wizardry as representative one might just have separate buttons on a suit of armor count as multiple items. One could then argue that having multiple activation buttons on this hilt would be similar. Then there's how effects like Soulcraft and Enchant Weapon allow three abilities on a weapon, which might be considered as limits independent from each other, much less TW. The most relevant limit is when a given person finds the result in bad taste, which is why there's been some pushback on the idea.

[ShadowLogan]

@taalismn
I don't disagree with you that the OP could have phrased what they where looking for better. I'm just trying to work within the given parameters.

Alternatively one can start jumping through hoops. (...)

Potentials to consider to adding to the list:
-a Gizmoteer from SA2
-a Psi-Tech from Psycape
-device inflicts a curse of vulnerability to lasers on a target (inflict curse is likely possible, though the specifics of the curse might not have any basis AFAIK) so that the 1st strike does normal damage but subsequent hits do more.

(on your list you mentioned Galaxy Unlimited, I don't have the book but HU2E has a 5d6 energy sword)

Besides why go with a wimpy Wilk's Laser Sword with TW modification (for damage output atleast), when you can go with a Naruni Energy Sword (Mecha Knight PA, Mercenaries pg134-5) that hits x2 as hard and has superior payload (IINM the MK's ES isn't cabled, and no indication of wireless transfer VS the W's LS "battery"). Now sourcing the Naruni equipment is an issue, but if we're doing unrestricted access its worth considering

Also IMHO "Fleet Feet" is superior to "Speed Weapon". Not only does it x2 raw APM (SW each raw APM counts as 2, but is limited to the weapon in question IINM), it doubles PP attribute (complete with bonuses) and Spd attribute. It's only downside is the slight penalty to initiative (which likely doesn't mean much when you get into the granted bonus APMs is countered by the enemy)

There's no mention of real-estate being a factor in enchanting anything.

I don't think there is per say, but it would be a common sense thing to consider when dealing with mystic markings (that are mentioned being present on the BFB). Presumably these mystic markings have to still be legible/recognizable as such to work. One can't just make a mark and say this is supposed to be the Symbol for "Closed Seal" but it came out looking more like "Dimensions" and expect it to work properly because the TW/Diabolist/mage couldn't make it legible enough at your desired scale.

Then you have to also consider if the location is actually important. The BFB specifically mentions the markings location as the blade and not left to be ambiguous. The question to be considered is that location on the BFB (or any TW device) significant to the "magic" involved or not. If it is, putting the markings elsewhere might not work at the desired output. I'm not saying you can't put the same mystic symbols (or chain of) on the hilt, but if they are intended for the blade the output might not be what you desire (if there is output at all, which is a possibility).

It might also be worth considering to what impact TW alterations to the device might have for mystic markings. For example, what if TW modifications require winding copper wire(s) around the hilt, how does that impact the markings effectiveness if the wire(s) cross the markings (or even merely come close to them). This could lead back to the location aspect, the TW(s) who created the BFB might have found they needed the markings on the blade away from the hilt modifications to work properly with the winding(s) done in a certain pattern to boot so you can't simply change the winding pattern.

[Aermas]

Yeah but that just leads me to want to pull of crazier things in answer to restrictions.

Like casting reduce on yourself & enlarge on the item so you can add tons of information on circuit sized sigils & runes. Sure that doesn't cover your copper wires concern & such, but it all comes down to the player trying fun & inventive work arounds to the problem

[Curbludgeon]

My mentioning of Heroes Unlimited was just in relation to those OCCs which double SDC and change to MDC. With the Battle Fury already rounding 6d6 up to 2d4x10 a 5d6 laser sword sadly wouldn't cut it. Those classes' cheese work better with machine guns and the like, anyway.

That Naruni sword has some potential. The 1d6x10 damage is at the ceiling for an equivalent to the Northern Gun Universal Energy Link (WB34 pg 64 and elsewhere).For those that don't have that book it's basically a retractable cable in an armor forearm which can power up to 1d6x10MDC\blast weapons and automatically shuts off for weapons in excess. Whether that limit would apply to a weapon getting a constant current like an energy sword might be open, but I don't recall it being used in that book to power a melee weapon. Having a "conventional" power source for a TW or otherwise enchanted weapon is also a concern. While some TW firearms can still fire non magical ammunition, I can't recall something similar for an energy weapon. If people know of such pretty please share.

The weapon is just a hilt, but at 40 pounds and intended for a 10 foot tall power armor is a bit big for people. Work in a Mystic Fulcrum or Featherlight into a spellchain, and it could be workable, with the bonus of having a bit more space for runes and such.

I'd contend the downside of the Fleet Feet spell as compared to Speed Weapon or Magical-Adrenal Rush is that the spell was only reprinted from PFRPG's first edition and the Cutting Room Floor due to player demand for cheese, and left tucked in PFRPG 3 as a guilty afterthought.

[ShadowLogan]

@Curbludgeon
Yeah "Fleet Feet" has its drawback in terms of sourcing, but IMHO MAR is the worst of the 3 in terms of downsides when it wears off (and it doesn't enhance to the same level as FF or SW).

I agree about the size of the Naruni weapon being a potential issue, but since we don't know the race/size of the character in question it might not be as big a deal in some cases as others.

@Aermas
Trying to find work arounds for the issues raised though is likely going to just drive the price up farther since now you have to find a TW who can do the work, plus the added cost of these rather unique services and I could see the cost of this thing ballooning into ridiculous territory that could be achieved via simpler methods that avoid the issues altogether.

[Blue_Lion]

the thing with TW it is up to each individual GM what can be done in there games. Many would stop things they see as breaking or not in line with how they see things working. So in the end ask your GM.

[Aermas]

@Aermas

Who cares about price? Or the struggle? Making cool stuff is it's own reward.

[Shorty Lickens]

In my game I would not allow it. Only physical blades. And nothing that was already magical or T.W. energy powered. I would allow MDC blades or exotic materials. Maybe even living or deceased materials, like the stuff from England.

[Shorty Lickens]

the thing with TW it is up to each individual GM what can be done in there games. Many would stop things they see as breaking or not in line with how they see things working. So in the end ask your GM.

Yeah you absolutely have to be careful of power creep. Rifts is probably worse than any other system out there. You CAN have balanced games if you work at it, but its too easy to slip into craziness and then you can't manage the actual gameplay.
And you also have to remember: If its so easy for your players so make super powered items easily, why hasn't everyone else done it? Why weren't those items already floating around before in large quantities? Why hasn't a mad scientist or wizard already made such items and used them to take over Rifts Earth by now?
And something everybody KEEPS FORGETTING ALL THE TIME: Everything in rifts earth is already ONE HUNDRED times more powerful than the pre-apocalypse items. A basic laser pistol is one hundred times more damaging than a ballistic pistol. Future body armor is one hundred times stronger than modern body armor. In fact if you cannot do at minimum 100 SDC to a piece of armor or shielding in rifts earth, you do zero damage. Bullets just bounces right off. So do minor explosions. You need something like a bazooka to even scratch the Plastic Man. Though I would roll for impact damage from being tossed around. In fact you can probably kill the dude inside Plastic Man without really damaging it at all. Which is weird but its the system.

[Aermas]

And you also have to remember: If its so easy for your players so make super powered items easily, why hasn't everyone else done it? Why weren't those items already floating around before in large quantities? Why hasn't a mad scientist or wizard already made such items and used them to take over Rifts Earth by now?

Well some people HAVE done so. Heck,t here's a Rifter where a dude made a huge Iron Juggernaut dragon that a TW can pilot. Dominators have such advanced designs no one else can copy them let alone know the line between whether its magic or tech or both. The Megaversal Legion has recoiless I- Beam tech which would make Glitterboys unstoppable if they ever leaked the technology. Etc. Etc.

[ShadowLogan]

And you also have to remember: If its so easy for your players so make super powered items easily, why hasn't everyone else done it? Why weren't those items already floating around before in large quantities? Why hasn't a mad scientist or wizard already made such items and used them to take over Rifts Earth by now?

Well some people HAVE done so. Heck,t here's a Rifter where a dude made a huge Iron Juggernaut dragon that a TW can pilot. Dominators have such advanced designs no one else can copy them let alone know the line between whether its magic or tech or both. The Megaversal Legion has recoiless I- Beam tech which would make Glitterboys unstoppable if they ever leaked the technology. Etc. Etc.

I don't really have a problem with the idea of a piloted Iron Juggernaut. IJs have always been a bit blurry for me in terms of what they actually are, we know there is a "pilot", but the nature of the vehicle is not clear IMHO so you could have "the advantage of secondary operators" (as Scurge put it in TFG1 "Rebirth" episode arc). And I don't think IJs qualify as FCB ("pilot" still retains their entire body), they are supposed to be the equivalent of some type of piloted robot vehicle (it isn't clear if the pilot is "live-in" like a Mechanoid, RT's Invid/Inbit, or PW's Invalin IIRC, or "option" like pretty much every other robot vehicle in Rifts).

Dominators are supposed to be BBEGs. I did some comparison on their Star Fortresses if they had to contend with something from Robotech or Macross 2 (by RAW, 1E and 2E) and it didn't go well for the DSF who had no advantage in terms of range depending on the faction considered (at least for 1E RT and M2, 2E RT was nerfed to be more "friendly" to PW crossovers unlike in 1E IMHO). And don't think bringing the entire DSF fleet's known present size is going to help them, the faction(s) with the easiest time have millions of ships to employ (at their height) vs the couple hundred DSF known to exist and those factions needed a few thousand ships (in other words Dominators would get steamrolled by less than 1% of the available numbers). I'd also point out there hand weapons are for 30ft tall individuals, so few races could use them outside of a robot vehicle (and IMHO some types of platform/weapons tend to get nerfed for "balance") at which point IMHO they aren't all that game breaking (even at the time).

I-Beam tech mounted on Glitterboys would not make them unstoppable. There is nothing to indicate the I-Beam could duplicate the GB's RG-14's performance in terms of range or damage in the required size. The RG-14 has a range of 11k feet IIRC, the only I-Beam weapon with that range is the 120mm TANK cannon (which is IINM something like more than 2x the size of the RG-14's ammo), and to match the damage output requires use of exploding shells for said weapon. Plus there is the issue of compatibility with the I-Beam tech being integrated into the railgun (which IIRC the RG-14 uses exotic materials to achieve the performance it does, which just re-reinforces the issue of compatibility IMHO)

[Aermas]

That's a lot of acronyms.

And if your only argument against stuff like recoiless Glitterboys is "maybe they cant" then I'm not too worried.