My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

For all talk related to Robotech RPG Tactics™. A strategic, tactical board game brought to you by Palladium Books®, Ninja Division® and Harmony Gold®

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Would you like to demo Robotech RPG Tactics?

Yes - anywhere I can get a game happening in public
5
14%
Yes - in game stores and conventions
5
14%
Yes - at conventions
0
No votes
Yes - in game stores
1
3%
Yes - but only privately (friends, family, school, local club)
2
6%
Maybe - (post your queries / thoughts below)
6
17%
No
16
46%
 
Total votes: 35

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Spinachcat
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My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Spinachcat »

My only goal is to promote public play of RTT. Some of the angriest voices in the KS just might become great demo leaders when the game finally comes out because their anger is sometimes, maybe often, actually a sign of their commitment to the game. Many of these upset, angry and maybe even disagreeable people are HUGE fans of Robotech and minis gaming. Palladium needs them.

RTT is not going to demo itself.

AND THE REST OF YOU!!!! Hello you high quality individuals who like to get snippy in RTT threads! I need you to KEEP CALM & ROBOTECH ON! at least during this thread discussing how we as backers can promote the game.

If this thread gets locked, everybody can kiss my Rumpelstiltskin and I'm done trying to help RTT.

DEMO TEAM DISCUSSION!!!


I want to hear your questions, your thoughts, your concerns about doing public demos of RTT. Please ask lots of questions. As a collective, we backers may be able to answer some of them. Some of the answers will need to come from Palladium, but at least we would know what questions to ask.

If you are not a backer, but *MIGHT* buy RTT and *MIGHT* demo the game, please participate too!

Some of us backers are Megaversal Ambassadors. Some of us backers have demo'd other RPGs, CCGs, and board games. Some of us have demo'd minis games like Warhammer or Warmachine at conventions and game stores, we can help with tips. I am asking everyone with demo experience to PLEASE share your experience (good, bad and funny).

KEEP CALM & ROBOTECH ON!!!!
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Alpha 11
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by Alpha 11 »

Yes, please keep it calm. :clown: And no funny business! :clown: Sorry, couldn't help it. And maybe a little laughter will help keep things cool. :D
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by Kryptt »

I was a maybe, but now it's a no. Not worth the time or effort to promote a game for people who think so little of the backers who funded the "dream". If I see someone playing it I'll be more than happy to engage them. But I won't go out of my way to promote RRT. I don't appreciate the way the forums are run and the casual dismissal of backer concerns.
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by McPherson »

Still sticking with a Yes in and around the Midlands area of the United Kingdom.

Already sunk enough time and money into building terrain for the game it'd be a crime to let it sit and rot doing nothing.

Though on the more positive note I did speak to the LGS owner who I mentioned in the past thread regarding RRT and he says when Esdevium posted up as available last month he was going to pick up a few boxes, then got told it wasn't available and is now on the fence again (whoever told Esdevium that it was available needs to reel back their excitement a touch - telling a distributor it'll be there and to put it on their order lists only for it not to be there month(s) afterwards just looks bad - its like getting FFG stock over here, after the second or third try many stores move onto something else)

However (Back on track) he did say that once I get my backer stuff he would like to see it demo'd in the store so here's hoping.

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Re: You @!*# got my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by rosco60559 »

I kept with maybe. More than likely I'll keep with doing demos for friends and the 1 backer I know owns a shop but as for joining the official demo team not too sure. From the sound of things they just get a t-shirt and a slap on the back. If there was more incentive to join the official team I would consider it, but from the looks of things pb's own community doesn't really want anything to do with us war gamers the way rrt topics get moved and locked up. That as I stated in another thread just looks real bad, I might try to get a rrt section opened up at the adeptus windy city site and keep unofficial at least their mods don't gave a hair trigger for the mod hammer and the community there is friendly.
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by NMI »

Kryptt wrote:I was a maybe, but now it's a no. Not worth the time or effort to promote a game for people who think so little of the backers who funded the "dream". If I see someone playing it I'll be more than happy to engage them. But I won't go out of my way to promote RRT. I don't appreciate the way the forums are run and the casual dismissal of backer concerns.

What backer concerns have been dismissed? When noticed by PB staff, they have been responded to. If a concern has gone unanswered and folks bring it up here again, they have their ways of reaching out to Palladium and getting their answers.

1. Snail Mail.
2. Phone [either direct dialing, Skype, Google Voice, etc - the latter two allow for long distance call on the cheap]
3. Email: kickstarter@palladiumbooks.com
4. The kickstarter page itself.
5. PM me and I will be glad to send an email directly to PB staff on your behalf.

As for the how the Forums themselves are run, I am sorry you feel that they are not run to your satisfaction but when individuals break the rules, they will be dealt with accordingly. This is whether they are backers or not. Myself and the rest of the moderation team understand the frustration many of you are feeling around the, let's say "history" of the RRT Kickstarter. I am a backer as well. I am not 100% happy with the delays, but I also know the situation behind the delays somewhat. However, just because one is a backer of the RRT Kickstarter and they are frustrated/upset/confused does not give them free reign to act however they want on Palladium's forums. There is a way to voice ones concerns constructively and then there are those people who insult [directly/indirectly], troll, bait - Palladium Books, PB Staff [mainly Kevin], the moderation team, each other, other forum users, etc] - this is NOT acceptable under any circumstance!

You want to blame the atmosphere of the forums due to the moderation [and some more specifically want to blame it on me directly], well the moderation team would not have to be so heavy handed at times if everyone used a little common sense, courtesy and respect towards one another - including Palladium Books and Staff.

Kryptt - To keep this thread on topic, I would be more then willing to discuss this further with you via PM.

rosco60559 wrote:their mods don't gave a hair trigger for the mod hammer and the community there is friendly.

Perhaps the mods there don't have a hair trigger because the community is friendly or follows the rules?

My offer to Kryptt is extended to you as well. Feel free to reach out to me in a PM to discuss this further.

============================

Spinachat - Sorry for stealing your show, but I wanted to address this post publicly.
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Morgan Vening
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by Morgan Vening »

NMI wrote:
Kryptt wrote:I was a maybe, but now it's a no. Not worth the time or effort to promote a game for people who think so little of the backers who funded the "dream". If I see someone playing it I'll be more than happy to engage them. But I won't go out of my way to promote RRT. I don't appreciate the way the forums are run and the casual dismissal of backer concerns.

What backer concerns have been dismissed? When noticed by PB staff, they have been responded to. If a concern has gone unanswered and folks bring it up here again, they have their ways of reaching out to Palladium and getting their answers.

Seriously? You might as well lock this thread now,or just ban everyone that replies. That is the highest level of nonsense I've seen. And you've set that bar pretty high. I can't see how anyone can accurately respond to your assertion without you feeling it a breach of protocol.

We've finally got an answer (and Email) for the Replacement Policy. That went through the "process" you mentioned, escalated several times by you, personally. It only took 4 months (well, I only see it mentioned as far away as March 25). And if YOU can't get prompt responses (you've 'escalated' things to PB Management on several occasions, for very little response).

Granted, some of the more pertinent information has finally been answered, though the EU VAT situation would be good if there was a better assurance than 'we hope'. And adds a further question, like when will the EU contingent be shipped out? Cause "We’re going to pack up all shipments going to Europe, palletize them, and ship them to their UK warehouse." is going to take a significant amount of time and resources. The fact that they're being "palletized" indicates it's a significant sum. Are these going to be done early, meaning the individual US backers get theirs held back? Or are they going to be last, meaning EU backers have to wait on their two stage shipping, meaning November or later is a more realistic timeframe? Yeah, it's bad for someone either way, but those people have the right to know.

And that's part of the problem. There are any number of obvious questions that have been asked, over and over again. Sure, they aren't psychic. But being a little more proactive with answers would go a long way to smoothing concerns. Or at least prompt responses. Hours is unrealistic, I accept that. Days isn't. Weeks is bad. Months is down right wrong.

But this thread is an example of being proactive. Robotech drops next week, apparently. And there doesn't appear to be any procedure set up for a demo scene, other than the nebulous "It'll be done through the Megaversal Ambassador system.". How about a procedural thing, showing people who are NOT PBForum members a) how you sign up, b) what's expected, c) what resources will be available, like demo setups composition, d) what rewards, if any, the process will provide, even if it's just a robotech "Megaversal Ambassador" shirt.

Similarly, as others have posited, status of Wave two, status of container one, AND container two, are similarly obvious questions that shouldn't need to be asked. But have been, and promptly ignored. And that requiring the taking of it to private communication when they've got several bullhorns at their disposal (here and on Kickstarter), just seems like the least efficient way of dealing with problems.
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by NMI »

Morgan - If a question is not asked, then how can it be ignored? Instead of further derailing this topic, please start a new one. Or if you have questions for Palladium, please use one of the previously mentioned methods of contact.

Although the Megaversal Ambassador Program is running a Demo / Launch program of its own, I do recall that Ninja Division was suppose to also be handling some sort of Convention support of some kind. As they are not members here, perhaps you would like to reach out to them and ask.
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by Seto Kaiba »

Spinachcat wrote:RTT is not going to demo itself.

If you are not a backer, but *MIGHT* buy RTT and *MIGHT* demo the game, please participate too!

's gonna have to out here, because our local stores only carry Palladium's Robotech stuff on a special order basis (and I am routinely the only one who special orders it). Most of the dedicated tabletop gamers I know turned it down for the same reason I did. It's a new entry by a virgin company into a glutted market, with a property that has a profoundly negative reputation among anime fans and gamers alike, and too small a fanbase to sustain its animated series... which means it doesn't have the fan-power to sustain the tabletop game either.

If the game takes off, I might buy a starter set and demo it at my local stores... but only to support Palladium, not Robotech. My vote was still "No" though, because with the backer outrage practically thick enough to cut into blocks, I can't bring myself to predict success for the game.
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by jaymz »

Spoiler:
Spinachcat wrote:My only goal is to promote public play of RTT. Some of the angriest voices in the KS just might become great demo leaders when the game finally comes out because their anger is sometimes, maybe often, actually a sign of their commitment to the game. Many of these upset, angry and maybe even disagreeable people are HUGE fans of Robotech and minis gaming. Palladium needs them.

RTT is not going to demo itself.

AND THE REST OF YOU!!!! Hello you high quality individuals who like to get snippy in RTT threads! I need you to KEEP CALM & ROBOTECH ON! at least during this thread discussing how we as backers can promote the game.

If this thread gets locked, everybody can kiss my Rumpelstiltskin and I'm done trying to help RTT.

DEMO TEAM DISCUSSION!!!


I want to hear your questions, your thoughts, your concerns about doing public demos of RTT. Please ask lots of questions. As a collective, we backers may be able to answer some of them. Some of the answers will need to come from Palladium, but at least we would know what questions to ask.

If you are not a backer, but *MIGHT* buy RTT and *MIGHT* demo the game, please participate too!

Some of us backers are Megaversal Ambassadors. Some of us backers have demo'd other RPGs, CCGs, and board games. Some of us have demo'd minis games like Warhammer or Warmachine at conventions and game stores, we can help with tips. I am asking everyone with demo experience to PLEASE share your experience (good, bad and funny).

KEEP CALM & ROBOTECH ON!!!!



I voted maybe. I may demo it on my own. As for officially. Not likely. Official events will be the domain of the MA program as per last official mention of it that I recall on the KS pages. Unless they drastically change how the company is involved in that program, I won't be involved with it. The concept is good but the company itself is too overextended with other things to really handle it properly in my opinion.
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my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by ZINO »

Yes - anywhere I can get a game happening in public
i am a backer

question can some give more information on this part
VEF-1/VF-1D Valkyrie Pack (total x 3 Miniature ?)
$30.00 Qty: 1

Miniature we are talking about the mechs only and vehicle content only
also how many Miniature do i have in total?
18 Valkyries in all three modes, or total 54 Miniature ?
total 4 Miniature Destroid Tomahawk,
total 4 Miniature Destroid Defender,
2 Miniature Command Destroid Upgrade Kit each , total four Miniature
total 4 Miniature Destroid Spartan,
total 4 Miniature Destroid Phalanx with Experimental Upgrade Kits,
2 Miniature Rick Hunter Valkyrie in all three modes, total 6 Miniature
2 Roy Fokker Valkyrie in all three modes,total 6 Miniature
4 Super Valkyrie in all three modes, total 12 Miniature
total 4 Miniature SF-3A Lancer II Space Fighter,
total 4 Miniature QF-3000 Ghost Fighter,
total 48 Miniature Regult Battlepods, Miniature
total 8 Artillery Battlepods with Experimental Upgrade Kits,
total 4 Miniature Quel-Regult Recon Battlepods,
total 4 Miniature Glaug Officer Battlepods,
total 4 Miniature Quel-Gulnau Recovery Pods,
total 2 Miniature Khyron Glaug Officer Battlepod,
total 2 Miniature Miriya Queadluun-Rau,
total 6 Miniature Gnerl Fighters,
total 6 Miniature Nousjadeul-Ger Male Power Armor with Experimental Upgrades,
total 6 Miniature Queadluun-Rau Female Power Armor with Experimental Upgrades.

this so far 144 Miniature or 196 right ? plus
then ADD-ONS
SF-3A Lancer II (total x 2 Miniature )
$20.00 Qty: 1

Armored Valkyries (total x 4 Miniature )
$20.00 Qty: 2

Destroid Pack (total x4 Miniature )
$20.00 Qty: 1

Command Pack (total x 3 Miniature )
$20.00 Qty: 1

MKII Monster (total x2 Miniature )
$40.00 Qty: 2

Glaug-Eldare
$30.00 Qty: 1 (total x1Miniature )

Spartan Pack (total x4 Miniature )
$20.00 Qty: 1

VEF-1/VF-1D Valkyrie Pack (total x 3? Miniature )
$30.00 Qty: 1

Super Valkyrie Wing (total x 6 Miniature )
$35.00 Qty: 1

Experimental Battloid (total x4 Miniature )
$20.00 Qty: 2



Miniature only that's a total 173 or 225 Miniatures? am i correct please confirm this
after seen what i think i am getting
i decided to get help on this to build and paint the right
so check if my math is right
Last edited by ZINO on Sun Aug 03, 2014 5:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
let your YES be YES and your NO be NO but plz no maybe
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Spinachcat
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Unread post by Spinachcat »

Ladies & Gentlemen, the Megaversal Ambassador program is an extremely loose organization. It's just a collection of people who enjoy running Palladium games in public. That's it. Anyone who wants to join us can join us. However, the Megaversal Ambassador program was set up for running Palladium RPGs...understandably since that's all PB had back then. The main focus of swag was Rifter magazines because the Rifter has lots of articles and usually covers 3-4 different PB games. AKA, an issue can have articles about Rifts, Palladium Fantasy and Nightbane, etc. It's a good gift for RPGers. Not so useful for RTT demos.

Using "official event" with "Megaversal Ambassador" is a marketing push, not any kind of exclusion. If you voted YES to this poll, then jump over to the MA forum and get signed up. It's not about being "official", its about we can do more for each other as a team. Even our semi-organized organization is better if we can have more voices.

The needs of the RPG MAs will be different than the needs of the RTT MAs. There will be some overlap of course. But I have done RPG demos and I've done Warhammer demos (I was an old school Outrider) so there are different challenges and different advantages when doing demos for different genres of games.

For instance, RTT demos need to be quicker.

If you are doing a RTT demo, you need to be able to explain basic rules in less than 5 minutes and more importantly, show them to players in a mock fight. Remember the video during the KS? Show, not tell is your best option.

Also, RTT demos will probably have drop-in players. It's not unusual for RPG demos at conventions to be done via sign ups where X players show to the table committed for 2-4 hours, but its common for Minis demos to be 30-60 minute affairs where people drop by check out the sculpts and see how a basic fight happens.

Remember - there is no more powerful marketing tool for games than Actual Play. The more actual play that occurs, the better the odds are for RTT to succeed. And as KS backers, we need RTT to succeed so we have people to play with in the future.
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Re: my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by NMI »

Rick S. wrote:
Spinachcat wrote:Remember - there is no more powerful marketing tool for games than Actual Play. The more actual play that occurs, the better the odds are for RTT to succeed. And as KS backers, we need RTT to succeed so we have people to play with in the future.



that's why only one game a day was set up for Robotech Tactics at GenCon ? also my game is going in the closet when it arrives.
That may be all that was submitted by fans via the MA program. There will be Demo's being run by Palladium Staff, Freelancers and friends of PB @ the booth as well.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by ingexthefuryhunter1 »

Rick what you seem to want is a game like the old battle tech games where, part role play and part minature play. With a cross over of the two, this will be in the MA section. The demos will have a portion of this but will mostly be shorter versions and more geared to showing the playability and the functionality of the game pieces
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Re: my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by jaymz »

Spinachcat wrote:Using "official event" with "Megaversal Ambassador" is a marketing push, not any kind of exclusion.



That may be Spin, and as I said I may myself do demos and run games, but which is likely to be better perceptionally? Just a guy running games at his local shop or officially sanctioned games that are in part supported and run by representatives appointed/recruited by palladium?

I can tell you what usually goes over better at cons and such and it hasn't been the random guy running a game like this.

I am sure there are many who wont be seen voicing here that they will run games. That it will happen to some degree is not in question. What many want though is games run that have the sanctioning and support of PB. THAT is what has to happen through the MA program. I hope it does and if it does change to the point of being viable for such endeavors I will gladly sign up again.

I've made my opinion of Rifters being swag for RPG events known multiple times. It hasn't changed nor will it. They have no Rifter analog to give for RRT not that I would want that as swag to give the players for a game I am trying to promote.

So to summarize. I might run games. That is all I can offer since I cannot afford to do anything more anymore.
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Re: my DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN

Unread post by Spinachcat »

jaymz wrote:That may be Spin, and as I said I may myself do demos and run games, but which is likely to be better perceptionally? Just a guy running games at his local shop or officially sanctioned games that are in part supported and run by representatives appointed/recruited by palladium?


I agree with you 100%.

Perceptions do matter. That's part of why Zachary the First initiated the Megaversal Ambassador program. Also, the funny thing is that people often think "official / sanctioned" is actually that. When I run RPGA events, its because I am RPGA DM (woot, I passed an open book test!) and if I run a RPGA module (downloaded free), suddenly I get to say "Official RPGA Event" when in actuality WotC has no idea (nor cares) that I am hosting said event. Nobody in the RPGA hierarchy knows about it either, unless we ask for swag. We RPGA DMs are pretty much ronin too. But to players, they get excited by the "official-ness" that our supposedly "sanctioned" events convey.

This is why I encourage anyone who voted YES in these polls to become a MA. I know some of your concerns and I don't disagree with your concerns. You and I are often on the same page. Being a MA is a use of your free time and its unpaid, so the ONLY reason to stay an MA is because its fun for you.

In your case, or in the case of anyone uncomfortable with joining the MAs, you *MAY* be able to strike up a relationship with a local store owner who will provide some kind of coupon for people who play a demo. I've seen that a couple times. AKA, $5 off if you buy the game you demo'd in the next 48 hours.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by jaymz »

That may be a possibility....there is however the other side of the coin here. Palladium is not exactly a "known commodity" anymore as it pertains to gaming. Our work and word of mouth can only do so much.
I am very opinionated. Yes I rub people the wrong way but at the end of the day I just enjoy good hard discussion and will gladly walk away agreeing to not agree :D

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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Maximilian Jenius »

I really hope that what I am about to say is taken not as a negative attack but as suggestive criticism.

What I have heard about organized play the entire time post kickstarter campaign is that the MA program will be handling tournaments, demos, leagues and the like. From what I am reading in this thread there really is no organized plan for how tournaments or leagues will occur. I see no hint of global events anywhere, more like a smattering of unconnected events that may or may not happen based on where an MA may be.

I highly suggest that anyone with any influence take a long hard look at what Privateer Press does for their events. There is a reason they have taken a huge chunk of GWs marketshare in the last decade, and their organized play and their pressganger program are a huge part of that.

If you really want to get people fired up for this game, you need an army of people pushing it in stores everywhere and motivate them to do so. The competition has that, and they are going to be in stores constantly in spiffy PP T-Shirts throwing warmachine demos nonstop, because they get free minis to do so.

It is also important to point out that PP started as a very slim, small company and it was their dedicated fans that grew their profits.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Spinachcat »

Privateer Press is an excellent model to emulate. No question about that.

From what I understood AND I MAY BE 100% WRONG was that Ninja Division originally was going to be involved in more of the tournaments / league / organized play stuff. That's my memory of the initial buzz around the KS. I don't visit the Ninja Division forums so I have no idea if anything is being planned by them.

Anyone know what's up with Ninja Division? Any links to posts from them?
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by NMI »

Spinachcat wrote:Privateer Press is an excellent model to emulate. No question about that.

From what I understood AND I MAY BE 100% WRONG was that Ninja Division originally was going to be involved in more of the tournaments / league / organized play stuff. That's my memory of the initial buzz around the KS. I don't visit the Ninja Division forums so I have no idea if anything is being planned by them.

Anyone know what's up with Ninja Division? Any links to posts from them?

I knew I was not the only person to recall that Ninja Division was supposed to be supporting / running tournament / league play. I just cannot remember where I read it at. On the KS page? Murmur? Press Release?
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Morgan Vening »

NMI wrote:I knew I was not the only person to recall that Ninja Division was supposed to be supporting / running tournament / league play. I just cannot remember where I read it at. On the KS page? Murmur? Press Release?

They were. But as time passed, and as more information came out, just like with the Kickstarter and the game itself, Ninja Division's "partnership" role has gotten less and less. No reason was given, and speculation just degenerates into partisan bickering. All we really know, is that for some reason, ND's participation seems to have shrunk to almost nothing.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by jaymz »

Yeah, there were a KS update or two...and possibly even a Palladium weekly update that stated flat out the tournament and league play would be through the MA program and that ND at best would be an adviser in how to go about doing it but that was about it last I heard on the whole thing.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Forar »

No "possibly" about it. ND's involvement in the organized play was advertised for most of last year in the copy/paste about RRT in the weekly updates and the front page news release.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Warshield73 »

Just restating what I said in the previous forums, for now I am saying yes, but for me support from PB has little to do with it. The only thing that would change this is my ability to paint and build the minis and portable terrain. Since I lasted posted I have been given several links and suggestions for this so hopefully it will just be a question of time.

Not just having enough time to paint them and create terrain (which given that the school year is about to start will be a big problem but also running time. At cons I prefer to run regular RPGs (Rifts, HU2, and Robotech) so this would take at least one game out of the ones I normally run plus set up time. Depending on the rules I might do a few Robotech Macross RPG games with a combat or two done with the minis. Just to show them off.

I plan to run them at the local cons and there are two local gaming shops that I have already talked to that, while they do not carry PB products, are more then happy to have game demos in the stores. Again, my main problem is time. At most I might be able to do one demo every other month with my work schedule. I guess since I have never done minis gaming before (and since I have seen at cons just how...heavily regulated (understatement) another companies "society" is, organized play is just not that important to me.

The good news for me is I have found two other backers near my area that also want to do demos, but they do not come to these forums.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by jaymz »

Warshield, PM if you want some simple buildings and such. All you need is a colour printer, card stock, and some glue sticks :D
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Warshield73 »

jaymz wrote:Warshield, PM if you want some simple buildings and such. All you need is a colour printer, card stock, and some glue sticks :D

Thanks, I have a ton of those now. One of the things I got from people after my post on the previous thread.
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Unread post by jaymz »

Okey dokey :ok:
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Lord Malachdrim »

Maybe - It will depend on if I buy the game. I missed the kickstarter and I really want to pick this up but I'm becoming increasingly concerned that certain (left blank) are going to kill the game with their incessant whining and thinks like the lets "Robotech Take Over" kickstarter nonsense of theirs.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Warshield73 »

Lord Malachdrim wrote:Maybe - It will depend on if I buy the game. I missed the kickstarter and I really want to pick this up but I'm becoming increasingly concerned that certain (left blank) are going to kill the game with their incessant whining and thinks like the lets "Robotech Take Over" kickstarter nonsense of theirs.

I agree and this is actually a huge problem. It took me an hour at a with a manager of a gaming store last month to cut through all the nonsense he had heard and just get him to look at the RRT stuff. One of his workers even thought PB was going out of business because the stole all the KS money. This guy Simpson does this youtube show called gamers on games where implied PB had stolen all the money and it seems to have gotten around quick.

The unhappiness is one thing and I get it to some extent, but some of the rest of this is really destructive.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Warshield73 »

Rick S. wrote:
Warshield73 wrote:
Lord Malachdrim wrote:Maybe - It will depend on if I buy the game. I missed the kickstarter and I really want to pick this up but I'm becoming increasingly concerned that certain (left blank) are going to kill the game with their incessant whining and thinks like the lets "Robotech Take Over" kickstarter nonsense of theirs.

I agree and this is actually a huge problem. It took me an hour at a with a manager of a gaming store last month to cut through all the nonsense he had heard and just get him to look at the RRT stuff. One of his workers even thought PB was going out of business because the stole all the KS money. This guy Simpson does this youtube show called gamers on games where implied PB had stolen all the money and it seems to have gotten around quick.

The unhappiness is one thing and I get it to some extent, but some of the rest of this is really destructive.



and yet PB keeps doing things to throw roadblocks in their way like breaking their word to backers and selling at GenCon before backers get their product.

We are not criticizing that, perfectly valid criticism even though I disagree. Unless you are saying this excuses lying about criminal behavior not at all what we are talking about.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Kryptt »

Warshield73 wrote:
Rick S. wrote:
Warshield73 wrote:
Lord Malachdrim wrote:Maybe - It will depend on if I buy the game. I missed the kickstarter and I really want to pick this up but I'm becoming increasingly concerned that certain (left blank) are going to kill the game with their incessant whining and thinks like the lets "Robotech Take Over" kickstarter nonsense of theirs.

I agree and this is actually a huge problem. It took me an hour at a with a manager of a gaming store last month to cut through all the nonsense he had heard and just get him to look at the RRT stuff. One of his workers even thought PB was going out of business because the stole all the KS money. This guy Simpson does this youtube show called gamers on games where implied PB had stolen all the money and it seems to have gotten around quick.

The unhappiness is one thing and I get it to some extent, but some of the rest of this is really destructive.



and yet PB keeps doing things to throw roadblocks in their way like breaking their word to backers and selling at GenCon before backers get their product.

We are not criticizing that, perfectly valid criticism even though I disagree. Unless you are saying this excuses lying about criminal behavior not at all what we are talking about.


Don't forget that the demo guys don't even know the rules to RRT. Although I heard that's being worked on. If this game makes it it'll be a miracle despite all the roadblocks put by PB, HG, ND. I know there doing there best to give a great game but it's problem after problem with this project. The models on the rdf side look so so (just look at the F and G mode of the iconic vf-1). I won't be able to tell till I get mine and maybe make an unboxing video.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by MurderCityDisciple »

Oh boy,

The demonstration team doesn't even have the rules yet?

Have they even been seriously playtested?

Especially-
Playtested by experienced mini-gamers who are going to rip these rules to shreds if they suck?

How's it going to look if the demo-team doesn't know the rules and are unsure of them when demo-ing?
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Phaze »

The demonstration team doesn't even have the rules yet?

Have they even been seriously playtested?

Especially-
Playtested by experienced mini-gamers who are going to rip these rules to shreds if they suck?

How's it going to look if the demo-team doesn't know the rules and are unsure of them when demo-ing?


I believe the 'Demo' team (Palladium) has the rules...Its the MAs, such as myself and one other, that do not have a good set of rules to play from. What I have is remembered from last GENCON, specific questions I have asked, and what I read from the rules used last GENCON. I've been told it is close but not exact. I will have to wait until Wednesday (GENCON) to get a copy to play with. I have played it and its a good game, but we shall see what the final set of rules do.

As for the reason the MAs that are running Tactics games don't have the rules...I will let others chime in, for it is not my place to speak to that.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Forar »

I sure hope they're getting the rules before then, even a few days early. I can't imagine it'd make a very good impression if people who are sitting down at event games will look very kindly on the experience if the person running the demo has to constantly refer back to the document they were given, or have to make it up on the fly.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by MurderCityDisciple »

Nothing is more off putting than playing a game where the person running it is unsure of themselves and the rules.

Having your questions answered with, 'Uhm's' and 'Ahhh's', followed by them thumbing through the rulebook is just bad form on all fronts.
I've been in RPG game's (and not just Palladium one's) where this kind of hamfisted GMing has taken place.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by MurderCityDisciple »

Phaze wrote:
The demonstration team doesn't even have the rules yet?

Have they even been seriously playtested?

Especially-
Playtested by experienced mini-gamers who are going to rip these rules to shreds if they suck?

How's it going to look if the demo-team doesn't know the rules and are unsure of them when demo-ing?


I believe the 'Demo' team (Palladium) has the rules...Its the MAs, such as myself and one other, that do not have a good set of rules to play from. What I have is remembered from last GENCON, specific questions I have asked, and what I read from the rules used last GENCON. I've been told it is close but not exact. I will have to wait until Wednesday (GENCON) to get a copy to play with. I have played it and its a good game, but we shall see what the final set of rules do.

As for the reason the MAs that are running Tactics games don't have the rules...I will let others chime in, for it is not my place to speak to that.


What's to keep MA's from just totally houseruling RRT?

Or even using the RPG rules instead of the miniature rules that they aren't sure of?

Since the MA's aren't officially official they can do anything they want...correct?
(isn't somebody already doing just this anyway? Using the Megaversal system with mini's as game pieces)

And since this game is supposed to be attached to the Robotech RPG and it's being played/demo'd in the RPG room, what could it hurt?

I would be interested in using/demoing/playing the mini's with the tried and true Megaversal RPG rules fer sure. I can't stand the tedious measuring, movement phases and all that. Loosey Goosey ruled, mecha smashing fun is more to my taste.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by yanko128 »

MurderCityDisciple wrote:...

I would be interested in using/demoing/playing the mini's with the tried and true Megaversal RPG rules fer sure. I can't stand the tedious measuring, movement phases and all that. Loosey Goosey ruled, mecha smashing fun is more to my taste.


Loosey Goosey is all well and good in an RPG, where it is a co-op game. Loosey Goosey will kill any wargamer's interest in the game, as war games are by nature competitive. If you want mecha smashing fun, you do not need rules for it. If you want a successful wargame (which is what RTT is) you must play it by the rules. And if those rules are ****, no matter how good the minis look, the game will be still born.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Phaze »

And since this game is supposed to be attached to the Robotech RPG and it's being played/demo'd in the RPG room, what could it hurt?



Yes we could, but we would be loosing sight of the end game...to promote RPG Tactics. I am doing this to help the game, not (only) to go smashing mechs. If I wanted to smash mechs, I would still be playing old school Battletech with the 'Unseen'.

I am an MA to promote this game because I want it to succeed. Playing different rules would cloud the issue and do a disservice to the game.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by MurderCityDisciple »

So there's no oversight or quality control with the MA's so one could be a total turd (not naming names, but I've been in 2 or 3 gawd awful Palladium con games, they handed out Rifters, so I think they were MA's) or even worse a anti-Palladium saboteur.

I know other companies keep a close watch on who's promoting there product, I guess Palladium really doesn't care about that stuff.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Spinachcat »

MurderCityDisciple wrote:How's it going to look if the demo-team doesn't know the rules and are unsure of them when demo-ing?


Anyone who is demo'ing RTT at GenCon has the rules and minis. There is no reason for any concern about that. I understand that Carmen Bellaire was involved in all the rules development and he will be leading/doing lots of the GenCon demos. I fully trust Carmen to do a great job. I don't know who else is doing RTT at GenCon.

Everyone else who wants to demo RTT in the future will have read the rules too. Anyone who takes the time to buy the minis (either through the KS or GenCon or retail in the future), then takes the time to build and paint them, will most likely be somebody interested enough to learn the rules. And then, even more likely that anyone who wants to demo the game (as a MA or not) will be somebody who will be ready to teach the game.

THIS THREAD is here to help anyone interested in doing demos IN THE FUTURE once we have our minis. The first step obviously is to get the minis, then to build them, then to paint them and learn the ruleset. That's gonna be a few months at least for everybody, but once people are ready to rock, then we can help with How To Demo Ideas.

And yes, it is VERY important for anyone demo'ing the game to (a) really understand how the game plays and (b) be comfortable and capable to explain the rules to others quickly and in an engaging manner (aka - show, don't tell).
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Spinachcat »

MurderCityDisciple wrote:I know other companies keep a close watch on who's promoting there product,


Actually, loose orgs for demos is the norm today. Most companies don't have the manpower to support their demo teams, let alone monitor their behavior. Back in the 90s when there was more money in the hobby, you saw some companies like GW asking the demo teams to have participants fill out survey sheets and feedback cards. THAT was a disaster as people started sending fake feedback because you got more swag if your "participants" said you did a good job.

Pathfinder Society is having trouble right now because of the tightness in their org. The end result is going to be more freedom and maybe less swag. We will see. In GW's case, the result was implosion and then rebirth with a near total focus on tournaments.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by MurderCityDisciple »

Yeah those Pathfinder guys are nutso. I went to a little con recently and I think they ran at least 70% of the games there. I'm talking over a dozen. They seemed to have their schtuff together too. Battlemats, sweet pre-gens, dice towers, and so on.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by jaymz »

Spinachcat - actually the MAs do not have the finalized rules of the game. Unless they got them yesterday. This is from an MA, a significant one at that, that will be running games at gencon. The rules they do have are old demo rules. Also they do not have minis. They may get acces to the blue table ones but as of right now they do not have any.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Forar »

I'd be surprised if they used the Blue Table Painting minis for games. I imagine those'll be locked in a case for display.

Natural wear and tear of heavy use for hours on end at a demo table would probably rub off some of the luster (figuratively and literally).

They've had figures on hand to demo with before, I imagine they'll use those, plus other plastic figures (test and otherwise) that are prepped and ready for table time.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Kryptt »

jaymz wrote:Spinachcat - actually the MAs do not have the finalized rules of the game. Unless they got them yesterday. This is from an MA, a significant one at that, that will be running games at gencon. The rules they do have are old demo rules. Also they do not have minis. They may get acces to the blue table ones but as of right now they do not have any.


This deal is getting worse all the time. So are they supposed to use paper standins? Maybe they can use the fantasy paper standins to sell RRT for the success of the game. Talk about poor planning. TT gamers aren't as laid back as RPG gamers who at times fudge the rules. If I go from one state to another I expect to play the same game of RRT. Instead it looks like it's going to be promoted as an RPG supplement and not a TT game. How is this for the success of the game? People wake up and see that it's a cash grab. Understandable but it breaks the spirit of the ks.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Seto Kaiba »

Kryptt wrote:This deal is getting worse all the time. So are they supposed to use paper standins? Maybe they can use the fantasy paper standins to sell RRT for the success of the game. Talk about poor planning. TT gamers aren't as laid back as RPG gamers who at times fudge the rules.

Considering tabletop gamers are usually as much about the miniatures as about the game itself, not having the demo players playing with production miniatures (and well-painted, well-assembled ones at that) will make the demo a real non-starter with its intended audience.
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Phaze »

People...Relax.

As a MA that is running games at Gencon for RRT, I will have actual production minis to use. I was informed that they are being painted by artists for the sole purpose of MA games at cons and I get to choose my units on the day of battle from a large pool, and that I may also have access to Phase II prototypes as well, meaning I could drop a monster on the board. The 'Demo' Team for Palladium, of course, will have their own minis. I am not using MY minis, because I, like all of the Kickstarter supporters, may not get them in time.

As far as rules go...I will not be fumbling through a rule book in order to teach or play this game, it delays the game and any pause in the action is a moment of distraction. I will only need to pull out the book to clarify a point of contention for the understanding of the players, not to learn the rules myself. If I thought for a moment that I couldn't get six people to leave the table at the end of a game with a smile and memories of a good game, I wouldn't be doing this.

Yes, it is true I don't have an actual book in hand or a digital copy of the rules (yet), but I have been assured that the rule set I have been using is close to the final product and I am not worried. The MA coordinators are working hard to get me a digital copy of the rule set prior to next Wednesday, but even if that falls through and I don't get it till Wednesday, I will be prepared. Should I have a question of the ruleset, I will also have the assistance of one of the Palladium staff members or MA Coordinators in that area to assist. Thats a BENEFIT to having all of the Palladium Games in one area, RPG or not.

This is a stand alone miniature combat game...not a supplement. I am running 3 RPG Tactics Games and one RPG game in a series only to show how they CAN be used together. They do not have to be.

Everyone....breath. The sky is not falling. I am going to GENCON and everyone playing my games should have a KICK@@@ time playing Robotech with other fans.
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I'll still enjoy watching you get blown off the table while you stare in helpless wonder at Phaze's marching legions of colored perfection. -- Godsgopher
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Phaze
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Phaze »

hope none of your players are real miniature players Phaze since they will have their own copy of the rules (if PB sells RRT at GenCon)and thumbed thru and read them real quick, and will be quick to point out problems, which you will encounter since there are 2 major changes to rules 1.0 in version 1.5 but i'll let you find that one out.

Also i'm curious whats your plan if nobody attends the games? just curious cause I saw a posting on another site of someone trying to find someone who wants their RRT game tickets (and not successfully at that), seems whoever set the times on your games, didn't bother to see what else was running at that time. but hey who am I? no one.


OMG...Its like talking to EEYORE.

I hope they are mini players, beacuse I AM too and they can give good honest assessment of the game, that I can get them excited about it, that we can find common ground by mech bustin'. I've played mini wargames since...chainmail...the original...before D&D. I think I can handle it.

If no one attends? lol... It sold out in two hours after posting. Ok, devils advocate, if those people bought tickets in protest to block it out, or just can't unload them, them I have a line of people (just that I know...in my little corner of the US) that would love to jump in for two generics. Now this is a con that is 50,000 people strong...the largest con in INDIANAPOLIS history, surely I could find willing 'test subjects' that don't feel as you do on a moments notice. And if all else fails, I, yes I, will still have a good time because I will challenge the staff to a game of smash up on my New Game Table with my two college aged boys beside me.

BRING EM ON! :D

(Damn, did I just throw the gaunlet down on the Palladium staff?) :?
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I'll still enjoy watching you get blown off the table while you stare in helpless wonder at Phaze's marching legions of colored perfection. -- Godsgopher
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Forar
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Forar »

Phaze wrote:Yes, it is true I don't have an actual book in hand or a digital copy of the rules (yet), but I have been assured that the rule set I have been using is close to the final product and I am not worried.


Are you using the playtest rules dated May 2013, or a more recent revision?
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Kendachi
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Re: My DEMO TEAM thread locked? LET'S TRY AGAIN!!!!

Unread post by Kendachi »

Rick S. wrote:hope none of your players are real miniature players Phaze since they will have their own copy of the rules (if PB sells RRT at GenCon)and thumbed thru and read them real quick, and will be quick to point out problems, which you will encounter since there are 2 major changes to rules 1.0 in version 1.5 but i'll let you find that one out.


Uhm... where'd you get some rules from? I've seen the May 2013 play test rules and nothing else.

1.5? What are you talking about?
"If a question is not asked, then how can it be ignored?" - NMI

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"Robotech RPG Tactics, the game, will be at Gen Con. For sale. In quantity. There's not much question about that." - Wayne
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