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Some people build vast adventures, some people craft intricate global histories. i give crud guns to people and make them shoot brodkil until they're ready to do my helping farmers with their pigs adventure. excuse my shotty lineart, my scanner doesn't cooperate with anything.

Chipwell armaments

The weapons line from Chipwell armaments, Known for their substandard features and rock-bottom prices share a reputation for being less powerful, accurate and durable than every other product on the market. This hasn't served to harm their sales, however. The reason? Chipwell knows their market- security agencies and local militias who never work far from their base of operations and statistically rarely engage in firefights over 600 feet on foot can count on support instead of requiring the firepower to deal with most bandit gangs, raiders, and roaming monsters in each soldier's hands as well as having a ready source of replacement E-clips and maintenance.
Chipwell took ready advantage of these facts, providing a line of weapons that make compromises in areas those forces didn't need so they can afford to equip more of their forces for less cash. Many of the internal components are actually SDC materials, sealed inside a cheaply mass-produced casing! As a result the light ballistic plastic weapons are less durable than most MDC and lack many of the common features most adventurers want from a weapon, but Chipwell weapons provide reasonable stopping power at a low-affordable cost, which ensures that thousands are sold yearly. Chipwell weapons are also the only brand not knocked off by black markets (they'd have to retool their own weapon lines to produce worse components, which would cost them more than the weapons would earn!) and are instead resold from shipments stolen or acquired elsewhere to turn a profit.
Chipwell has frequent discounts available for bulk weapon orders, and their weapons are available in white, black, grey, and tan, with custom coloring of the weapon casings & installation of sights, scope railings, and brackets for carrying straps can be added on for a small fee (normally 200-500, more for rush orders or the rare high-traffic periods) on location in their Merctown and Ishempeg outlet locations. Note: All Chipwell weapons have less MDC due to their cheap plastic casings (4-12 MDC per weapon, compared to the 10-30 of most brands) and many don't even have any form of sighting built into the simple ballistic plastic casing by default (-2 to hit past 1000 feet and halve all aimed shot bonuses unless a sighting system is installed)

Min-Eclips:Designed to exploit the design of their weapons, Chipwell has created a miniature E-clip. roughly the size of a flip-top lighter, the Min-Eclip is half the capacity and a third the size of a normal E-clip and fits cleanly into the shallow slots of Chipwell energy weapons. The underside is fitted with a gripping rubberized cover to make it easy to remove and prevent sliding around when not in use. Min-Eclips retail for 3000 credits, and most retailers will recharge them for around 1000 credits. Note: the Min-Eclips are a poor fit in competing products, and they have a 01-40% chance of getting jammed in most e-clip ports when shoved in there! The jam can't be cleared in combat, and takes 2D6 minutes to clear with basic tools. Many stores won't recharge them if they think it will jam in their recharging system (about 1-20% chance)

Chipwell lasers: Lasers were the obvious choice for Chipwell Armaments to enter the weapons market, as they're reliable, simple to build, and inexpensive for an MDC weapon. With this in mind chipwell's design team focused on "trimming the fat" to build a line of laser weapons that any village could afford to supply their guards with. Chipwell's laser weapons are built with focusing elements and capacitors generally considered unsuitable for use as weapons- limiting their range, energy efficiency and rate of fire and their casings are cut out of pre-molded plastic forms which helps them save money on molded components and has become chipwell's signature image.

CLW-500 laser rifle
The flagship weapon of Chipwell's laser lineup, the CLW-500 (along with the CLW-100) was the very first personal weapon released for sale by Chipwell. The weapon is designed to be easy to handle and load while remaining viable to use in urban areas with its bullpup design and has seen steady sales from minor kingdoms and various security groups.
(Note: This is the rifle depicted on page 144 of Rifts Mercenaries)
Weight: 10 Lbs.
Range: 1100 ft.
Mega-damage: 2D6 MDC per shot
Rate of fire: Single shot only
Payload: 14 shots from a regular E-Clip, 24 shots from a long E-Clip
Cost: 14,100 credits

CLW-100 laser pistol
This ultra-small laser pistol by Chipwell can boast being one of the smallest laser pistols on the market. Unfortunately it accomplishes this by cutting the barrel down to half an inch(14mm)! The result is that the the Chipwell 100 laser pistol is out-ranged by most SDC firearms! As a bonus, this means it can be drawn from the holster faster than most other weapons and readily concealed if needed, but very few people willingly use them as more than emergency weapons- although some city rats and criminals have grown fond of it when trying to sneak weapons past security checkpoints. Because of the rear-loading design and lack of any balance, the CLW-100 suffers from a -2 to hit when using a long E-clip.
Weight: 2lb
Range: 120 ft.
Mega-damage: 1D6 MDC per shot
Rate of fire: Single shot only
Payload: 12 shots from a regular e-clip, 24 from a long E-clip
Bonus: +5% to conceal an unloaded weapon (or loaded with a Min-Eclip), +2 to initiative when starting a combat round when no-one has their weapons drawn.
Cost: 4,000 credits

CLW-170 heavy laser pistol
Some of the first responses for the weapons was that the laser pistol needed more "heft", and that the range and balance was inferior. Chipwell rapidly addressed these issues and produced the -170 for clients that needed a more reliable weapon. moving the e-clip to a front-loading profile let them give the barrel some length, they also managed to reliably improve the basic damage. While over twice the cost of the CLW-100, Chipwell has giving a half off on the price of one with every dozen -100 models bought, which has seen it adopted by many police forces for their ranking officers.
Weight: 4 lbs.
Range: 400 ft.
Mega-damage: 1D6+3 MDC per shot
Rate of fire: single shot only
Payload: 10 shots from a regular E-clip, 21 from a long E-clip
Cost: 9,000 credits

CLW-1000 laser sniper
The highest quality energy weapon produced by Chipwell, the CLW-1000 laser rifle was made to function as a support weapon, intended for watchtowers and other vantage points. This is the only weapon they chose to outsource key components (Wilk's) in to ensure the weapon was up to the demands required of it, and even comes with a passive night-vision and laser targeting installed! Even so, the weapon's overall range is only average compared to other products on the market.
Weight: 10 lbs.
Range: 1900 ft.
Mega-damage: 3D6+3 MDC per shot
Rate of fire: Single shot only
Payload: 11 shots from a regular E-clip, 21 shots from a long e-clip
Bonus: night-vision scope and laser targeting provides +1 to hit, additional +1 on aimed shots
Cost: 39,700 credits

Chipwell "Power Beam" ion weapons
Seeking to address a demand for inexpensive weapons with good stopping power, Chipwell arms hired a weapons designer that came to them with designs for a series of ion weapons (Actually, they were rejected designs that had been stolen from northern gun). Chipwell's weapons team developed a cost effective way to produce the designs and marketed them as their "Power beam" line of weapons. Unfortunately for Chipwell, the sales teams shortened the tagline to "P-Beam", causing serious backlash from several buyers who had believed they were buying particle beam weapons which has made the ion weapons very unpopular with most prospective customers via word of mouth. (Note: Northern Gun is aware Chipwell has unwittingly put their old plans into production. The heavy backlash from the release of the weapons has kept them from confronting Chipwell, fearing it may hurt the northern gun reputation to claim the designs.)

Chipwell's Ion weapons are heavy and short ranged compared to other brands, but have reasonable stopping power and payloads. Their worst feature hoever is that the guns exposed barrels aren't insulated, meaning they heat up to dangerous levels (3D6 SDC for 1D4 rounds after firing) during normal use making them a safety hazard! Chipwell hasn't made this a great secret, but doesn't drawn any attention to the issue either as resolving the issue would hike up the cost of the weapon.

CIW-700 ion carbine
The CIW-700 is actually a fairly middle of the road ion weapon, dealing good damage at a largely reasonable range. The weapon's distinctive chrome forward housing is actually the exposed barrel of the weapon (Chipwell was never able to resolve heating issues inside of the frame and simply added an internal air-cooling sleeve and a warning not to touch the barrel after firing). The weapon is slowly finding a market both in militias and adventurers who like the "chrome" look.
Weight: 14 lbs.
Range: 700 feet
Mega-damage: 4D6 MDC per shot
Rate of fire: Single shot only
Payload: 10 shots from an standard e-clip, 20 from a long e-clip
Cost: 22,000 credits

CIW-600 ion pistol
Chipwell's pistol counterpart to their Ion carbine, the CIW-600 has proven massively unpopular. Not only suffering the initial marking problems, the weapon is heavy and prone to serious heat issues. Chipwell's ion pistol is known more for burning the holster than stopping power and can cause serious burns if one forgets about the heat (P.P. test of 12 to avoid a burn after combat). Chipwell's response to these complaints has been to issue several refunds and to sell all ion pistols with an insulated holster made of MDC plastic and a safety guide going forward, but it's very likely the weapon's days on the market are numbered.
Weight: 5 lbs.
Range: 200 feet
Mega-damage: 3D6 MDC per shot
Rate of fire: Single shot only
Payload: 11 shots from a standard e-clip, 21 from a long e-clip
Cost: 7,500 credits

Chipwell "manstopper" Conventional firearms.
After the publicity disaster of the "power beam" weapons, Chipwell scrambled for something to help recover their image. Desperate, they took on a D'norr devilman merchant (Chipwell normally only hires humans) calling himself Marty Keys. Keys, a fairly competent hobbyist gunsmith, had aquired a collection of pre-rifts weapons blueprints and believed he could adapt them to give Chipwell an efficient line of SDC weapons for security teams guarding normal prisoners.
The response to these weapons has been beyond anything Chipwell expected, with the new "man-stopper" line of weapons quickly gaining a reputation for both high quality and heavy durability (all Chipwell gun casings are cut from the same ballistic plastic molds, meaning these weapons are MDC structures) and the company is looking into expanding the lineup as well as considering a series of SDC hunting weapons. Chipwell has secured an agreement with wellington industries to provide ammunition for their weapons, rather than produce ammo themselves and major Chipwell outlets now have a selection of heavy weapons from the Manistique imperium.

CBW-45 pistol
A basic semiautomatic, the -45 is based off old pre-rifts police sidearms and is a reliable weapon. While the accuracy is limited from the lack of sights, few of the law enforcement officers this is marketed for complain.
Weight: 2 lbs.
Range: 160 ft
Damage: 4D6 SDC per shot
Rate of fire: single shot, or in bursts
Payload: .45 caliber rounds, 8 round magazine
Cost: 800 credits. a box of 100 rounds is 42 credits and separate magazines are 5 credits each.

CBW-5-56 "submachine gun" assault rifle
Chipwell's sales team mistook this for a submachine gun in their initial advertising release, but it's very obviously an assault rifle to anyone inspecting the weapon in spite of the compact bullpup design. This hasn't hurt sales in any noticeable way, and the design is picking up in popularity for forces that need weapon that will leave SDC targets recognizable thanks to its rate of fire and easy to handle design. There has been a somewhat outspoken demand for the addition of an underbarrel railing, and Chipwell has announced plans to develop an viable solution.
Weight: 7 lbs.
Range: 1300 ft
Damage: 3D6 SDC per shot, or 6D6 for a three round burst
Rate of fire: single shot or in bursts
Payload: 5.56 rifle caliber rounds, 30-round magazine standard. 40 round magazine available.
Cost: 1600 credits. a box of 100 rounds is 50 credits and separate magazines are 5-6 credits each.

CBW-12-G shotgun
Chipwell's 12-G models is a semiautomatic Shotgun design capable of both hunting and defense, something Chipwell's marketing team initially failed to consider. Demand has found the weapon regardless and Chipwell is rolling out a "woodsman" model with a camo-pattern casing, expanded forward grip and front sighting to appease the requests for a pre-made design
Weight: 6 lbs.
Range: 200 ft.
Damage: 4D6 slug ammunition or 3D6 buckshot or (buckshot provides +2 to hit) Both shells can be silver-plated for 1-3 credits each to inflict full Hit point damage to vulnerable monsters.
Rate of fire: single shots. A short three round burst can be attempted at -2 to hit.
Payload: 12-gauge shells, 10-shell or 20-shell magazine
Cost: 1100 credits, plus 700 for the "woodsman" package. a box of 50 shells is 25 credits and the magazines are 5-6 credits each

CBW-14-5 support machinegun
A heavy machinegun the design team modified to fire 14.5 caliber to match their Assault Suit powered armor's weapon, Chipwell's design actually uses MDC metals to prevent wear and make it a man-portable design. The design even comes standard with a targeting scope and has a bipod stand built into the frame (the legs slide out of the front casing and lock into place). Chipwell intended for the weapon to only be deployed in fortifications, but it can be used two-handed by power-armored troops or cyborgs (users without an enhanced Strength of 20 or more suffer -6 when using without bracing it against a stable flat surface and can only fire wild). Chipwell's support machinegun hasn't been the success the rest of their "man-stopper" line was and is only finding sales slowly.
Weight: 68 Lbs.
Range: 5000 ft
Damage: conventional ammmo deals 1D4 x 10 +10 SDC per single shot, or 1D4 x 100 SDC (1D4 MDC!) for a 20 round burst. high yield explosive deals 1D4 MDc per single shot, or 5D6 MDC for a 20-round burst
Rate of fire: single fire, or in bursts.
Payload: standard is a 200-round belt that weighs 45 lbs, 3000-round ammo drums
(10 MDC) are also available available for 25 credits, weights 4 lbs or 455 lbs. fully loaded!
Bonus: Targeting Sight provides +1 to hit
Cost: 11,000 credits. a 200 round belt of conventional rounds is 140 credits while a loaded ammo drum of conventional rounds is 1,635 credits. a 200 round belt of explosive rounds is 3030 credits while a loaded ammo drum of explosive rounds is 45,025 credits!

Watchman body armor
Looking to improve sales in poorer markets where power armor sees little penetration, Chipwell looked towards developing a durable, cost-friendly set of MDC armor, and settled on this design. Their Watchman armor is made of MDC fabric backing a series of overlapping ceramic plates, and provides excellent protection for its cost. The ceramic plates can even be removed for easy replacement and Chipwell offers a generous recycling program as part of their extended service package!
The problem with the armor is that it's loud, heavy and non-environmental. while the helmet has a filter to limit the danger of smoke the ceramic plates weigh down the wearer much more than other comparable armors and worse, they constantly scrape together announcing the armor's location. These problems are minor for guards at detention centers or checkpoints, but adventurers and patrolling police forces can't stand the noise. Juicers and crazies won't touch it with a 50-foot pole! While the armor has found its niche, it's not likely to become a smash hit.
MDC: by location
Helmet: 15
Arms: 12
Legs: 23
Main body: 40
Weight: 23 lbs.
Good mobility but loud: -10% athletics, -35% prowl!
Bonus: Helmet features polarized lenses and a filtered mask. A short range radio can be added for 2000 credits.
Cost: 15,000 credits

I like it. it feels post apocalyptic and home built, not unlike the gun markets of Pakistan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FinRqCocwGE

I like it; it helps build Chipwell's image as the BudgetArms/DaiLung of Palladium Rifts.
The big companies(canon and fanon) have to see these cheap weapons being bought up by the truckload and wonder how low they can/dare cut their own prices to capture market-share, while not feeling tempted to cut corners and diminish reliability or safety.

I don't know how they'll manage that, i designed these entirely with cutting corners everywhere i could find them! Even the weapon casings are rounded off!

Thanks guys, glad to know people like them.

You ever play R.Talsorian's Cyberpunk? The weapons in that system have Reliability ratings. UR(UnReliable) means the weapon jams or explodes on you on a critical fumble. And they got these 3D-printed vendor guns called Polymer One-Shots(preloaded clip, and can't be reloaded) which tend to melt if you fire them too fast.
And the low-end cheap-o arm manufacturers actually create polymer machine pistols or heavy caliber guns, some of which make Chipwell look like Colt for reliability.
Fun that is.

But if you really wanted to make DANGEROUSLY cheap armaments for Rifts, transpose some of the unreliability factor to energy weapons.
E-Clips that spontaneously combust like bad lithium batteries.
Rail Guns that mis-synch the firing sequence of the accelerators, and either fall short of stated range and damage, or wobble the projectile into the barrel walls, ripping out the innards and destroying the gun.
Ion weapons that leak electrical shock or create a nice halo effect around the user, painting them for return fire.
Wilks-knockoffs with plastic housings that warp and leak, allowing corrosion to set in.
Particle Beam weapons that irradiate the user.
Plasma weapons that overheat.

I like these a lot , plus there helping round out an npc i been working on. So i must say well done.

What book were the ManStoppers in? You think there is a market for aftermarket support?

The SDC weapons are actually rebuilds of some pre-existing weapons (and probably trademark infringements, some guy found the blueprints in a guy's safehouse he dug up) that suffer from some losses to effective range from Chipwell rebuilding the designs to fit in their stock plastic casings. the exception is the Machinegun, which i upped the caliber to fit the weapons in chipwell's existing products. how does it do it? MDC components instead of the SDC kind to take the strain.

They're all rebranded for the RIFT setting, they're in that big book of guns, whatever it's called. i can look up the exact models that got poached if you like. as for support i'm pretty sure chipwell is the type of company happy to provide parts and service for a reasonable fee but feel free to go nuts anyways! rifts is not the best place for tracking where your nearest approved part depot is after all. wherever there's someone that's just a little too far to get approved repairs there's a buck to be made.

"You want us to ship spare parts WHERE?! I'm sorry, sir, but you place me in the quandary state of wanting to close a sale and advising you that the shipping bill is very much more than the actual value of the parts you request."

What is the name of the Big Book of Guns?

my friend's compendium of contemporary weapons; but i've renamed them all for chipwell's lineup since they were slightly rebuilt.

As an aside, has anyone toyed with the idea of licensed manufacturers, different corporations making the same "big brand products" but with slight (or not so slight) degrees of difference in reliability, quality of some minor features or identifiable quirks, that might in a bit of a good name or infamy, in their games? Some are essentially extensions of the big name, others might be seen as silent partners who could try to take off on their own in different circunstances - and a bunch are "Banditos with a seal of approval" at most, for good & for ill.

It's something i have considered since i first read on the many arms groups in Mercenaries. Also, a return of Mazda Corporation as an answer to Angrar Robotics.

Damn shame my current game is set in the Magic Zone.

There's also the related 'badge engineering', where a company acquires rights to an older, often defunct, product line(and its tooling) and makes a few updates(or cosmetic changes), slaps their logo and name on it, and sells it as something new...or an older, more prestigious, but declining, company sells license to a smaller company to put the logo of the bigger company on its own, often proven to be inferior, products, hoping that the name and prestige will drum up sales. Happens a lot in car marketing.

Good that you brought that up - have you toyed with that kind of thing in your games, like with Wilks' laser-deflective armor, an Iron Heart Wastelander Motorcycle, Chipwell laser tools set or other such products for your players to gamble on purchasing?

i don't know that the arms market is large enough for companies to do that sort of thing, but i'm starting to wonder if any of the companies have exploited the lax ability to enforce trademark to sell "less than competitve" equipment from faulty product runs under rival branding to undercut them in markets they haven't managed to gain a strong foothold in yet....

Not examples like those, but I've hinted in my Three Galaxies campaigns that it's far more common a practice in the more organized areas of space, where often style overrules substance.
WZTTechyards(which I've inherited from Darkmax, engages in a more benevolent form of it, buying up old larger defunct companies and their facilities for a song, and upgrading their products. Paladin Steel/Aegis Stellar Industries to a lesser extent absorbs some older and smaller companies that have fallen by the wayside, secured their patents, and produced newer versions of the better old classic products, and uses its dimensional trade network to sell the stuff in new markets.

I imagine Triax does/allows some of it in Europe. Older non-strategic designs, especially of vehicles or lower powered weapons(WaffenTech comes to mind), get farmed out to local allies like Poland, drumming up jobs, giving the lower and middle classes access to cheap transport and building the economy...so the better-off locals can spend their new money on fancier, more modern imports from the NGR.

Generally, in our own world, badge engineering is seen in a more negative light(though perfectly legal, it strikes many as dishonest), as people buying what they think is a shiny new Bentley design, instead find themselves driving a platform using tech from the '70s or '80s, produced by a second-tier auto company that simply remodeled the exterior.


As Orin notes, however, the marketplace on Rifts Earth is generally too small for the sort of horse/nag-trading that typifies badge engineering in our own world. There's a certain threshold that products have to WORK at, and companies selling blatantly defective or misrepresented products risk running into survivors, corporate hit teams, or killers who ARE smart enough to ask what the red button does.

Yes, a setting as large as the 3Gs makes far more sense for this kind of business shenanigans to go on. Though a Rifts character of mine did get involved with some of this - after he managed to become through a number of circunstances a minor shareholder in Naruni Enterprises - as part of a strategy of his to get around the whole mess with the CS and its allies. In fact he had to do quite the balancing act, as he wanted NE's resources to advance his own agenda of rebuilding civilization through commerce and industry, while sparing Rifts Earth of being turned into a NE possesion through debt discharge and any other such shenanigans.



That is partly something my character ended up doing, getting outdated machinery and other resources NE had no more use for leased to communities in Rifts in exchange for free access to certain cyclical rifts or nexus and some other arrangements, assuring NE access to hundreds of dimensions to make business upon, sometimes much larger markets than the nations of North America, while keeping their hands (mostly) clean and away of local vicissitudes and CS interference.



Makes sense - in my game i barely scratched the surface of this kind of business underhandedness, that is more Cyberpunk's stories part & parcel, i guess.

Actually, the Black Market also seems to do it a lot, with their 'generic' weapons which may go under several different brand names, but are all the same weapon under the tricked-out frame. Though technically this goes a bit beyond what constitutes 'true' badge-engineering.

Have to take a good long read on Black Market one of those days. Looks like i'm missing quite some fun stuff.

Oh yeah....Being an agent of the BM can be FUN. Getting OUT of it, potentially more so.

More so with the dignified company of business brands like Highwayman Vehicles, Rogue Tools & Outlaw Armor.

There is at least three or more companies that are releasing old designs under their own brand. Two of them are in books, two are on these very forums.

In New West it lists revolvers but not brands for them, so someone is making and selling those.

Btw, I can't figure out which weapon listed in the first two posts is which weapon from the "Big Book of Guns", so I don't know what kind of aftermarket support to offer.

Must admit i wouldn't know, as i'm not much into the "upgrade late 20th century/early 21st century hardware with MDC materials" line of military vehicles, though i can see the practical appeal.

it's implied in one of the merc books that there's a bunch of small companies doing that with guns, but GAW is the only one retrofitting full-on vintage army machines. so there's probably a bunch of pre-rifts SDC weapons out there being made both with the original maker's loges and new logos, it's just they're all one-house outfits.

as for the man-stopper origin guns, the pistol is a colt 45, the rifle's an einfield L-85, the shotgun's a bernadelli B4 (with a disaster of a 10-round mag that is in a gun magazine i saw), and the machinegun is an abomination of an HK 21A1 and like two other support weapons which i could only justify not flying apart by saying "oh it's made of MDC components" and honestly i'd be surprised if anyone even considered providing support for the thing besides Chipwell themselves.

That said, retrofitting vehicles like that always made far more sense to me. You upgrade the armor & frame with MDC materials and most of the work is done, at least from the point of view of people wanting to survive with the tin can in a battlefield.

But guns - you don't just turn then into MDC weapons by making MDC materials' bullets, a lot more stuff goes in actually enhancing their power. Though i admit my memory on how Mercenaries adresses this or not is spotty, to say the least, at the moment.

SDC still works for a lot of things, so that's probably why they're getting made. and there's MDC explosive rounds for some calibers of rifle, and those ramjet things but i don't know they can be fired from just any gun.

I think something went pear-shaped with the quote boxes in your last post Orin.



Yeah, you do have a good point on that, this kind of guns and stopgap solutions in the same kind of communities or niches Chipwell frequently fits itself into.

Mercenaries p.103 states a couple of times that ramjet/explosive rounds allow cheap or normal sdc guns to be mega-damage capable, without any mention of having to change anything else about the gun.

L85? Really? I hope it's the L85A2, the design that was actually put together by people who cared if the weapon worked.

I was thinking the weapon was a AKS-74U or HK53, because those get called SMGs fairly often for carbines or assault rifles.

-

CBW-45 pistol isn't going to sell well in The New West when Jasper Munitions is a thing.

Link to old site I found this from.

Sure, it can be the -A2, i just cribbed the stats as a base so it can be whichever sub-model you need. they all got stripped down for those cheap Chipwell casings anyways.

Also Chipwell isn't producing these for the private market first from how i read their stuff, they market to small governments and companies where they need a lot of "acceptable" firearms for cheap. The new west's gunslingers are probably not their target market.especially considering these Chipwell guns don't even have iron sights on them by default....

How do they work if they don't got iron-sights? Laser? You use them as a touch attack weapon?

point barrel in direction of enemy, and fire. you might've noticed there's a bunch of aiming penalties for chipwell guns listed in the beginning, it's because the case is just smooth plastic unless you pay them to add some kind of sighting rails.

If the weapons are MDC, I think my people can mill sights and rails into them.

Yeah, i'm sure lots of places would be able to refit chipwell's guns although i'd expect a premium to be charged since it's not something i'd expect the company to officially approve.

So who wants some stun guns?

Electrostun tasers.

While the neural mace is the de facto riot control weapon of the coalition, attempts were made to design a ranged method of non-lethal incapacitation for enforcement purposes. Rejected due to being useless for the military was the creation of army engineer Boris Chipwell, who had taken the plans with him when he retired active duty. He soon revisited his designs after founding Chipwell Armaments, seeing an unmet demand for weapons that would allow for nonlethal incapacitation both among small law enforcement forces and traveling bounty hunters. the Electrostun taser bolts inflict a small amount of tissue damage but also deliver a similar nerve-scrambling charge to humans and most D-Bees who are unprotected (MDC creatures and people in fully sealed environmental armor are unaffected) which makes them safe to use even in large crowds. Unlike some designs, Chipwell's tasers fire energy bolts instead of wires or shell cartridges ensuring that these weapons will be reliable even if supply lines become unsafe, which is a great boon to prisons built in remote locations.

CES-330 Taser gun
Built into a rifle configuration, the -330 electrostun taser is aimed at detention facilities, bounty hunters, and security where range is more of a factor for success. Both the taser gun and taser pistol feature an exposed contact pad at the front of the weapon that allows the weapon to be used to physically deliver the stun directly to reduce drain on the E-clip's payload and this allows the -330 some measure of distance when delivering additional stuns. Sales have been good since their release, and the Coalition has quietly purchased a small supply for equipping the ISS in the higher levels of their mega-cities to ensure no VIPs are injured in any scuffles (and to ensure any suspected traitors are brought in alive for interrogation).

The CES-330 is also installed in a riot-dispersal variant of the Chipwell Assault suit labeled the CAS-32 Peacekeeper suit. The taser replaces the Wilk's laser on this model, while the machinegun is replaced by a belt-fed grenade launcher typically supplied with tear gas. A loudspeaker and additional thermal sensors complete this design.

Weight: 6 lb
Range: 400 ft. or by contact
Damage: 2D6 SDC, and must save against the taser bolt (an nonlethal poison, 16 or better) or have their speed reduced by half and -6 to strike, parry, and dodge for 1D6 melee rounds. Ranged blasts sacrifice some power, and targets have a +2 to save against these. Skills requiring fine motor skills suffer -80% penalty while stunned.
Rate of fire: One stun blast for each melee attack, ranged or contact.
Payload: 22 blasts from a regular e-clip, 44 from a long E-clip. It takes four contact stuns to equal a stun-blast charge
Bonus: Even if the they successfully save, the charge causes the target to suffer -2 to strike, parry, and dodge for 1D6 melees. Each additional charge extends the penalties an additional 1D6 melees (and forces another save to resist full penalties).

Cost: 9000 credits

CES-310 taser pistol
Based on the original Chipwell designs, the -310 electrostun taser pistol is a light, efficient weapon advertised as suitable for all law enforcement, security, and personal defense purposes. However, its limited range has caused a number of law enforcement groups to pass over it and Chipwell is reviewing the design for a way to rectify this matter before competitors beat them to cornering the non-lethal sidearms market they see as the keystone of the line.
Weight: 2lb
Range: 40 ft.
Damage: 1D6 SDC, and must save against the taser bolt (an nonlethal poison, 16 or better) or have their speed reduced by half and -6 to strike, parry, and dodge for 1D6 melee rounds. Ranged blasts sacrifice some power, and targets have a +4 to save against these. Skills requiring fine motor skills suffer -80% penalty while stunned.

Rate of fire: One stun-blast for each melee attack, ranged or contact
Payload: 18 blasts per standard e-clip, not designed to hold long e-clips. It takes four contact stuns to equal a stun-blast charge.
Bonus: Even if the they successfully save, the charge causes the target to suffer -2 to strike, parry, and dodge for 1D6 melees. Each additional charge extends the penalties an additional 1D6 melees (and forces another save to resist full penalties.)

Cost: 3000 credits

Electrostun baton
Offered as an alternative to the taser, Chipwell also provides a bulky stun baton as an inexpensive form of non-lethal self defense. The collapsible baton has an integrated battery that uses the same charging system as the batteries in their power armor line for logistical streamlining, but the 18" baton itself is an SDC structure and unsuited for use in actual combat (22 SDC, but if more than 8 SDC is sustained, the baron will fail to deliver a charge 1-60% of the time).
Weight: 3 lbs
Damage: 1D4 SDC, and must save against the taser bolt (an nonlethal poison, 16 or better) or have their speed reduced by half and -6 to strike, parry, and dodge for 1D6 melee rounds. Skills requiring fine motor skills suffer -80% penalty while stunned. Note that the baton isn't durable enough for any bonus damage for strength to apply.
Payload: The baton can generate about 30+1D6 stun charges fully charged.
Bonus: Even if they successfully save, the charge causes the target to suffer -2 to strike, parry, and dodge for 1D6 melees. Each additional charge extends the penalties an additonal 1D6 melees (and forces another save to resist the effects.)

Cost: 1200 credits. Demand is much lower than hoped, and Chipwell is looking to push this device into the personal defense market by giving it a visual facelift. The planned redesign will weigh 2 pounds and only carry 12+1D6 charged on a smaller battery that can be charged from most conventional power outlets, but Chipwell is looking for a fashion designer willing to partner with them on the design before announcing development which has unexpectedly halted progress.

Something that crossed my mind that might or not help with the reliability of the Electrostun baton shock feature would be to have multiple smaller batteries instead of just one - kind of like the SNK would try to circunvent their chipset production limitations with multiple 8-bit processors in the old Neo Geo videogame of the 90s.

When whole - if designed and built right, two whole steps for Chipwell to hit or miss, if the concept is sound in the first place - it produces the same power as the original through the batteries combined force, but in case of damage in combat, might maintain the lesser charge instead of complete failure due to some "spare" or other still working.

Maybe even make each section detachable for quick replacement - or add a retractable connecting cord between them, for a "shock garrote/nunchaku" combo of sorts.

"Don't tase me, bro."

Though I was expecting a higher incidence of accidental electrocution from Chipwell products. Faulty power regulation.

This thread reminds me of something I was going to incorporate into Rifts. Chipwell's level of technology and quality control aren't quite up to making robot vehicles, but it would be very good for regular trucks / hover vehicles / motorcycles. I was going to introduce a line of heavy SDC / light MD vehicles under the brand name "CTS," which stood for Chipwell Truck Series, and enjoy a good reputation within their niche. These would be the vehicles you see around a frontier town that are basic, but dependable. Chipwell deliberately chose to market them under the CTS name to separate them their robot vehicles' reputation.

"It's Chipwell, it's, kind of good, for the price range at least."

chipwell's stuff isn't poorly made, it's just very, VERY cheaply made. in a field where cheaply made usually means you pay a lot more down the road. they have good engineers apparantly, they just run on the "store brand soda" mentality where if they replace the expensive parts with cheap stuff that's "just as good" lots of people won't be picky enough to care.



Man, that's a great idea and i wish i thought of it. but i draw my ideas first and stat them after the fact, and i can't draw cars and stuff for crap. ready-built technicals and patrol cars would totally be a Chipwell thing though you should play with that.

I'm checking what the Golden Age Weaponsmith handguns go for and where they sell them, and I find the CBW-45 pistol to be completely noncompetitive.

A bit more of my head-cannon....

Chipwell sells foremost to things like militas and and small kingdoms, in large bulk-orders. The manstopper line is to provide them with a selection of SDC options to fill out their needs as a one-stop matter. If quality is the concern, shop elsewhere! If your budget needs the help, come to chipwell!

i wouldn't advise anyone in their right mind to shop for chipwell as a private purchaser. that's not their market.

Well, i don't like double posting, but i hope you'll forgive me.

Support weapon/micro-power plant
Nuclear power is a part of everyday life in the post-Rifts world, and a side effect of this is that nuclear waste in the form of spent fuel is a common problem. Chipwell chose to see these byproducts as a resource, developing a way of extracting the most viable material from the spent fuel they recovered servicing the nuclear plants of their robots to power a tiny, low-yield plant they offered as an inexpensive way to charge e-clips and batteries for their power armors. Northern gun almost immediately knocked off the technology, as they saw the potential of the micro-power plant and quickly produced their own model targeted at providing power for heavy support weapons and other military purposes. Chipwell quickly found themselves almost forced out of the same market they'd created as northern gun outstripped them in sales (Northern gun having the advantage both in reputation and having much more material to produce plants to meet demand) before they had time to adapt their own production model to the market! Recently, Wilk's has also started producing their own small energy plants to meet demands in the west for compact a source of power.

The micro-power plant weighs around 45 pounds and generates roughly as much energy as two e-clips every melee round- sufficient to power most support weapons, a variety of vital electronics, or simply provide a emergency power supply and typically have a conventional electrical outlet and two couplings for energy weapon cables (350 credits, 6MDC per 4-foot cable). The micro-plant has a reclaimed fuel pill that is good for roughly 1-2 years (longer if the micro-plant is only lightly used, such as as a backup generator) and can be refurbished an estimated 10-15 (9 + 1D6) times (at 40% of the cost of a plant) before material fatigue makes the system unreliable. Note these are not a substitute for the nuclear power plants in power armors, and generate only a small fraction of the energy power armor needs. If the micro-power plant is destroyed, the safety lining is ruptured and the fuel starts leaking dangerous levels of radiation over a 12-foot radius! The micro-plants are not meant to be transported during use, and have braces built into the frame that are meant to be bolted into place, through a few borg warriors have been known to attach them to a framework that can be hooked into place like a spare ammo drum. Each Micro-power plant sells for 350,000 credits, and features vary by manufacturer.

Northern Gun's Support weapon micro-plant weighs 55 pounds, has 60 MDC, and features an emergency self-destruct code in case the position is overrun that causes the micro-plant's internal components to fuse and renders it irreparable, although it isn't able to damage the protective lining and cause damage outside of itself. This model comes with adapters to allow a number of types of E-Clips to be charged in the support weapon ports including Coalition, Triax and Wilk's models. Additional adapters can be purchased for 45 credits each. This model is the most popular, especially with mercenary outfits and buyers looking for a way to power fixed defensive emplacements.

Wilk's Micro-energy plant has 40 MDC and features a dedicated Wilk's E-Clip recharge port, several additional electrical sockets, a digital readout showing the exact power supply and draw for manual regulation, and a "hibernation" option that locks the nuclear system into low-output. It also has an optional adapter for connecting to a local power grid via the weapon couplings, 2,500 credits. Wilk's model is popular in the west for powering remote homesteads and as an emergency power plant for medical and engineering facilities, as well as traveling operators.

Chipwell's Mini nuclear generator has two additional electrical outlets, only a single weapon coupling, 25 MDC, and a large power connector designed to be used either to connect to a power grid directly, or to a Chipwell E-clip charger array. Chipwell's model serves mostly as the choice for corporations looking to outfit their security with power for their weapons and batteries, as Chipwell charger arrays vary from a small 2-clip model to models that can charge 24 E-clips and 14 electrical batteries at once! (Note: charging an E-Clip takes a minimum of 15 minutes, 24-hour electrical batteries an hour. Each additional E-clip after the first two the Micro plant services slows the recharging rate by an comparable amount I.E. four clips would only take a half-hour, ten would take over three hours) Chipwell charger systems cost 10,000 credits for a two-slot E-Clip charger, plus an additional 2000 for each additional pair of E-clip Ports or 4000 for each pair of electrical battery ports and can be connected to any conventional power generator.

I appreciate your inclusion of the NG and Wilks power systems for comparison. Helps emphasize the 'cheap but good enough' aspect of your design and marketing strategy.

Thanks! I usually let the existing products handle the comparisons, but....er, sorta produced an entirely new item this time and needed something to contrast. I'll try not to invent new product concepts in the future.....

The non-chipwell stuff was actually done first on this trying to sort out what to make it look like, then it got retooled to fit other company design lines. And given the nature of it i figured that NG would leap at the income to be had from reclaiming useful material from servicing their own products and they'd probably dominate the market by reputation alone. traveling adventurers probably need a mobile powerplant for when they have an electrical engine and keep running into towns that can't charge it, right? just slap this in the trunk and plug it in overnight.

Aww, i gotta double post again.....

Chipwell support weapons
Chipwell's primary product line is inexpensive robots and power armor, and one of the ways they cut back on overhead is limiting how many weapons are built into the armors. Most chipwell robots are intended to carry their primary weapons like rifles rather than have them installed into the robot, which allows them to forgo powerful and expensive power generators instead of simple electrical batteries. Chipwell's line of robot-sized energy weapons are sized for the 9+ foot robots, and run on their own bank of E-Clips with features including a standard handguard that protects against the weapon being dropped from a fall or impact and a diagnostic port that can be used to integrate the weapons with nuclear-powered robots or laser targeting systems. Their partnership with Wellington Industries includes offering Wellington's heavy weapons as well and many customers prefer Wellington's guns for their firepower when arming a Chipwell robot or power armor, which ultimately drives sales and support contracts for both companies.
One unexpected drawback (in chipwell's eyes) is the weapons have found popularity across the midwest with giant-sized monsters and D-Bees who otherwise use slapped-together robot salvage or excessively expensive "custom builds" for a weapon their size. Chipwell's robot weapons have a comfortable grip and an easy to load bay for E-clips instead of having to fumble with tiny E-clip receivers which is difficult for giant hands. Chipwell refuses to willingly sell to D-Bees and won't provide the robot-sized weapons if they suspect any of them will end up in the hands of monsters, but the black market has taken to buying the inexpensive weapons in bulk through "reputable" shell companies, replacing the plastic cases with metal plating, and selling them at a hefty markup. Chipwell suspects this is part of a plot to embarass them by rivals and make the coalition suspect them of sympathizing with non-humans. None of this is currently true, but the people running Chipwell believe it is and are looking for proof regardless. (Black market "knock-offs" will have 25-40 MDC metal plating compared to the 14-20 MDC plastic cases, a sight/scope rail like conventional rifles and a spiked handguard that adds 1D6 Mega-damage when used by creatures with supernatural strength to punch/bash. Adds 5 pounds and at least 20% to the full price, usually 40-60% even with demand is low. The black market is often able to get them wholesale, so this is surprisingly profitable)
Chipwell also provides the robot weapons in a tripod-mount "support weapon" design for mounting at static fortifications or on vehichles. These are less popular but still see good enough sales that Chipwell offers them "on order" at most locations. Chipwell markets these weapons to be used with a seperate miniature power plant to reduce logistics overhead, but they also retain the E-clip connections as a backup source of energy. (note: connecting the weapon to an external power supply does not charge any E-clips loaded into them.) Chipwell offers installation of sighting rails and a 50 MDC armored shield (8000 credits) to protect the weapon and gunner for tripod-mount designs.


CLW-S 1200 tribarrel laser
Chipwell's early intentions were to offer a pulse laser weapon with high volume of fire to supply with their robots using multiple firing chambers to reduce wear like a minigun. Unfortunately there was simply no way to accomplish this cost-effectively and the design's scope was pulled back. Ultimately, they produced a multiple-barrel laser rifle that cycles the three barrels at a rate of fire that resembles pulsing. The weapon has the advantage that it's able to use larger firing chambers to give the CLW 1200 good range for Chipwell's weapons cheaply without compromising the weapon's performance elsewhere.
Both configurations of the weapon can be manually adjusted to fire a number of barrels to fine-tune the damage output, through a dial on the controls of the support weapon or under the grip of the giant rifle model. This doubles as an effective safety for the weapon for use during parades or training, as the dial was given a 0 setting. the 0 setting actually causes the barrel to rotate slightly to pull the lasers offline, and someone familiar with Chipwell's weapons can spot this with a successful use of the relevant detect weapon quality skill. The tribarrel laser rifle is popular as a support weapon among militas and larger D-bees as a light service rifle thanks to having good range and damage in an easy to use platform.
(Note: this is the rifle depicted in the hand of the warmonger armor on page 145 of Rifts Mercenaries)
Weight: 32 lbs
Range: 2200 feet
Mega-damage: 2D6 for a single shot blast, 4D6 for a double blast, and 6D6 for a full triple blast.
Rate of fire: one melee action per blast for any firing mode
Payload: 11 blasts for a short E-clip, 21 For a long E-clip. Loads three E-clips in an internal bay under the rear panel.
Cost: Both rifle and tripod configurations cost 36,000 credits, plus Chipwell offers on-site installation of integrated laser targeting for another 5000 credits.

CIW-S 1700 Heavy ion blaster
Developed as part of the "power beam" line of weapons, the CIW-1700 support Ion blaster had a delayed development cycle which let it avoid the debacle of the earlier marketing snafu, and only a small handful of locations where the the Power Beam line was popular market it as part of that line. The Heavy Ion blaster offers a high damage option for Chipwell's robots, but suffers from the other Issues Chipwell's Ion weapons have, including limited range and poor energy efficiency. Because the support mount reuses the controls build for the 1200 support laser, it also has an 0 setting as an effective safety switch.

The Heavy Ion blaster also suffers from the issue of the barrel becoming dangerously overheated, to the point that touching the chromed barrel of the Heavy Ion blaster for 1D4 rounds after firing will inflict 3D6x10 SDC to anyone touching it, and even mega-damage creatures will sustain 1MD if touching it with exposed skin! Firing the weapon even causes a visible shimmering effect from the heat coming off the barrel and both configurations of the weapon have clear warnings on the weapon. The heavy Ion blaster is mostly bought by detention centers for mega-damage prisoners, traveling forces in need of a quick damage dealer for a personal robot and to evil monsters through the black market. Brodkil love the bulky weapons and even think the overheating barrel is a fun perk!

Weight: 28 lbs.
Range: 900 feet
Mega-damage: 1D4 x 10 MDC
Rate of fire: One blast per melee action
Payload: 4 shots for a short E-clip, 8 for a long E-clip. Loads three E-clips in an internal bay under the rear panel.
Cost: Both rifle and tripod configurations cost 32,000 credits, plus Chipwell offers on-site installation of integrated laser targeting for another 5000 credits.

CML-300 Multi-Missile launcher
Easily the most expensive of Chipwell's support weapons line, the CML-300 is essentially two missile launchers strapped into a single frame. Unlike the launchers from competitors, Chipwell's system dead-fires the missiles using a very rudimentary laser targeting system (+1 to hit, 1000 foot effective range)instead of a proper targeting system. As a result, the missiles do not get their usual bonuses to hit (+3) and suffer from the same aiming penalties other Chipwell weapons have! The launcher was a matter of some friction between Chipwell and Wellington industries, and Chipwell grudgingly agreed to restrict sales locations as part of their agreement (something the black market has capitalized on, to both company's frustration).
The Launch system is designed to be hand-fed, with an internal arming system locking the barrels until the missile is fired but a special magazine is designed for the weapon (12 MDC)that carries two separate feeds for the two launchers and reloads the barrel feeds automatically. The tripod configuration suffers from a very limited field of view and can only be used right handed, as the controls have to be mounted on the left side of the launcher to avoid the exhaust vents while the rifle configuration's triggers are small and difficult to use (must roll robot piloting successfully when firing a single missile or fire both tube accidentally) but the launcher can be tied into the robot's combat computer to activate the missiles. (Note: Chipwell robots do not have a combat computer sufficient to lock the missiles onto the target and the separate system must still be purchased for bonuses.) The loading system, additional laser targeting, and any additional targeting computer are all powered by one of Chipwell's electrical batteries (48hours continuous use, 36 if a targeting computer is added) The weapon is selling well so far, mostly near the pecos empire where Chipwell is providing sales to towns attempting to stay free of their control. The black market has knocked-off this design and supplies it illegally in Merctown, Ishempeg and other cities Chipwell agreed not to provide the weapon in, something Chipwell and Wellington industries tries to clamp down on.

Weight: 70 lbs. plus 12 lbs. for a loaded magazine.
Range: About a mile.
Mega-damage: By missile, usually armed with Fragmentation (5D6 MDC, 20ft radius), or Armor-piercing (1D4 x10 MDC, 3 ft. radius)
Rate of fire: One or two missiles per melee attack. Hand loading the launcher takes an additional action to load each tube, and anyone standing by the weapon's exhaust vents will take 1D4 x 10 SDC damage from each missile fired. Replacing the magazine takes two melee rounds, and can be performed with the robot's hands.
Payload: A loaded magazine contains five rounds for each missile tube in separate compartments, for a total of ten rounds. The Launcher can be hot-loaded with two more mini-missiles before attaching the magazine for a maximum load of 12 Mini-missiles total. While each compartment can be loaded with a different type of missile, this is not recommended by Chipwell.
Cost: Both rifle and tripod configurations cost 67,000 credits unloaded, Plus an additional 4000 credits for integrating a complete targeting computer (supplied by Wilk's) to regain the missile bonuses. Poor availability, and not available legally in merctown. Additional magazines are 600 credits unloaded with mini-missiles usually costing 900 (fragmentary) to 2000 (armor piercing) each, through a separate distributor.

CHMG-S 100 Heavy machinegun
The original model lost to the opening of the rifts, this heavy 14.5 caliber anti-aircraft machinegun was briefly used against flying supernatural foes by the forces that would become the coalition before being phased out for their lack of firepower. They had shared the blueprints with a number of nearby towns in those early years, however and the design has circulated throughout North America since. Chipwell resurrected the design in an extremely cut-down model (over 70% of the barrel was cut) as an oversized rifle as part of their opening product line, both because of the low cost and long range of the weapon and the minor detail that their energy weapons production would not be ready in time.
The weapon fires explosive cartridges recently developed by wellington industries to provide suitable stopping potential, and uses an electric system for loading the ammunition with an electrical battery supplying enough power for 20,000 rounds. Note: this is an entirely different design from the CBW-14-5 infantry support gun, and the reduced barrel caused it to lose the majority of its range as well as making it extremely unstable. Firing the weapon without an enhanced P.S. of 20 or more means the weapon can only be fired wild with an additional -10 to strike.
Weight: 30 lbs.
Range: 2000 ft.
Mega-damage: Loaded with explosive munitions, a burst is 40 rounds and inflicts 5D6 MD. a single round does 1D4 MD.
Rate of fire: standard
Payload: Drum magazine is 800 rounds, that's 20 bursts. changing the drum magazine takes one melee round. The larger, 3000 round drum Chipwell makes is not designed for this model, but can be adapted for it (clips are installed into the side of the gun) and takes four melee rounds to thread the feed into the machinegun.
Cost: Only available in a rifle configuration, 12,000 credits, 24,000 fully loaded. Additional magazines of explosive rounds cost 12,040 credits. integrated laser targeting usually not offered unless requested. Provided with the Chipwell Assault Suit (including two magazines) as part of the robot's cost. Generally not popular outside of a few enthusiasts due to the cost of ammunition, Chipwell continues to produce them as a default weapon to supply their robots with.

~~~~~~~
Annnd that's it! I think this is a fairly complete run of weapons for Chipwell so i'll end my developing there. after those powerplants, i figured they needed support weapons and this let me provide their robots with some additional bang at the same time instead of producing a bunch of extra robots. Their existing line is pretty complete for their job anyways. Hope ya like 'em!

How far goes Chipwell's catalog in the area of armor? "Normal" ones, full enviroment or not, not power armor, that i know they have dipped into.

not including the one o packed into the first post, i believe they've been mentioned as producing their own line version of the armors in the core rifts books, although i forget exactly which ones it is. i wonder who first made those armor designs....

If we are talking of "general/vanilla" models like Urban Warrior, Plastic Man, Huntsman & Bushman, that have no owner afaik, probably lost in time or spread all around the place by a mix of helpful operators and enterpreuning black marketeers eager to do knock-offs.

Hmm, if Chipwell is capable of producing those i imagine they could certainly try some quick & dirty stopgap "upgrades" to cover face from some of their power armor debacles of the past, like replace their usual "plates & rivets" scheme with a inexpensive light weight polycarbonate plate full enviroment protection modeled in the good, old Plastic-Man.

As an aside, i would say the Watchman might not exactly be a great sell, considering that a Plastic-Man is only a little more expensive (about the price of adding a radio feature in cost difference) but offers more homogenous protection, lighter weight and better mobility/stealth.

Sure, they could make them better- but that defeats the purpose of making something in the price range of people that can't afford those expensive Northern gun models!

I suspect you might've missed the point of the Watchman. it's not cheaper to buy, it's cheaper to maintain in bulk- the average traveling scholar may not care that the random patch jobs make their huntsman armor look a four-year old painted it but any business will. and the watchman lets them replace a few plates, sell the refuse back to Chipwell and have the same set of armor on the same soldier front and center within a day. it also means Chipwell Armaments is a regular visit of their materials team.....

(This all means i made an armor for the exact purpose of equipping NPCs to let the players make called shots and get out of dodge in a pinch. )