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 Post subject: Rules clarification..
Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 2:31 pm
  

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Comment: Also known as: Lonnie Langston
Does magic attacks (Spells and Spell like abilities) automatically bypass A.R.? Wouldn't they still need a D20 roll to see if they bypass A.R.? (Even though they may have a set # needed to dodge.)

Thanks, I just don't have my books with me and I needed to know.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 2:53 pm
  

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Hmm, I can't find anywhere in the book that this problem is addressed, but I would think those spells that have strike rolls and/or can be dodged would be affected normally by armor. Spells that never miss such as Call Lightning probaby strike the target rather than the armor, unless the armor provides full body coverage and is made of materials that won't conduct the damaging energy to the wearer. Non-damaging spells would generally ignore armor entirely, affecting the mind or some other property of the target.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 2:53 pm
  

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I believe if it has a direct effect (like a lightning bolt, fireball, etc.) then the rolol needs to be higher than the A.R., otherwise, no.


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Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 3:00 pm
  

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Comment: Also known as: Lonnie Langston
Thanks, I figured something like Energy Bolt or Fireball needed to roll to penetrate the A.R., but may have a set # (an 18 for EBolt) to dodge the attack. I was basically making them roll to penetrate, not strike.

Thanks again.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:07 pm
  

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Is anyone else creeped out by this question? In all the years of gaming, have I never had this situation come up?

I guess we've always had spells with strike rolls.... Haven't played many magic users since ~1994 or so when I quit Rifts.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 7:52 pm
  

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Actually, I think I have. All these were addressed in a Rifter, and rather nicely, in some ways. It also included hazards for wearing armor and trying to cast spells, which came out rather nicely.

Among other things, though, it seemed as though a spell requiring a roll to strike did, indeed, need to bypass the armor's AR. If it didn't bypass the AR, it would impact upon the armor. Or miss, if it was a 4 or something.
Now, I also remember rules stating just how much armor could be penetrated by direct effect magic and psionics. Basically, a mage of psionic in full enviromental MDC armor can't use hir magic or psionics on anybody outside the armor without removing it, but nor can those outside the armor directly effect hir. In short, if it's hermetically sealed, none of your spells can get through to the inside. (Although you can certainly effect the armor all you want, just can't teleport into it or enchant the wearer.)
If there are exceptions to this, it will probably be listed in the spell, I guess.

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Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2004 1:22 pm
  

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If it states that the attack "can only be dodged" then I'd say it automatically ignores AR.

If it states "roll to strike," I'd say it is self explanitory. Anything else, I'd say use your judgement.

Life Drain (for example), affects you regardless of your AR.

Fire Bolt (for example) will hit if it is not (successfully) dodged (roll to strike at +4), and will hit YOU if the roll is over your armour's AR, or toast your armour if not.

Fire Ball automatically damages you, if you don't dodge, regardless of your AR (but if you're wearing environmental armour, YOU are safe, your armour on the other hand... :D ).

For anything else, go by the spell description and/or use common sense. :D

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Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2004 7:27 pm
  

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I e-mailed Rodney Scott this question some time ago. His response was spells like
Fireball which require a dodge of 18 or higher, means the spell has an 18 to
strike. So any NAR or artifical armor is automatically by-passed if its AR is under 18.
However, if the NAR was 19, then it wouldn't do anything. So spells like Firebolt
which have a +4 to strike, means you roll the dice and add +4. Normal rules for
NAR apply. Call Ligthning (depending on which one) usually says dodge on a
natural 20 dice roll or on 24 with modified, bonuses. So this means it has a 24 to
strike. It was really greatful to learn this because it helped solve some major issues
my players were having with spell magic.


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Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2004 7:40 pm
  

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Reagren Wright wrote:
I e-mailed Rodney Scott this question some time ago. His response was spells like
Fireball which require a dodge of 18 or higher, means the spell has an 18 to
strike. So any NAR or artifical armor is automatically by-passed if its AR is under 18.
However, if the NAR was 19, then it wouldn't do anything. So spells like Firebolt
which have a +4 to strike, means you roll the dice and add +4. Normal rules for
NAR apply. Call Ligthning (depending on which one) usually says dodge on a
natural 20 dice roll or on 24 with modified, bonuses. So this means it has a 24 to
strike. It was really greatful to learn this because it helped solve some major issues
my players were having with spell magic.


Yeah - that's basically the answer I got when I E-Mailed palladium about this very issue years ago.

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Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2004 10:30 pm
  

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Cardiac wrote:
Reagren Wright wrote:
I e-mailed Rodney Scott this question some time ago. His response was spells like
Fireball which require a dodge of 18 or higher, means the spell has an 18 to
strike. So any NAR or artifical armor is automatically by-passed if its AR is under 18.
However, if the NAR was 19, then it wouldn't do anything. So spells like Firebolt
which have a +4 to strike, means you roll the dice and add +4. Normal rules for
NAR apply. Call Ligthning (depending on which one) usually says dodge on a
natural 20 dice roll or on 24 with modified, bonuses. So this means it has a 24 to
strike. It was really greatful to learn this because it helped solve some major issues
my players were having with spell magic.


Yeah - that's basically the answer I got when I E-Mailed palladium about this very issue years ago.


Probably because Rodney was the Q&A guy at the time :D

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There you go man, keep as cool as you can.
Face piles of trials with smiles. It riles
them to believe that you perceive the web they weave
and keep on thinking free.

-- The Moody Blues, In the Beginning


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Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2004 10:59 pm
  

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The way I handle it is if it has a physical portion to it, like fire ball ice shard or lightning bolt then it must rull higher than the ar of the victem.

Just the way I does it
Aegis

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Unread postPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2004 12:49 am
  

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I don't generally make magic attacks subject to AR, which I find makes magic more effective, (something for which my magic loving players adore me for). Anything to help out the mages of the Megaverse.

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