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 Post subject: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2020 9:50 am
  

Explorer

Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 7:29 pm
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Has anyone tried using powers found in other books, e.g. super powers, or spells as a talent?


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 Post subject: Re: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2020 5:59 pm
  

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Monk

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The NBSG has rules to convert spells into talents.

I have used spells as ideas to design talents before the NBSG came out, yes.
My way of balancing the usage of spell ideas for talent ideas is totally different then the NBSG's ""conversion rules"".

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 Post subject: Re: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2020 12:20 am
  

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Knight

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drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
The NBSG has rules to convert spells into talents.

Do you think that could be used to reverse-engineer talents into spells?


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 Post subject: Re: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2020 9:35 am
  

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Monk

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Through the Glass Darkly

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 Post subject: Re: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 11:34 pm
  

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Rogerd wrote:
Has anyone tried using powers found in other books, e.g. super powers, or spells as a talent?


It's actually the Dark Designs sourcebook that has the guidelines mentioned above. Relatively simple to use them to go in reverse as well and make Talents into spells, psionics, etc.

Most of the feedback I have gotten regarding them has been overwhelmingly positive. Just remember that they are not "hard and fast rules" but rather guidelines, allowing G.M.s to make adjustments in the name of game balance, fun, etc. I really just tried to pull back the curtain a little on the mental calculus we game designers use when creating new abilities. It may not get you to the exact product you had in mind, but it should at least get you in the ballpark where you can find the rest of the way yourself. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 12:28 pm
  

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Monk

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Feedback: I hate them. Because they make the resultant powers too expensive.

Yah I know about Preserving the uniqueness of spells bit.
Besides the talent the char ends up with shouldn't be exactly like the spell that inspired it.

My Basic math for making talents with the same idea as spells....

EDIT: Found my org. text. See below.


Yes, it is loose. This is because there is a lot of looseness in what NB talents can do. And to let people have freedom to diverge from the idea derived from the spell idea. So it is more a "How To Make a New Talent" test, than a how to convert spells to talents text.

Yes, it forces the GM and Player to actually THINK for themselves. Rather than 'follow a formula' which just leads to the same old same old.

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Last edited by drewkitty ~..~ on Fri Oct 23, 2020 12:32 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:02 am
  

Explorer

Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 7:29 pm
Posts: 140
Warwolf wrote:
It's actually the Dark Designs sourcebook that has the guidelines mentioned above. Relatively simple to use them to go in reverse as well and make Talents into spells, psionics, etc.

Most of the feedback I have gotten regarding them has been overwhelmingly positive. Just remember that they are not "hard and fast rules" but rather guidelines, allowing G.M.s to make adjustments in the name of game balance, fun, etc. I really just tried to pull back the curtain a little on the mental calculus we game designers use when creating new abilities. It may not get you to the exact product you had in mind, but it should at least get you in the ballpark where you can find the rest of the way yourself. :wink:


Thinking of also including some of the class powers from Pathfinder too actually - now that i have re-reading some of the material again.


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 Post subject: Re: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2020 12:27 am
  

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Monk

Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2000 1:01 am
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For those of you interested,...this is the text I wrote up back when there were only two or three NB books.

Quote:
When a Nightbane makes a talent that is based on a spell there is some difference between how the talent will act and cost. I've run into the situation where I wanted to make a talent that was close to a spell that was on the books, and the gm had ruled that the cost to use it would of been equal to that of the spell. But this would of made a talent that was out proportion of the rest of the other talents on the lists. Has this ever happened to you? This is why I came up with this system to calculate the P.P.E. costs, both permanent to buy costs and the to use costs.

The first thing you do is find the P.P.E. cost of the spell and the level of the spell. The level of the spell is the base permanent cost of the talent. The you take the spell P.P.E. cost and that is your base to use cost for same range and duration as the spell. However, most of the time the spell give the rang and duration in feet per level or minutes per level while talents, for the most part have a set range and duration. To lessen the to use costs you can do few things, such as decreases the range, decreases the duration, put limitations on the usage. Increasing the permanent cost of the talent can also be raised to lower the usage costs. By raising the permanent cost by 1 point will decrease the usage cost by at least 2 but no more then 4 (GM discretion). Dropping the per level increases of range and duration each will lessen the usage cost by 20% each.

The usage costs is equal to the base usage cost of the spell being mimicked minus the modifications and limitations to be included into the talent.

activation P.P.E. = Spell P.P.E. - range modifications - duration modifications - other limitations

The permanent cost is equal to the Spell level and the additional desired amount of usage costs reduction.

Acquiring P.P.E. = Spell level + any additional reduction of the activation P.P.E.

Here is a example of how a spell such as Mute can be mimicked by a talent.
Base spell costs: mute L9 (50) 30 feet
Base talent cost with out any modifications: 9 perm , 50 temp....5min per L...30 feet
Finished Talent
Shadow Hand of Gagging--this talent is an extension of the Bane's will, at first this talent will appear at a time of great annoyance by a person. The SHoG appears as a shadowy hand that flys out from the Bane's own hand to the source of annoyance and clamps onto the annoyer's mouth causing him to be unable to speak. This talent can not dose not affect the annoyer's breathing in any way. So it can't be used to suffocate them. This talent can be used on mages to stop them from casting spells.
limitations--can only be used in morphius, and the Bane must be in Line of Sight of the annoyer when used, to use SHoG the Bane must make a gasping gesture at the annoyer, range 20 feet per Level. can only be dodged, and only if the annoyer has seen SHoG in use before hand.
costs--perm ppe cost--10 , cost to activate--10 per 10 min.(up front or maintained)
Note--The LOS also means that the user need to be able to see the target area...the mouth..so it has to be used in plane sight of the target.

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 Post subject: Re: Nightbane Talents
Unread postPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2020 12:39 am
  

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Monk

Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2000 1:01 am
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Location: Eastvale, calif
Another couple of Talents I've made.

Eve's Delight
A truly unique talent that no-other nightspawn would be caught dead admitting having, this talent was born out of a desire to keep a woman named Eve happy. Creating 2D6 2 oz chocolate bars of the nightspawn's imagining.
Cost to Acquire:  6 perm PPE
Activation Coast: 15 PPE
Range:  up to 3 feet away.
Duration: perm..



Starfield v 2.0
This talent creates a a shell of darkness that no light can get through with an inner surface is covered with flecks of light like a night sky that give minimal light to the insides. (moonless night bright) When created the size of the sphere is determined by the how much P.P.E. is invested into it when it is activated, 10 feet radius per 4 P.P.E. used to activate it, with it lasting one minute per level. Characters without nightvision or the like caught within the sphere are -4 to perception and -6 to Strike/Parry/Dodge if there is no light source inside. The sphere is centered on the Nightbane and moves with them. The Nightbane themselves is not hampered in any way by their field, though they cannot see past the edge of course.
Note: UV, IR, radio, x-rays are forms of light.
Limitations: Activation costs are doubled when in Facade.
Cost: 10 P.P.E. to permanently acquire it; 4 P.P.E. minimum to activate. Each additional 4 P.P.E. increases the radius by 10 feet.


Spoiler:
PS: I do have the NS core book, published before a certain comic book artist rose a stink. So don't B'ch about the NS usage.

_________________
Q's on this board need canon answers first for the question that was asked. Then you can post your own opinions or house rules, they need to be listed/declareds as your own opinions or house rules.

Crimson
Eleven
Delight
Petracor


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