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Unread postPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:54 pm
  

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Hero

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Okay... I know that these will almost always be NPCs as their very natures make them ill suited for Players, but given their importance to the setting... and the possibility that players may have to interact with them at some point (maybe even fighting rogue or rivals of their Great House), it would be nice to finally get some actual stats on these beings.

I also understand that some of the attributes used for Player Characters may not be applicable to these beings (Engineers are stationary and thus don't really have a need for Physical Endurance... at least not like players would)... but other stats may be important (just how intelligent is a Librarian anyways?). If a Librarian went rogue on their House and had to be put down... just how much of a fight would they give a group of Players? If a rival house had to be brought low by killing its Engineer(s)... how would one go about doing so?

It is questions like this that make knowing the stats of these beings important... especially if other Houses are going to be rivals rather than allies of the Players. Besides... most other Palladium games offer stats on beings that are not intended to be players... including some that would be very unlikely for players to even encounter... let alone fight. Hell... we get stats on the various personalities of the Machine... even though it is unlikely any player will actually live long enough to interact with one of them (given their extreme hostility towards humans for the most part).

So I ask again... why don't we get stats on these two beings that have made the Splicer setting even possible?

Oh... and if I've missed where these stats are located... please feel free to enlighten (and embarrass) me.

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Unread postPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 9:31 pm
  

Palladin

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mental attributes are probably based heavily on the person selected to become one... so for a librarian, probably very very smart, and for engineers probably pretty smart, and ideally also a good MA (their ability to deal with people would be fairly important). for both i would expect candidates with a high ME are also very desirable (i expect the process to be somewhat traumatizing for an engineer, particularly the loss of mobility, and extremely traumatizing for a librarian. plus, they have a tendency to go insane, which i expect a high ME helps resist).

for physical attributes, speed is 0 for engineers and probably something like 1d4 for librarians. PS is probably just the standard human range for engineers, probably some bonus for librarians (i seem to recall them being quite large). PP is probably substantially reduced for both on the macro scale (but effectively extremely high on the micro/nano/pico/femto scale). PB for a librarian is probably 1d4, for an engineer probably a small bonus above regular human (they've been compared to angels with the tentacles coming out of their body, which usually is not an association i would make for something ugly).

PE i would have to disagree, i would expect it to be significant, and also quite high. in both cases, we're dealing with people that are constantly doing things like separating out chemicals, analyzing and modifying DNA, creating new life forms, etc; for all intents and purposes, i would expect them to be largely immune to most chemicals and diseases, and to be quite exceptionally tough in other ways as well, all of which imo point to high PE (also high pain tolerance, for librarians).

now, HP and SDC... that's a bit harder. i'd take a look at the saint's bonuses, and increase them, personally. after all, the saint is basically tougher purely because their symbiont is making them so, and the symbiont has fully matured for engineers and librarians, which means it should probably be tougher than the larval (or whatever) form.


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Unread postPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 11:19 pm
  

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While these are good rules-of-thumb for some improvised stats... it would still be nice to have something even semi-official.

To be honest, I found it odd that they would exclude stats on these two beings in the core book on the basis that they would be inappropriate for players. Palladium Books have printed stats on a lot of creatures that were also inappropriate for players in their other game books... and even stats for some beings that it would be very unlikely for players to even encounter (or survive such an encounter).

True, Librarians and Engineers are not beings that most players are likely to encounter in any situation that would require stats (like combat), but there may still be occasions when such stats might be needed. Just as it will be rare for most players to actually encounter a Splugorth or a Nightlord in an actual combat situation, so too is this unlikely to happen... but there is still the chance.

Still, thanks for the advice on these guidelines.

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Unread postPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:11 pm
  

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Slappy & I have this fully covered in the submission we have already submitted to Palladium Books. This is why ALL of US need to knock down the doors with the Splice demand.

Our script covers building a Great House, stats on the Librarian & Engineer and so... much more. Its designed to help develop and expand this gameline, your campaign settings, etc.

We NEED this script to get through the clogged pipeline, hopefully by the end of this year.

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Last edited by Premier on Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Unread postPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:12 pm
  

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Looking forward to your Rifter submission, Premier & Slappy. :D

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Unread postPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:17 pm
  

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BookWyrm wrote:
Looking forward to your Rifter submission, Premier & Slappy. :D


Thanks BookWyrm, but actually this was a completed sourcebook script that was submitted over 1-2 years ago with some completed art to boot, not a Rifters article submission. We need more books and we have submitted enough material for 3-4 books, plus a few more brewing. Slappy & I are now splicing the previous script into smaller publications to try and squeeze these through the pipeline to get faster results for this game line. This is also not to mention that Galactus Kid and crew have also been finalizing several book scripts.

This is why the demand needs to be there and energized, as PB is always going to fuel the demand when numbers & sales count. Right now that is certainly Rifts as their primary cash cow, with Robotech via license has an invested cost, plus Dead Reign because they are IMHO, easier to churn out, but SPLICERS needs books out and we have the material to do this. We just need to express the demand more clearly to PB so that they feel the pressure and he energy that this gameline if it had more books out would generate positive sales numbers.

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Unread postPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 4:57 pm
  

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Well... this is one sourcebook that I will definitely get when it comes out, so add my voice to the growing multitude of Splicers clamoring for more!

I don't suppose we could maybe get a preview?

As you may remember (from other threads I've commented on), I have been working on my own little project and a book like this would be a huge help.

As a side question, Premier... how apart do you have Computer Cores in the games you run? Do they overlap to such a degree that the destruction of one won't be too much of a hindrance to the Machine's forces? While it would seem logical for NEXUS (and a reasonably intelligent AI) to build such redundancy. However, NEXUS isn't exactly working correctly (and arrogant enough to believe itself somewhat invulnerable) that it might feel such a level of redundancy is inefficient and put a greater amount of space between the Cores. This of course could open up a small area free of the machine should one of the Cores be taken down (not unlike what has happened with the Barren Marshes).

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Unread postPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:37 pm
  

Palladin

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the fact that the barren marsh has no coverage would strongly suggest that there isn't much, if any, redundancy.

otherwise they would have had to destroy many cores to create an area like the barren marsh.


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Unread postPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 11:31 pm
  

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Actually, the amount of area the House of the Barren Marsh controls on the surface isn't that big... roughly the size of South Carolina (small when compared to all of North America and tiny compared to the amount of land all the continents would cover). There are also a number of factors that make the area fairly unattractive for the machine... the caustic waters within the area and a lack of resources NEXUS needs... means the area probably wasn't of critical importance to require redundancy. Areas of vital importance may be likely to have a greater level of redundancy to prevent a similar incident. NEXUS may be insane... but it can still learn from its mistakes... sort of.

Then again... it is possible that this has shown the machine how vulnerable it could be to the Resistance, causing it to build greater redundancy into the rest of its holdings. That no other House has managed to claim a portion of the surface might be because of this.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:15 am
  

Palladin

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to be fair, it took multiple generations for the first computer core to be taken down. it may be the only one that has been taken down because nobody else is capable of it, just yet.

(or it could be that it has actually been done elsewhere, and house barren marsh, which btw is the source of the vast majority of the fluff text, simply doesn't know about it).


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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:00 am
  

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This is true... but until we hear otherwise, this is the only time it has been done.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:57 am
  

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Premier wrote:
This is also not to mention that Galactus Kid and crew have also been finalizing several book scripts.

Thanks Chuck. yeah we have some irons in the fire.

I'd also like to discuss the posibility of teaming up with you specificially on a future project from start to finish. Concept, brainstorming, development and completion.

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Unread postPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 5:28 pm
  

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Razorwing wrote:
Well... this is one sourcebook that I will definitely get when it comes out, so add my voice to the growing multitude of Splicers clamoring for more!


Thanks Razorwing! The more voices requesting Splicers sourcebooks the BETTER!
Even a phone call to the PB office does the Splice a good!

Quote:
I don't suppose we could maybe get a preview?
As you may remember (from other threads I've commented on), I have been working on my own little project and a book like this would be a huge help.

Hmmm…. Will have to check on that one. might be a good idea for PB & Splicers.

Quote:
As a side question, Premier... how apart do you have Computer Cores in the games you run?


I use a system that Slappy & I have orchestrated and is described in the submitted script, for building, developing and establishing a diverse Splicers atmosphere and its habitats.

Spoiler:
It utilizes a NEXUS Computer Core as the foundational basis for the surrounding area, via its inhabitants, Great Houses, Retros, resources, etc. So for every Computer Core there is this surrounding area with its corresponding Resistance established to fight the Machine Core and they are divided into territorial factions (Great Houses), along with various other inhabitants (Retros, Ghost Towns, Preserves, etc.) and the habitats that reside in them, plus the various terrain types and resources availed to them. This helps define each Great House within each “Area of Influence”, their locations and relationships with each other. Just one Computer Core and its Area of Influence is enough to campaign within for many years, let alone campaigning within multiple Areas of Influence. I don’t have the script in front of me at this exact moment to tell ya exactly the square mile footage per Computer Core compound installed and this may actually be up to the GM. A lot however is painting a more solidified picture for gaming experiences and establishing the Splicers society and habitat, even on this broken world, a systemic structure is forming.


Quote:
Do they overlap to such a degree that the destruction of one won't be too much of a hindrance to the Machine's forces? While it would seem logical for NEXUS (and a reasonably intelligent AI) to build such redundancy. However, NEXUS isn't exactly working correctly (and arrogant enough to believe itself somewhat invulnerable) that it might feel such a level of redundancy is inefficient and put a greater amount of space between the Cores. This of course could open up a small area free of the machine should one of the Cores be taken down (not unlike what has happened with the Barren Marshes).


This will typically be more up to the GM and the Area of Influence’s design. For example the Great House of Barren Marsh destroyed the Computer Core that it was designated to resist within its Area of Influence. I would be confident to suggest that NEXUS would “like” to reestablish this Computer Core, however, the marshy habitat and the level of resistance in that Area of Influence has made this task extremely difficult and not a major priority. This doesn’t mean that the Barren Marsh doesn’t receive its fair share of machine attacks; infiltrations, traps and invasion attempts, as this will be a constant in most surface level interactions, but it won’t be as severe or as supported in a timely manner as those that harbor a fully functional Computer Core within its Area of Influence.

Personally, I don’t see the need for overlapping Computer Cores as one CC may simply be larger if needed to meet any anticipated level of resistance it feels it is incurring. It’s all about the amount of war efforts that NEXUS feels is necessary and where it stations these units to suppress the Resistance. Its important to remember that NEXUS is being considered to being in a more laid back persecution mode than before.

(Splicers Corebook – 2004, Page 8)
Quote:
“So where does that leave all of us today? Well, it has been some time since the Machine’s all-out onslaught to exterminate all human life. It seems satisfied with its genocidal handiwork and has settled down in a period of slow but vigilant controlled reduction of the human race; like an exterminator with a monthly regime to keep rat population in check within acceptable levels. At least until the Machine decides it is time to begin its next great purge of humanity or to finish us off completely, once and for all. It may be formulating or putting into place such an operation at this very moment. That is why we must strike now. This “lull” gives us the opportunity to strike back and reclaim out world. “ – Christina Marchetti, the first rebel.


So unless NEXUS has decided its time to crank things back up, (which would really make for a No holds barred, horrific and EXTREMELY intense gaming setting) it is with this assessment that the need to have redundant CCs for strategic purposes would not be instituted at the “present” time, unless it was for some other unique purpose* to justify having such a consolidated area drenched with an over-abundance of operating resources.

* = Unique purpose(s) might be; to test the Resistance within that Area of Influence, feuding Personalities can't decide on the best strategic location of a Computer Core or they are relocating the CC operations and the construction of one is during the existence of another (that's if they plan on deconstructing it afterwards or using it has a lure), etc.

As to areas free of the machine presence, I would suggest the deep subterranean habitats, the cold arctic regions as well as the seas and oceans. I have briefly mentioned the core books “Splicers: Arctic Realms” & “Splicers: Dark Depths” as WIP scripts that pertain to this subject matter more in-depth, but with the current roster of titles, we thought it best to flush out the current surface level source material first.

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Unread postPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 5:43 pm
  

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Shark_Force wrote:
to be fair, it took multiple generations for the first computer core to be taken down. it may be the only one that has been taken down because nobody else is capable of it, just yet.

(or it could be that it has actually been done elsewhere, and house barren marsh, which btw is the source of the vast majority of the fluff text, simply doesn't know about it).


As to NEXUS learning from the fall of its Computer Core (CC) to the Barren Marsh, I think both Razorwing and Sharkforce’s comments have some applicable merit.

My take is;

A: Undesirable Habitat - The current swampy habitat of the Barren Marsh is not that appetizing nor extremely beneficial to NEXUS's gain, for it to deem CC loss in the ruin city it was located in, as a major crushing blow that warrants extreme retaliation to reclaim this CC location. The book does state that NEXUS "must have plans" to reclaim it, but so far it hasn’t. However, I would not be so assumptive to think that the swampy habitat is an ultimate protection from NEXUS attacks. Infantry is only one part of the military arsenal that NEXUS wields. Orbital razing is another, per page 19 “ Purges carried out either by robot armies or strategic strikes from orbit if there is heavy resistance.”

B: Supreme Arrogance - The machine is supremely arrogant and justifiably so. With such resources and control over the planet and its inhabitants, and the abundant robots at its disposal, why wouldn’t it be? Such arrogance and the fact that no other Computer Core siege attempt has been successful since Barren Marsh, even though other Computer cores reside in ruin city locations. It is clear that NEXUS must recognize these CC vulnerabilities as similar to the one that fell to Barren marsh, but yet all other attempts on CCs have failed. So NEXUS is either using such seemingly “vulnerabilities” to lure in the Resistance like rats with a huge piece of cheese or there is something more at play here.

C: Deeper, Twisted Agenda - NEXUS is studying its adversaries and seeing how we cope with various liberties, oppositions, psychological warfare, etc. It is a good chance that Barren Marsh is under more scrutiny than one might think. Maybe it is with good reasons that NEXUS allots for only one successful Computer Core to be taken and allowed it to not be reclaimed, Yet that is. What is NEXUS doing in all this time with its billions of calculations and robot designs.

I see it as a arrogant teenager or adult who has captured a wasp, scorpion or even a snake and is enjoying the idea of watching these things that it knows can sting or bite, but poses no true life-threatening threat, so they think.

D: Rare Perfect Combination - The fall of the CC to Barren Marsh was the results of the perfect storm in favor of the Great House and or was allotted on purpose. Rather this was done on purpose by one of the Personalities, potentially Eve or as a joint NEXUS venture to see what the resistance thinks it can do and will do with surface presence to better evaluate counter measures. Whatever the case this was a generational battle for such gain and it has not been replicated even though other CCs exist with the same vulnerabilities, indicating just how difficult the first success much have been.

Just my 2 cents

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Unread postPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 5:45 pm
  

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The Galactus Kid wrote:
Premier wrote:
This is also not to mention that Galactus Kid and crew have also been finalizing several book scripts.

Thanks Chuck. yeah we have some irons in the fire.

I'd also like to discuss the posibility of teaming up with you specificially on a future project from start to finish. Concept, brainstorming, development and completion.


tell me more...

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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:10 pm
  

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Comment: THE SPLICE MUST FLOW!!!
Premier wrote:
The Galactus Kid wrote:
Premier wrote:
This is also not to mention that Galactus Kid and crew have also been finalizing several book scripts.

Thanks Chuck. yeah we have some irons in the fire.

I'd also like to discuss the posibility of teaming up with you specificially on a future project from start to finish. Concept, brainstorming, development and completion.


tell me more...

We'll discuss at GenCon, specifically for Splicers, but also the Free Quebec Rapid Deployment Force that we discussed last year. I'll be sure to bring my A game and we can knock around ideas and potentially come together on concept.

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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 3:51 pm
  

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Premier,

Thanks for your insight into the distribution of the Computer Cores and how the Barren Marshes likely survive as the the only House that controls any of the surface world.

While it is true that the Machine isn't as intent as it once was on humanity's destruction, and thus may have scaled back the level of redundancy in maintaining control of its forces... I doubt that it would completely eliminate it. It may have deactivated a number of the Computer Cores so as not to waste resources (and because it arrogantly thinks that they aren't needed), but I am not fully convinced that it would deconstruct them entirely. Yes, it believes humanity is now controlled... but one day it may decide it is tired of the game and want to eliminate the species entirely... in which case the decommissioned Cores may be needed again (and would take far fewer resources to reactivate a decommissioned Core than it would take to rebuild one that was dismantled).

This also allows some of the personalities to potentially use such cores for their own purposes... without the others being aware of it (at least initially). It is possible that it was (and is) through these decommissioned (and mostly inactive) Cores that the few helpful or manipulative personalities have managed to aid the Resistance.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:38 pm
  

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The Galactus Kid wrote:
Premier wrote:
The Galactus Kid wrote:
Premier wrote:
This is also not to mention that Galactus Kid and crew have also been finalizing several book scripts.

Thanks Chuck. yeah we have some irons in the fire.

I'd also like to discuss the posibility of teaming up with you specificially on a future project from start to finish. Concept, brainstorming, development and completion.


tell me more...

We'll discuss at GenCon, specifically for Splicers, but also the Free Quebec Rapid Deployment Force that we discussed last year. I'll be sure to bring my A game and we can knock around ideas and potentially come together on concept.


Ah... I do remember the Free Quebec discussion and the art that intrigued ya.
Will bring it with me.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:56 pm
  

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Razorwing wrote:
Premier,

Thanks for your insight into the distribution of the Computer Cores and how the Barren Marshes likely survive as the the only House that controls any of the surface world.

While it is true that the Machine isn't as intent as it once was on humanity's destruction, and thus may have scaled back the level of redundancy in maintaining control of its forces... I doubt that it would completely eliminate it. It may have deactivated a number of the Computer Cores so as not to waste resources (and because it arrogantly thinks that they aren't needed), but I am not fully convinced that it would deconstruct them entirely. Yes, it believes humanity is now controlled... but one day it may decide it is tired of the game and want to eliminate the species entirely... in which case the decommissioned Cores may be needed again (and would take far fewer resources to reactivate a decommissioned Core than it would take to rebuild one that was dismantled).

This also allows some of the personalities to potentially use such cores for their own purposes... without the others being aware of it (at least initially). It is possible that it was (and is) through these decommissioned (and mostly inactive) Cores that the few helpful or manipulative personalities have managed to aid the Resistance.


Thank You for such kind and encouraging words. Its just my 2 cents of course and I enjoy taking aspects that seem like potential issues and turning them into intriguing game scenarios. "Deconstructed" or idle Computer Cores is a nice playing field for campaigns and territorial scouting parties for future expansions. Razorwing, your suggestions are wonderful opportunities for players to scout and explore the surrounding areas, to see if a core is truly "silent or is it a sleeper. If its a sleeper is there a presiding personality and what is its purpose? Such Computer Cores could also make for wonderful Technojacker Refuge Bunkers or compound "if" they can do a full cleansing. Unless the TJ(s) are bitter characters who were once imprisoned or hunted and persecuted by fearful Splicers and perhaps they are setting up a bit of metal vengeance and has joined with NEXUS influences. Perhaps the deconstructed Computer Core is a future tell sign of something wicked about to happen (i.e.: Earthquakes from tectonic shifting, tsunami, etc.) and NEXUS has predicted that the location would no longer be safe or stable. Maybe its a warning sign that warrants investigation or it could be a ploy by NEXUS to ferret out neighboring Great Houses who seem to relocate when a Computer Core is constructed/de-constructed, and maybe NEXUS is attempting a new silent method of operations? Maybe a redundant set-up is because something big is being developed in one or both of these Computer Cores and NEXUS wants the best security to protect this construction?

Certainly, the Librarian would be intrigued as to what is going on in a redundant CC set up.

Whew, just so .... many possibilities.

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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:33 pm
  

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I got to preview some of Chuck's and Slappy's submitted material and based on the portions they sent me, it's definitely awesome and I want to see it printed about as much as I want to see Atorian Empire! The House Creation "guidelines", the new gear on both sides, adventures, plots, twists, etc... definitely A+ material! As Kevin would say, "It's EPIC!!!"

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Unread postPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:36 am
  

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Comment: THE SPLICE MUST FLOW!!!
Yeah. I would also LOVE to see the personal weapons creation rules in print officially and not just Rifter 0.

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Ziggurat the Eternal wrote:
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The Shameless Plug would be a good new account name for you. 8-)

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Unread postPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:45 pm
  

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Premier wrote:
As to NEXUS learning from the fall of its Computer Core

It can succeed next time but only if Slater is boss.

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Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 30, 2014 11:59 pm
  

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Premier wrote:
Slappy & I have this fully covered in the submission we have already submitted to Palladium Books. This is why ALL of US need to knock down the doors with the Splice demand.

Our script covers building a Great House, stats on the Librarian & Engineer and so... much more. Its designed to help develop and expand this gameline, your campaign settings, etc.

We NEED this script to get through the clogged pipeline, hopefully by the end of this year.

And I still have a copy of this script :D

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"Freedom is the recognition that no single person, no single authority or government has a monopoly on the truth, but that every individual life is infinitely precious, that every one of us put on this world has been put there for a reason and has something to offer."
Megaversal Ambassador Coordinator
Palladium Books 2015 Robotech RPG Tactics Tournament Rules


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