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Unread postPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2022 11:18 am
  

Dungeon Crawler

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:00 am
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You guys may know of "the men who stare at goats" and the C.I.A. remote viewing "psychic spies" right?
A "S.pecial A.cess P.rogram"...
There are many other "Psychic" roles and programs that are still unacknowledged.
Now, this isn't a cracked pot havin' a field day rambling some nutty conspiracy. Remember when, Former President Obama publicly announced that America has developed and is building "Powered armor" and he joked that "I'm going to blast off now". There was at one time Articles of a concealed under clothing "Wearable" exoskeleton that would move HVT VIPs out of the way of danger, specifically to "Dodge snipers".

Well, it is not an exo.

It's a specially trained agent. Recruited Sensitive psychics who have developed precognition are taught a new technique.
This program was initiated by the same nuclear physicist who ran the C.I.A. remote viewing program, Dr. Edwin c. May.
The subject is trained in a "speed" martial art with a focus on training muscle memory "reflexes", to react as quickly as possible.
Then the psychic is trained to stay in the state of precognition consciously, and to "Lean into the future", up to 6 seconds into the future.
As Precognition is like trying to recall a dream you had makes the information gleaned "Intuitive".
This inaccuracy is beneficial, Precognitive information doesn't create paradoxes.
Also, the precognitive agents gain an ability to "Lean" towards desired outcomes within each impending (6) seconds.
Possibly using an awkward effect from Quantum mechanics demonstrated by the "Double Slit" experiment and all its variations, known to scientists as "Observation changes the outcome". this mysterious ability makes the psychic seem unbeatable in melee combat as they are shifting probability into their favor!

Operational utilization: S.A.P. (Sensitive Asset Protection) (reuse of acronyms to obfuscate)
The psychic does not have to know he or she is under attack, does not need to see or know the attacker.
The Precognitive awareness enables the psychic to take defensive actions to evade danger up to 6 seconds in the future.
The Combat Precognitive Agent is a supernatural guard or bodyguard.

P.C.C. Combat Precog or P.C.C. Combat Precognitive Agent
These sensitive psychics are trained to use precognition, clairvoyance, and related abilities to prevent disasters and/or to save lives in any way possible!
1. "Troubleshooting" This P.C.C. has precognitive dreams with enough information to go to the scene before the Event happens.
2. This P.C.C. has the Advanced danger sense power described in "Mindwerks" but cannot get any chemical, cybernetic (nor bionic), or nanotechnology augmentation. Receiving any such augment results in losing this psionic ability. This ability is "Always on" and the psychic can sense traps without the additional effort described. However, the psychic is in an altered state and would struggle to share the information with any accuracy.
3. This P.C.C. also has the intuitive combat sensitive psychic power. This power is "always on".
The bonuses for "Advanced Sixth sense" and "Intuitive combat" are stacked and apply to the psychic in combat situation without needing to prepare.
4. This P.C.C. also has the super psionic power of psionic invisibility with a slight variation; The P.C.C. can use psionic invisibility in combat, the power isn't dismissed. The Agent is not "Invisible" when doing so, but becomes difficult to spot, counter, or target in combat.

(The Combat precog can attempt to parry ranged attacks with swords or combat knives as a last resort. For obvious reasons this does not work against MDC attacks. The Combat Precog could "Slice a bullet", but the parry doesn't protect the psychic from a scattered ION blast, particle beam or rail gun burst) The psychic should not use any armors that penalize movement or hinder psychic functioning.
The P.C.C. is a master psychic and gains 6 psychic sensitive powers in addition to these above at character creation.
The Agent gains one additional psionic power every level earned. The new psionic power is to be selected from the; Sensitive, Healing, or physical categories. The Agent gains one super psionic power at 4th level, 8th level, and 12th level.

Training: the P.C.C. starts with hand to hand: expert and with one "Other" skill can raise this to Hand to hand: Martial arts, or hand to hand: assassin (If evil).

The "Combat Precognitive Agent" might have bonuses nearly equal to the bonuses granted to a Hyperion juicer but isn't technologically augmented.


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Unread postPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2022 11:37 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:00 am
Posts: 202
would you like to know more?
would you be interested in playing this kind of "Psychic"?


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Unread postPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 8:12 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:00 am
Posts: 202
I will have a youtube video put together soon, that way none of you have to take my word for it and it should express much more clearly what I am trying to share here.
if you have any ideas regarding this concept, please ask me.


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Unread postPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 8:43 am
  

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Are you aiming for a BTS2 PCC or a HU power cat, or a PCC like a rifts or PF character class?

As it is, with a little polishing could be used in BTS2 or as a sub. power cat tot he psionics power cat in HU2.

_________________
Answering the OP's question with the canon answer should be done First.
After that you can post your house rules....as your house rules.

May you be blessed with understanding,
and the ability to change course when you are off the mark.


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Unread postPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:51 am
  

Dungeon Crawler

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drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
Are you aiming for a BTS2 PCC or a HU power cat, or a PCC like a rifts or PF character class?
As it is, with a little polishing could be used in BTS2 or as a sub. power cat tot he psionics power cat in HU2.


I will shoot for a BTS2 version, which will have reduced powers to be better balanced for that game,
I made a first level HU2 Psionic category character: purchasing, Sixth sense, intuitive combat, and the superpower of invisibility...
as it stands now, I think it might be unbalanced given that kind of "not batman, but does something similar" psionic character type.
as the HU2 Psionic already covers this angle, I won't write an HU2 version.

however, my "Combat precog" is by far weaker than: Minor powers: Heightened sense of awareness, + Lightning reflexes.
I can see this being Powered up to survive a Rifts environment. I will write this Psychic Character Class for Rifts as I feel
that it has a unique focus and could stand alone, like the burster, zapper, and such...
while *NOT* detracting from the Mind Melter.

There are spiritual medium characters already in rifts, I think this "Precog" hero would be an interesting character to role play.
the character gets visions, he feels compelled to act on the fragmentary glimpses. He feels compelled to protect allies and anyone he is assigned to.
Use other sensitive powers to further his mission to protect, or to investigate.
it is no "Cosmo knight", but it should be good.


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Unread postPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 12:45 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:00 am
Posts: 202
this video should be ready very soon.
yeah, its a chopped series of clips, but once you see it...
you don't have to take my word for it.

https://youtu.be/9NFw8Pze8Ow


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Unread postPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 12:48 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:00 am
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This video also...
is "Psionics" a thing?
...watch and decide for yourself.

https://youtu.be/dWduMTGY_AQ


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Unread postPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:10 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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A new kind of Psychic...
One who is bent on using precognition to evade danger, dodge attacks and strike exposed weak points...
One who isn't waiting for light to strike the retina nor sound waves to reach the ears...
This is a fighter who has a "Precognitive Consciousness"
a fighter who is experiencing the future up to 6 seconds ahead of time,
a fighter who can observe millions of future time line scenarios, and select the best future iteration...
A fighter who can "Lean" into the future towards "optimal outcomes"!
A fighter who already knows the environment, the area, and what everyone is going to do...
before when the others know what they are going to do!
A fighter whose moves might be perfected based on precognitive guidance.
A fighter who has an edge when trying to avoid traps, and area of effect attacks, because they have advance knowledge of the future!
A fighter who seems to move too fast for the eye to follow,
A fighter who seems to flicker and blur,

A fighter who really can Slice bullets out of the air,
A fighter who could use an MD weapon to parry an MD weapon attack! (Maybe)


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Unread postPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:12 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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also, let me know what you think of the vids...


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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:27 am
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Question: Intuitive Combat specifically prevents someone from using any other psionic powers. if this is "always active" then they couldn't use any psionic powers ever. One assumes the intention is for them to not have this limitation as a special perk, but if so it needs to be mentioned.

also: How would these guys react to a Group Mind Block? if they're used to always having all this on, then someone suddenly shutting their psychic senses off would be fairly crippling wouldn't it?

_________________
Sometimes, you're like a beacon of light in the darkness, giving me some hope for humankind. ~ Killer Cyborg

You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2022 2:23 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:00 am
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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Question: Intuitive Combat specifically prevents someone from using any other psionic powers. if this is "always active" then they couldn't use any psionic powers ever. One assumes the intention is for them to not have this limitation as a special perk, but if so it needs to be mentioned.
also: How would these guys react to a Group Mind Block? if they're used to always having all this on, then someone suddenly shutting their psychic senses off would be fairly crippling wouldn't it?


The use of rule language seems to cause some consternation. leaving many to house rule their own games. in the case of new writing projects like this it behooves me to listen and make desired changes.

1. A caveat "the P.C.C. Combat Precog as a class feature combines the effects of Advanced danger sense and intuitive combat as an always on set of Class bonuses (akin to those listed for juicers). The Precog has the full benefits of advanced danger sense without needing to perform any other actions nor spend any additional I.S.P.. The Precog is not restricted from using other psionic powers despite benefiting from the intuitive combat power.

2. Psionic characters at any degree of power (limited, minor, major, or master) are only affected by mind block or group mind block if they choose to be. Just as you might sense a magical curse being placed on you (saving throw to resist) psychic characters can choose to ignore a mind block activated by another.

The Hinderances of this P.C.C. are:
"hero syndrome" the psychic feels an urgent desire to act on clues from precognitive dreams to save lives.
The psychic seems "distant", "Distracted" and "preoccupied". The psychic has a difficulty in listening to instruction that has no bearing on the precognitive "Missions".
As they grow more experienced and more powerful their dreams will include more details/clues. This responsibility is an overwhelming burden, each mission that the psychic fails to resolve the more chaotic and jumbled their visions will become, as the unconscious begins tormenting the psychic for failures.
This Psychic MUST have sleep and must be allowed to dream or they will temporarily lose their "Always on" powers.

All of this post is a "Garbage file" that I will rewrite and refine.
Hell, I may just say this P.C.C. has the Major power "Natural combat" and the minor powers: "Extraordinary P.P.", "lightning reflexes", and "Heightened sense of awareness" and Drop the idea completely. despite this solution Not being the intent of the P.C.C. at all!


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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:22 pm
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
psiandco wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Question: Intuitive Combat specifically prevents someone from using any other psionic powers. if this is "always active" then they couldn't use any psionic powers ever. One assumes the intention is for them to not have this limitation as a special perk, but if so it needs to be mentioned.
also: How would these guys react to a Group Mind Block? if they're used to always having all this on, then someone suddenly shutting their psychic senses off would be fairly crippling wouldn't it?


The use of rule language seems to cause some consternation. leaving many to house rule their own games. in the case of new writing projects like this it behooves me to listen and make desired changes.

1. A caveat "the P.C.C. Combat Precog as a class feature combines the effects of Advanced danger sense and intuitive combat as an always on set of Class bonuses (akin to those listed for juicers). The Precog has the full benefits of advanced danger sense without needing to perform any other actions nor spend any additional I.S.P.. The Precog is not restricted from using other psionic powers despite benefiting from the intuitive combat power.

2. Psionic characters at any degree of power (limited, minor, major, or master) are only affected by mind block or group mind block if they choose to be. Just as you might sense a magical curse being placed on you (saving throw to resist) psychic characters can choose to ignore a mind block activated by another.

The Hinderances of this P.C.C. are:
"hero syndrome" the psychic feels an urgent desire to act on clues from precognitive dreams to save lives.
The psychic seems "distant", "Distracted" and "preoccupied". The psychic has a difficulty in listening to instruction that has no bearing on the precognitive "Missions".
As they grow more experienced and more powerful their dreams will include more details/clues. This responsibility is an overwhelming burden, each mission that the psychic fails to resolve the more chaotic and jumbled their visions will become, as the unconscious begins tormenting the psychic for failures.
This Psychic MUST have sleep and must be allowed to dream or they will temporarily lose their "Always on" powers.

All of this post is a "Garbage file" that I will rewrite and refine.
Hell, I may just say this P.C.C. has the Major power "Natural combat" and the minor powers: "Extraordinary P.P.", "lightning reflexes", and "Heightened sense of awareness" and Drop the idea completely. despite this solution Not being the intent of the P.C.C. at all!


To quote from the Rifts Main Book (Just the rule book I had handiest) on Group Mind Block:

Quote:
but it can also be used to prevent outside forces (good or evil) from communicating via telepathy or empathy. Thus, a villainous psychic can use the group mind block for his own evil purposes. Everyone within the 120 foot area of affect will be automatically blocked, but the affect is not detectable so they are not likely to know that they are being mind blocked (a detect psionics will indicate a group mind block)!


The power specifically says that everyone is automatically effected, that it is not detectable, and in fact someone has to actively use detect psionics to know it is being used. and even if it is detected, there is very specifically no saving throw.

That's why I bring it up. They cannot choose to ignore it, Group Mind Block can be used maliciously to arbitrarily shut down psychics from using their power at any time. It's very important when writing something to show to others, to remember that most groups have house rules that they have taken for granted for so long they forget they are house rules. Your group may say psychics can refuse a group mind block, but by the rules, they have no resistance and the power explictly has no saving throw allowed, even for psychics. it simply works and shuts them out from their powers at any time, the only cost being the psychic using it and any friends in range also can't use their psychic powers.

_________________
Sometimes, you're like a beacon of light in the darkness, giving me some hope for humankind. ~ Killer Cyborg

You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


Last edited by Nekira Sudacne on Tue Jul 05, 2022 10:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Unread postPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2022 8:55 am
  

Dungeon Crawler

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Group Mind Block: The power specifically says that everyone is automatically effected, that it is not detectable, and in fact someone has to actively use detect psionics to know it is being used. and even if it is detected, there is very specifically no saving throw.
That's why I bring it up. They cannot choose to ignore it, Group Mind Block can be used maliciously to arbitrarily shut down psychics from using their power at any time. by the rules, they have no resistance, and the power explicitly has no saving throw allowed, even for psychics. it simply works and shuts them out from their powers at any time, the only cost being the psychic using it and any friends in range also can't use their psychic powers.


Thank you for correcting me in this. :eek: :-? :? I am serious. Thank you.
I'll try again to write it up "By the rules" as best I can.

I look at the juicers (all of them) and I see their flaws, their limitations, as being a fascinating aspect, something that actually promotes character growth.
I really need help doing something similar with my Psychic "combat precog". After my posts in the thread here: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=183513#p3114822
I am trying to grasp at a way to make this character concept "more" than just a "Super-dodge-tank" and more than just combat. I want to put in writing that this character has an empathy with sapient life and is naturally concerned with the well-being, health and safety of others. That this character has horible nightmares when he fails to follow up on a precognitive warning and allows another sapient being to Suffer or Die.
I have no idea how to find it, but there is an illo of a MASSIVE, rock-hard, battle-hardened merc who is either giving or returning a balloon to a child. I want to encourage that. I want to encourage "EMPATHY" and finding joy even in seemingly pointless acts of kindness. That if a village is starving, this guy wants to do something REAL about it, to provide some sort of solution no matter how small.

That the Psi-stalker maybe a sort of evolutionary reprisal to supernatural threats; this character type may have evolved to promote self-less good for other sapiens. That more than an agent of vengeance, this character is a guardian, a defender, a protector. This character doesn't do donations, collect for charities, or pointless as-a-hole activism...
This is the guy who will "HELP" a fellow with a real need. This is the guy who will give a starving person food, water, medicine, shelter.
At the same time, this is the guy who will see right through the schemes of the greedy, selfish, and corrupt.

I don't want it to force a GM's hand, or force the GM to cater to the whims of this character/player. I don't want the precognition to be overwhelming impossible demands...
I would like the precognition to not be consistently "Doomed-Fated-Unavoidable", hell, I just want to give the Psychic a Character flaw that promotes "Doing the right thing".
...and I am struggling with communicating this desire in a way that can't be misconstrued, the words manipulated into justification for selfishness, or rules lawyer legalism-ed to pointlessness. can you offer guidance in this (creating a set of flaws and limitations that encourage the character to be "Good" without needing rewards)?


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 9:40 am
  

Dungeon Crawler

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I am wondering if I should make the "Psionic invisibility" a class ability akin to the Psislingers ability to reduce incoming megadamage into SDC damage.
the idea.
..."While psionically invisible, persons trying to target the combat Precog must first; spend an attack and succeed at rolling to hit to actually target the character.
A miss requires the attacker to repeat this process to be able to select the Combat precog as a Target. The attacks that are spent trying to target the
combat precog are wasted"...
I think I will.
1. does this work on someone inside power armor? I don't think so.
2. As Nekira Sudacne pointed out a "group mind block" can cancel a psychic's ability.
as a side effect I may modify how the class bonuses work...
treat a portion of the bonuses as Special training, that can't be penalized by mind block or psi-resistant armor.
if I instead convert the whole thing to a sort of super-power though...
opposition and outcry seems to stop.

...I need to think about this. is the character rendered powerless and an easy target to grease with MDC weapons...
or not.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 10:38 am
  

Dungeon Crawler

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as "sixth sense", "intuitive combat", are just "sensitive powers"...
and these are just minor powers: "lightning reflexes", "heightened sense of awareness" tend to cover what I envision as the bonuses for this ability.
the character is encouraged to be as fast as possible as a martial artist and to have trained their reflexes beyond normal limits...
... seems like the major power, "natural combat" with some abilities like automatic proficiency with combat skills and all weapons gets sawed off.

I am at a tad of a conundrum.

The Real world S.A.P. + "S.A.P." (special access program + sensitive asset protection) was a "Psychic" agent program. the agents had to be/exhibit "precognitive" ability and they had to be trained for years before, during and after in "speed" martial arts. methodology like, "Strike first!" "one shot, one kill!" no MMA ********. no grappling. no wrestling.
the whole point? HIT THEM FIRST, MAKE THEM SORRY, MAKE THEM CRY, GAME OVER.
all of the above, accelerated by real psionic ability: threat analysis, identifying the enemy, and then... Solving the problem, with brutal finality.

let's say, you are an "Anti-nuke activist" and you plot to break into a military base, get through all the layers of security, to reach a nuclear device with the intent to set it off, (oh you cad, you cute widdle terrorist you, mommy must be so proud). The Precog already knows you are coming. The precog knows that you used a friendship to get invited on base, borrowed your idiot enlisted guy's car (you said to go to a junk-food-store) to drive into a restricted area, then you cut a fence or two, or three, or five... triggered a microwave sensor, a seismic sensor, magnetic sensors, are watched by tiny cctv cameras, a drone at 35,000 ft, they watch you enter a secure building by breaking a monitored electronic door lock, trigger a sonic volume quantifier alarm, get scanned by an X-ray "back scatter" radiation wall panel, the security computers have I.D. on your gait, facial recognition and voice print. the security computers know every last bit of "kit" you are carrying, have looked through you bank history and tracked all or your purchase, looked through your I.S.P. (internet service) and tracked everything you've done, looked through your phone records at everything you've ever said...
The Elite select security forces guys are already there, waiting to arrest your dumbass. if you should SOMEHOW get past them alive...

The combat precog agent is already there waiting for you, ready to kick your ass. ready to kick your ass so hard that his or her toes get an honorary D.D.S. degree in dentistry.
if you are dead... you've just disappeared.
if you are still somehow alive... you've just disappeared.

that's S.A.P. ... sensitive asset protection.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 10:48 am
  

Dungeon Crawler

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so is the character psychic? super powered? both, some kind of hybrid? ... how do we make this P.C.C. do what it is able to do?
how do we write it to fit RIFTS rules, but not allow it to be rendered meaningless by the casual "mind block" or power armor...

I think I will have to do the "hybrid superpower" angle. your thoughts?


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 11:14 am
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
I think one issue is: You're trying to come up with some kind of "Hyperwareness" so someone always knows there is an attack coming. but the class with that already exists, it is the basic Juicer (and variants). They already have "Hyper Awareness" that allows them to never be attacked by surprise, period. Invisible, camouflaged, shooting from 2 miles away, all the above? dosen't matter. they still autododge. You're going to a lot of attempts to put peices togeather to just say "Can never be attacked by Suprise", but if so, you need to specify that just in and of itself. You can justify it as a blending of those powers, super or psionic, but none of them actually do what you want it to do, which is just give them an automatic dodge vs all attacks. speaking of, the Psionic version doesn't give them an autododge in the first place. Only the lightning reflexes option does.

as for superpowers vs. psionics, that really, really depends on what setting you are making this for. Superpowers should not generally be introduced as an OCC ability in non HU settings without good reason, and posting it in this forum does not indicate what setting you had in mind, nor has anything you said. Though your mention of Internet Service does indicate it's probablly a modern, HU style setting, but the PCC indicates...Nightbane? HU?

How it's built really depends on which setting.

_________________
Sometimes, you're like a beacon of light in the darkness, giving me some hope for humankind. ~ Killer Cyborg

You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 11:50 am
  

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against power creep though,

Can't have a psychic, gaining and learning more psychic powers with levels - IF...
you have one major and three minor SUPER POWERS starting with 7 attacks, and some GNARLY bonuses at level one!

Major: Natural combat ability (HU2, page 284)
Minor: (EXpp HU2 232)
1. Heightened sense of awareness (PU1, page 30)
2. Lightning reflexes (PU1, page 34)
3. Extraordinary P.P. (Hu2 232)
... but sigh, not "Sidestep" (PU2, page 94)

I mean for real. Stack those bonuses up! let's look at it, the totals I come up with are;
+2d4 to P.P. which may affect Strike, Parry, dodge, certain skills (and more?)
+5d4 to Spd, which, if high enough can affect dodge!
+7 attacks, +more w/levels
+6 init, +more w/levels
+2 disarm (+1 entangle) both are +more w/levels
+4 pull punch +more w/levels
+4 roll with punch, fall, impact. +more w/levels
+3 vs horror factor +more w/levels
+1 Vs Possession and mind control +more w/levels.
you have 2 Auto dodges with a +3 bonus. do not cost actions.
You have 2 additional auto dodges with no bonus. do not cost actions.
You are Never surprised, even from behind!
You do 1d6+2 on a normal punch in HU2 world, (*maybe MEGA DAMAGE in rifts!)
Paired weapons and W.P. paired weapons
jump 10ft high and 15ft long
may K.O. on a roll of 19-20.
Backflip: 72% +2% w/level
Exceptional balance: 70% +2% w/level
and, +10% on physical skills heavily based on agility, quickness, balance, and speed;
Acrobatics, Climb, Gymnastics, Prowl, etc.

(*and much more, but you will need the books for yourself to find out)

This is TOO MUCH power to start a regular Joe Psychic with...
also, it doesn't have anything to do with Precognition, and thus
doesn't reflect the character class I am trying to write.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 11:53 am
  

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let's compare the above to the psionic powers...


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 12:24 pm
  

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let's look at: sixth sense and intuitive combat ala RUE.

Intuitive combat RUE, page 173. bonuses are:
+3 initiative
+1 strike
+1 parry
+4 dodge
+2 roll with punch, fall, impact
+2 disarm
Can not be caught by surprise, not from behind, not from long range,
He or she can try to parry or dodge all attacks leveled at him.
+10% to abilities (balance, etc.) from Acrobatics and gymnastics
+10% to climb and Swim
NOTES:
This power normally requires a whole 15 second round to enter a zen-like state to activate.
This power specifically states that You can't use any other psionic power including MIND BLOCK!*
*now, this does catch my attention. an in the TEXT of the book WRITEN, "mindblock no work on you!"

Sixth sense RUE page 177 (technically 176, but only a sentence and label at the botom corner of the page.)
NOTE: *Places a 90ft range limit on this power! what?
NOTE: *You get the warning "tingles", but have no idea what the danger is, upto 60 seconds out! what?
NOTE: *this power is a reflex response, and is *NOT* controlled by the player! (that's okay.)
NOTE: *this power doesn't work if you have exhausted your I.S.P. (that's okay. defeats the purpose of "Always on" though.)
NOTE: *Bonuses only apply for the first round of the ACTUAL IMMINENT DANGER and then END! WHAT? no, not right for the P.C.C.
the bonuses are:
+6 initiative
+2 parry
+3 dodge
cannot be surprised, even from behind.

to add these two together (*if we could) we get:
+9 intiative
+1 strike
+3 parry
+7 dodge
+2 roll with punch, fall, impact
+2 disarm
Can not be caught by surprise, not from behind, not from long range,
He or she can try to parry or dodge all attacks leveled at him.
+10% to abilities (balance, etc.) from Acrobatics and gymnastics.
+10% to climb and Swim.
And can't use any other powers including MIND BLOCK.

So, I need to do some tweaking and revising.
as a technicality, a normal psychic from any palladium book I feel should be able to;
a. get the warning tingle...
b. activate intuitive combat...
but, this doesn't allow the bonuses to stack, and it may also impair your ability to warn the ally
if the ALLY is the one who will be in danger.

(*sighs) I need to do another rewrite of this P.C.C.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 12:38 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
POINT 1: none of them actually do what you want it to do, which is just give them an automatic dodge vs all attacks. speaking of, the Psionic version doesn't give them an autododge.
POINT 2: Superpowers should not generally be introduced as an OCC ability in non HU settings without good reason.
POINT 3:which campaign setting is it going to be for?


I am Sorry for the "snipping" of your quote, but I needed to get to your points and address them clearly. Here I go:
POINT 1: "Automatic Dodge ALL", while this is something I envision, it isn't possible even for these highly trained government psychics! I will have to reduce this to "one automatic dodge per round with the characters full bonuses" and any dodges you make will also use your full bonuses, *BUT will have to cost actions. Therefore, this isn't a super power. we have reduced the power of the concept to something doable by a regular (albeit psychic) joe.
POINT 2: agreed. this P.C.C. can't have super powers.
POINT 3: can we say, "this P.C.C. is written for all palladium game settings that include psionics" (maybe this rules out RECON, I do not know)?

Thank you. I need to keep at this and I am so glad to have your help!


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 12:47 pm
  

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Monk

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Sorry for snipping a lot of stuff back, but this conversation will get unweildy if we don't.

one automatic dodge per melee round? I'm not sure why it would be limited. Also:

psiandco wrote:
you have 2 Auto dodges with a +3 bonus. do not cost actions.
You have 2 additional auto dodges with no bonus. do not cost actions.


I think you may misunderstand how Automatic dodge works in the first place. You are never limited to one a round, or two, or four. If you have an automatic dodge, you may select automatic dodge in place of regular dodge at any time. These dodges do not benefit from ordinary bonuses to dodge, just P.P. and any bonuses specifically to automatic dodge, and they stack.

So for the P.C.C., they would get automatic dodge, but as nothing they have gives bonuses to automatic dodge, they can choose to against an attack, any attack, at any time, but they may wish to choose not to, preferring to parry or dodge for the higher bonuses.

For the Superpowered option you laid out, They would have Automatic dodge at P.P. + 6 vs. all attacks. the bonuses from P.P. and Lightning Reflexes stack.

I think you were reading "gains an automatic dodge" a bit too littearlly. It does not mean they can dodge a singular attack without taking an action, it means they gain automatic dodge, which they can select vs. an attack that can be dodged, at any time, any number of times per round.

_________________
Sometimes, you're like a beacon of light in the darkness, giving me some hope for humankind. ~ Killer Cyborg

You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 12:57 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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on dodging close range "Shooters"...
normally, this is SEVERELY penalized, as it applies to "normies" who are waiting for their normal senses (sight and hearing) to send info to the brain, the brain to process the info, and then make the body react. This is NOT the case for this P.C.C. having a precognitive consciousness means that you are already aware and acting in a frame of time an Instant before what all normies call "the present".

The precognitive agent, "intuitively Knows" up to six seconds ahead of time, and during these seconds is able to respond to the threat.
You aren't trying to dodge a lightspeed laser, Mach 7 U.S. Navy Railgun, or even a 9mm pistol muzzle velocity of 1,246.7 feet per second (380.0 m/s).
You *ARE* dodging the shooter though, the guy who is thinking about it, drawing the gun, (aiming?) and firing.

As long as you go first, most dangers and threats aimed at you... don't stand a chance, if you are trying to avoid it!


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 1:05 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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I started doing research on how to defeat a "precognitive superhero".
these things point out;
a. A threat they can't perceive, such as an "odorless, colorless, Gas"
b. A non-threat, that becomes a threat that is TOO BIG for them to avoid. (Walking under a huge trapeze net that suddenly falls, and it would take more than six seconds of running to dodge... THAT'S ONE BIG A** NET! for example.)


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 1:12 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Sorry for snipping a lot of stuff back, but this conversation will get unweildy if we don't.
one automatic dodge per melee round? I'm not sure why it would be limited. Also:
psiandco wrote:
you have 2 Auto dodges with a +3 bonus. do not cost actions.
You have 2 additional auto dodges with no bonus. do not cost actions.

I think you may misunderstand how Automatic dodge works in the first place. You are never limited to one a round, or two, or four. If you have an automatic dodge, you may select automatic dodge in place of regular dodge at any time. These dodges do not benefit from ordinary bonuses to dodge, just P.P. and any bonuses specifically to automatic dodge, and they stack.
So for the P.C.C., they would get automatic dodge, but as nothing they have gives bonuses to automatic dodge, they can choose to against an attack, any attack, at any time, but they may wish to choose not to, preferring to parry or dodge for the higher bonuses.
For the Superpowered option you laid out, They would have Automatic dodge at P.P. + 6 vs. all attacks. the bonuses from P.P. and Lightning Reflexes stack.
I think you were reading "gains an automatic dodge" a bit too littearlly. It does not mean they can dodge a singular attack without taking an action, it means they gain automatic dodge, which they can select vs. an attack that can be dodged, at any time, any number of times per round.


and you've got me here. You are right. I did fail to understand automatic dodge.
To stay in the realm of realism, I think the P.C.C. needs to specifically get "Only one automatic dodge (at no cost in actions) each 15 second round", and can "Aways dodge with their full bonuses applied and suffer no penalties to the attempted dodges regardless of situation"
does the above wording work with the rules? would that be okay?

I want the P.C.C. Combat Precognitive Agent (*Lol, a "CPA"! [yet, another example of further acronym deception]) to have an edge. to have a clear "psionic" advantage, but not be overpowered. I feel that UNLIMITED DODGING would be humanly impossible.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 4:00 pm
  

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Monk

Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2003 7:22 pm
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Location: 2nd Degree Black Belt of Post Fu
Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
I think just one would be too unrealistic. It's not unprecidented. I will note the Lanotaur Hunters from Psyscape are a race who naturally have the exact ability you are trying to describe. It's called Combat Awareness, and it lets them know what opponents are going to do before they do. And it gives them a nice bonus to dodge racially and also an automatic dodge that has no bonuses but does not take an attack, and has no per-turn limit.

your class could/should be based on the Lanotaur hunters, I think, and basically a project to try to instill the same abilities in a human.

_________________
Sometimes, you're like a beacon of light in the darkness, giving me some hope for humankind. ~ Killer Cyborg

You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 6:58 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Your class could/should be based on the Lanotaur hunters, I think, and basically a project to try to instill the same abilities in a human.


Hang on! (*Gets out his copy and reads it. (*Psycape, starting page 124.*)
The P.C.C. Combat Precognitive agent doesn't get "sense magic, sense supernatural, sense psionics" like the psi-stalkers do. they just don't. The player's can buy these powers with slots for sensitive psionic powers, but these powers aren't innate to the P.C.C. Combat precognitive agent. however, Precognition (in all of its forms) are Key/Central to the concept. The psionic powers; Precognition, clairvoyance, sixth sense, and intuitive combat regularly tap into "knowledge of the future" and no the powers of empathy, and understanding body language are not the same as "KNOWING" the future.

The Lanotaur bonuses:
Add four (yes, four) additional attacks per melee round,
+8 on initiative,
+4 to strike,
+5 to parry,
+7 to dodge,
automatic dodge on all attacks including those from behind,
+3 to disarm,
+5 to pull punch,
+4 to roll with impact or fall,
+6 to save vs Horror Factor and
+2 to save vs non-lethal and lethal poisons.

While the text of the Lanotaur "psychic reflexes" and "Psychic combat awareness" come close in some respects, there are others that just do not apply.
The P.C.C. combat precognitive agent is not dependent on seeing you strike a pose (body language) nor scent, hearing, motion sensing back hair, and definitely not an empathic nor a telepathic connection (for those behind it). This is "Precognition" sensing the future, intuitive knowledge of the future, visions of the future, and shifting future probability in your favor due to "Observation changing the outcome". I hate to say this, but an equally trained CPA ought to be MORE powerful than the lanotaur, because of Precognition...
no, not a Certified Public Accountant. I am talking about the Combat Precognitive Agent.

The CPA doesn't need to see an enemy, or hear them, or feel their emotions, or read the enemy's mind. these senses just do not apply. Deaf, Blind, Unable to smell, psychopathic lack of empathy, never seeing the target, being "head-blind" or unable to use "Telepathy"... The CPA can still dodge SNIPERS from 2 KM away, hell he could dodge a missile or rail gun from 100 miles away!

***************
Wait. I think I get it. you are telling me; "A. here is the text you might want to approximate" and "B. Don't be afraid to make them powerful."
You are right. there is no game balance when one guy could be permanently stuck with a 6 physical strength, and another can go toe to toe with a 10K forklift!
Some characters, will use their brains and skills to save the day. while other characters will have no other choice but to "get in there" and wrestle against a hill sized earth elemental.

The combat precog, is a fighter, but one that uses a special psionic ability that few others truly understand as they do. a true "Combat Precognition".


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 7:16 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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I think I see how the Lanotaur can be equal to juicers... they are NATURAL juicers, their mind over body racial power makes them invisible to Infra red, theremal, reduces any scent, they can automatically fool technology based "Lie detectors"...

Should I do something like that to the CPA? I don't think so. They may be Martial artists, and they are TRUE Precogs, but they aren't juicers.
They will have very impressive bonuses, but they aren't going to be "better" than a delphi juicer at everything.
The P.C.C. CPA, has *ONE* power. one advantage, and that is precognition. they don't have a Juicer's strength, endurance, and speed.
However, due to their precognition and speed martial arts training... the CPA could reasonably match the Juicer's reflexes.

In a fight, the CPA could dodge a juicer's attacks, but probably not parry as the CPA doesn't have enhanced strength. The CPA would be on an equal footing for a while, but the juicer by comparison does not get tired, where the cpa will run out of stamina.

Rifts earth CPA training quote, "don't try to block an attack who can inflict MEGA DAMAGE, all that will do is turn your blocking limb (arm or leg) into a splatter of ketchup. the way a psychic survives? just don't get hit!"


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 7:40 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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Basic juicer bonuses, from Rifts Ultimate edition page 79.
"an accelerated metabolism makes everything around the juicer seem to move in slow motion."
+2 attacks per melee round.
+4 initiative
+2 perception
+2 disarm
+3 roll with
+2 pull punch
+2 disarm
Automatic dodge on all attacks even from surprise and behind.
at no cost in actions/attacks. Normal dodge bonuses do not apply,
but P.P. modifiers do. The juicer is +1 to autododge at higher levels.
+4 vs psionics,
+6 vs Mind control.

It seems clear to me that I need to write up the P.C.C. CPA with a synthesis of these options;
1. Super powers
2. Psionic powers
3. Lanotaur bonuses
4. juicer bonuses

but restrict these bonuses, only to what is possible for a true precognitive +trained speed martial artist.
I'll get to work on this.
I may also want to "Future proof" this by guessing about the "Sneak peek" mentioned powers of Blind combat and other such, which may be coming soon.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 8:05 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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can a delphi juicer "stack" the Sixth sense or intuitive combat sensitive psionic power, with their martial arts, and being juiced? it seems the answer is "Yes"
So can a Crazy o.c.c.

despite the p.c.c. cpa not being juiced, they can have these bonuses because they are already acting "before" what we call the present.
not because of super enhancement.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2022 10:07 pm
  

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Explorer

Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2022 12:23 pm
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Location: The Motherland
It might be easier to take a step back away from giving him psionic powers (especially "always on" types) and approach it more like the Psi-Slinger from New West. That is, give him the abilities you want the class to possess, and simply describe them as being psionic in nature. There's no real need to exactly duplicate any powers and, indeed, there's even a few psychic-based classes that don't have any traditional powers at all, such as the aforementioned Psi-Slinger.

I think it'd be a lot easier building the class that way, then if they still feel like they're missing something, tacking on a few minor powers.


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Unread postPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2022 1:42 am
  

Dungeon Crawler

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I am already starting to envision a bts2 book centering on secret gov programs. An agency with specialized team members.

Cpa: you are precog body guards for Sensitive asset personnel... and Strike agent para-fighters.
Control: you psychically detect, identify, track, and send teams to eradicate supernatural threats. You often "go with" to make sure there are no "ones that got away"
Deacon: you are a military chaplain, who fights the supernatural with your faith in god. in addition to all the normal stuff you do; counseling, community outreach, helping the weakest links get to the help they need, team morale, monitoring team psych fitness for further missions, etc.
Orderly: you are the muscle who deals with the aftermath. Part mental health services and social worker. It is your job to shuffle survivors into the system.
The adults into jail or mental health, and the kids into foster/group homes. powers: physical psychics who have mastered "histrionic strength".
PR dept: it is your job to document the truth for the agency, build the intelligence (bestiary and ways to fight X), as well as to provide the media with proper cover stories everyone will forget in a few days. You have some hypnosis to make others agree with you and report what YOU SAY to report.
Recruitment: you identify real talent and make them an offer they can't refuse. A kickass paying job to do "what?"
Shades: you blend telepathy and hypnosis, your job is to wipe away evidence, and witness memories...
Striker: you are the guy with the guns, explosives, incendiaries, etc. to make sure a bad situation doesn't get worse. You like to talk about that one time your team had to fight off a brainwashed cultist horde, an entire nowhere town of 250... where anyone who stopped by disappeared.
Transit: you drive the large rv like gov hazmat van, that delivers teams to strike sites. Some vans hide magic circles of teleportation, odd how no one notices that 120 some odd paramilitary goons in jumpsuits all came out from one RV. there are also, smaller vans for "Strike teams".

but is it really government? or a private industry concern?
The "technology suppression teams" could be how the Agency is actually financially supported.
imagine the scenario, "Yes sir. We got them. the so-called inventor has been revealed as a fraud, and the prototypes are in our custody. no you can't have them. now... You like selling fossil fuels. we like having a global order that doesn't suddenly experience 75% unemployment and World War three. The question now is, how much are you willing to part with to make sure this Cheap, easy to make, affordable, revolutionary, anti-gravity tech disappear and stay disappeared? now, now, sir. fossil fuels is a multi-trillion dollar industry, can't you afford to be a bit more generous than that? oh, yes. yes sir. that will do just fine."


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Unread postPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 7:18 am
  

Dungeon Crawler

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:00 am
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I just realized that I had tapped into a stream of consciousness, and this pcc is the cyber-knight without armor, cybernetics, Psionic swords and shields.

The special ability I have been trying to define is no less than cyber-kinetic Zen combat. The question now is; does the game need a major/master Psionic who has such gifts?

How to do it?
Chakra slots. This psionicist prepares each day through meditation and selects powers to place in the chakra he has access to. The slotted power is either given an extended duration (until you next complete your daily preparation) or held ready for use at a greatly reduced cost.
The psionicist gains a chakra at first level and third level, and every three levels there after (6, 9, 12, and 15)

I think this will work...


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Unread postPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2022 7:34 pm
  

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If I do write this and submit it...
I will have to give it the ability to IGNORE the limiting text.


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Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 8:51 pm
  

Dungeon Crawler

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Beyond the supernatural 2: the Combat Precognitive Agent. This is a primitive, independent, evolution, of something "like" (but is clearly not) a pre-rifts cyber-knight. Design will match the power level of other bts2 psychics. It will also feature power/bonuses that scale with the presence of the supernatural.

Heroes unlimited 2: Psionic sub-category, "combat precog" will be a Psionic character with a unique specialization, focus, and class features.

Rifts: after the disaster of trying to help tolkeen, after trying to protect the innocent victims of the genocidal coalition... "Former cyber-knights" found their own "Order" in the ruins of the winnemucca (spelling?) Arcology. A monastic order of Psionic monks, called "Mentu" or "Mentu warriors" by outsiders. While they strive to uphold the same ideals of the cyber-knights, they won't withhold their aid from any innocent because of "political concerns" ...
They view lord Coakes reasons for refusing to aid the people of Tolkeen as a failure to serve the ideals of chivalry selflessly.
As the Mentu order has gone on its own path, is founded by rogue students who didn't complete cyber-knight training, and they don't have access to cybernetics... They are a different way. They are a different psychic character class.


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