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Unread postPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:51 pm
  

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Wanderer

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As I have interpreted from what little we have to go on Splugorth are by and large interdimensional conquers trying to spread their influence as far and wide as possible through whatever means they have available. The only real examples he have are older empires in the 3 galaxies and 2 up and commers, one in Center and one in Atlantis. From the description in Dimension book 14 it seems Desslyth once controlled a large portion of the known Thundercloud galaxy but as advanced age and poor health have crept on him his and he has lost his edge. What I really want an opinions on is how powerful and large could a Splugorth kingdom/Empire get whether they are in the same reality or not? If they are from a far enough away reality or otherwise is it possible they have never heard of Center or Atlantis or have different minion species. Please share your thoughts.


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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 3:37 pm
  

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Knight

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I think they can be as powerful as you want them to be. I know that sounds like a cop out, but I mean it. They can range in power level, and in domination of a galaxy or universe based on where they are located.

A different individual spul could easily have more or different minions, as well as access to more or different magical upgrades and transformations.

I played in a game that had an ancient gold Spulg who was part of a godly pantheon. They aren't that different from some of the weirder gods out there.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 8:33 pm
  

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Anything from a one-hick metropolis to an entire UNIVERSE dedicated to the praise and servicing of their resident Splugorth god.

Plus there might be a quite a few disenfranchised Splug wandering out there with little but the slime on their backs and a yearning for an empire. They might be young ones looking to establish themselves, or down-on-their-luck splugs who got tossed from their digs by other splugs, minion uprisings, other evil entities, or, of course, those meddling kids.

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"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
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Unread postPosted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 3:13 am
  

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As far as I know we only have 3 demographic breakdowns for the Splugies (WB2 of course but DB2 Phase World and DB5 Anvil) and only WB2 and WB21 have actually minions described. Am I missing any?

But, there is no reason why you couldn't create new minions for them. Now I have always thought that the "Elite Classes of Minions" would be mostly in common between all Splugies simply because the races are listed as being mystically connected to them and/or have been with them for millennia. But there is no reason that at least a few Splugies would not have some or any of these.

As far as I know they have never even described the additional worlds that Splyncryth controls so lots of room for new minions.

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Unread postPosted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 6:35 pm
  

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Knight

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Kregor were subjects at some point. Thundercloud has a lot of races that are/were subjects of Desslyth in the area. Below are a few of the races that are or were Desslyth's from Thundercloud.

Tsongkuba
Zuwadza

Shakdan
Kasaro
Bultungin

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Unread postPosted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 10:14 pm
  

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What I wanna know is who or what Billy-Bob the April Fools Rifter Splugorth had for minions? :clown:

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-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
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Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 3:25 am
  

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Palladin

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Comment: Palladium Books Canon is set solely by Kevin Siembieda, either in person, or by his approval of published material.
Remember. Before later authors retconned them into 'generic stock' the Kittani were the personal minions of Splyncryth. So were the Kyndians.
He found those races and picked them up.
So going by Atlantis a "young minor lord"
has 2 minion races
a few *billion* minions
A million or three rune weapons
...and he is considered to be 'young' and 'relatively minor'

Now look at Pantheons. Another Lord invaded the dimensional realm of the Pantheon of India. Note that this is one of the top tier pantheons in the Megaverse with a guy who is one of the jailors for the Old Ones...
… that Splugorth proceeded to beat the crap out of the entire pantheon. And not only driving the survivors out of the realm. But capturing and/or killing a number of the other gods and goddesses in the process...up to and including nearly killing one of the major goddesses.

The guy in the Three Galaxies? His realm used to be bigger than the rest of the governments put together and the Khreeghor empire was just one of his pet races.

The Splugorth are NO JOKE.

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Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 1:52 pm
  

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eliakon wrote:
Remember. Before later authors retconned them into 'generic stock' the Kittani were the personal minions of Splyncryth. So were the Kyndians.
He found those races and picked them up.
So going by Atlantis a "young minor lord"
has 2 minion races
a few *billion* minions
A million or three rune weapons
...and he is considered to be 'young' and 'relatively minor'

To be honest this was always my biggest problem with DB 2 Phase World. Carella seemed to go really generic for a lot of his demographics and I'm not sure if he had really read the material in Atlantis before he put it in.

eliakon wrote:
Now look at Pantheons. Another Lord invaded the dimensional realm of the Pantheon of India. Note that this is one of the top tier pantheons in the Megaverse with a guy who is one of the jailors for the Old Ones...
… that Splugorth proceeded to beat the crap out of the entire pantheon. And not only driving the survivors out of the realm. But capturing and/or killing a number of the other gods and goddesses in the process...up to and including nearly killing one of the major goddesses.

The guy in the Three Galaxies? His realm used to be bigger than the rest of the governments put together and the Khreeghor empire was just one of his pet races.

The Splugorth are NO JOKE.

I think it even says in one of the Phase World Books that the current period in the Three Galaxies is a low point in the power of the Splugorth empires which is one of the reasons there is room for the rise of the CCW and TGE.

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Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:42 pm
  

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Knight

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eliakon wrote:
The guy in the Three Galaxies? His realm used to be bigger than the rest of the governments put together and the Khreeghor empire was just one of his pet races.

Was that a retcon? I thought the Kreeghor had managed to kill the Splugorth AI ruling them, thought I might be mixing them up with some other race freed from an AI.

Warshield73 wrote:
To be honest this was always my biggest problem with DB 2 Phase World. Carella seemed to go really generic for a lot of his demographics and I'm not sure if he had really read the material in Atlantis before he put it in.

It's the job of editors to assess things like that, so if Carella did misunderstand something, they went ahead and canonized it anyway.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 1:50 pm
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
It's a retcon in the Thundercloud Galaxy, though Eliakon oversells it. it says that Desslyth once ruled over 1/3 of the Thundercloud galaxy, which did make him that galaxy's local superpower but not exactly it's unquestioned master, and instead of killing him the Kreegor just broke free and started eating up Desslyth's empire for themselves so that now he only holds 9% of it's former glory, a reasonable prize but not overwhelming.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:27 pm
  

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Knight

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DB2p74 might still be true...
"managed to blow up the Splugorth intelligence that was in charge of their planet"
"the Splugorth lord who perished"

Perhaps this doesn't refer to Desslyth but rather to another Splugorth who worked under him? If he was in charged of 1/3 of Thundercloud it would seem strange to only describe him of being in charge of one planet. It wouldn't be unbelievable that a dumber and less experienced intelligence was his protegee and in charge of the Kreeghor project and only he was killed.

Also: would there be anything preventing High Lords from casting a Resurrection spell on a Splugorth after it is killed by explosives?


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Unread postPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2019 3:07 pm
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Axelmania wrote:
DB2p74 might still be true...
"managed to blow up the Splugorth intelligence that was in charge of their planet"
"the Splugorth lord who perished"

Perhaps this doesn't refer to Desslyth but rather to another Splugorth who worked under him? If he was in charged of 1/3 of Thundercloud it would seem strange to only describe him of being in charge of one planet. It wouldn't be unbelievable that a dumber and less experienced intelligence was his protegee and in charge of the Kreeghor project and only he was killed.

Also: would there be anything preventing High Lords from casting a Resurrection spell on a Splugorth after it is killed by explosives?


Checking the spell in Book of Magic....

"missing limbs will remain missing"

So Ressurection won't repair a body that's fundamentally destroyed beyond repair as it doesn't regenerate anything, and also needs a body to work with, so if the explosion was enough to blast him to tiny chunks, just having a random body part here or there is still beyond ressurection as the spell won't regrow a tenticle a new body, and if the explosion was enough to deal double the splurgorth's MDC, then they are vaporized and nothing at all would remain to be the target of any form of ressurection.

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Unread postPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:26 pm
  

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Knight

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They regrow tentacles in 72 hours so limbs aren't really a concern (weird you'd think the secondary tentacles might regrow faster than main since they have less MDC)

Do you remember where this thing about double MDC vaporizing someone and making it impossible for the resurrection spell to work can be found?

Each splugorth commands at least 200,000 High Lords and some of them are Shifter/Summoner types the latter meaning meaning Circle Master.

I'd have to think SOME of them have looked into Power Circles, if one uses Wonder (PF2p155) they can try resurrection once per 60 seconds (89% success) and will have about 6D6 attempts at it, depending on how long it takes a flaming unicorn horn to burn up.

I'm betting they grow unicorn horns in tanks to power stuff like this.

Makes me wonder... if a horn is possibly half-burnt every 3 minutes, could you cast some kind of healing/repair spell on the horn to make it last longer?

I assume something like casting Impervious to Fire on the horn would halt the circle (since it requires the horn to BURN) but perhaps you could extend the duration by doing something where the horn still takes damage, but more slowly, like a 1/2 damage from fire spell.


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Unread postPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:42 pm
  

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Axelmania wrote:
I'm betting they grow unicorn horns in tanks to power stuff like this..


I think you need to grow the whole unicorn, not selective tissues, to get the full magical benefit.
And vat-grown unicorns, whole or portions, would be like synthetic melange(if you've read the Dune books)...It may look the same, taste the same, but would have potentially ruinous effects if you try to use it like original free-range unicorn parts.

In fact, I can see some adventure factors; the dangers of buying and using 'genuine'( or is it?) black market unicorn horn, or 'new and improved' vat-grown unicorn horn.
Cue GM evilly rolling or BSing up some side effects as the players frantically try to convince him that they just SNIFFED the potion, not actually IMBIBED it.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 10, 2019 1:50 am
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Axelmania wrote:
They regrow tentacles in 72 hours so limbs aren't really a concern



If they're blown so only a part of a tenticle remains, then there's not enough left to bring back to life to start regenerating, is the point.

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You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 3:39 pm
  

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eliakon wrote:
Remember. Before later authors retconned them into 'generic stock' the Kittani were the personal minions of Splyncryth. So were the Kyndians.
He found those races and picked them up.

Although you are entirely correct about the Kittani having a special relationship with Splynncryth due to his personal involvement in their discovery (rescuing them from the Mechanoids some 38,000 years ago), the same is not true for the Kydians. If you read the description of the Kydians in WB2, it says that they were discovered by "the Splugorth" 53,000 years ago. Nowhere in their description does it specifically mention Splynncryth. From the plurality of saying they were discovered by "the Splugorth" it's safe to say that the Kydians have a minion presence in multiple Splugorth kingdoms, and it is reasonable to consider them 'generic stock' for the splugorth kingdoms at large.

Warshield73 wrote:
To be honest this was always my biggest problem with DB 2 Phase World. Carella seemed to go really generic for a lot of his demographics and I'm not sure if he had really read the material in Atlantis before he put it in.

Yeah, it always bothered me that Kittani are found in greater numbers and higher demographic percents in Splugorthian kingdoms in the Three Galaxies than they are found within Splynncryths minions. I guess that over 38,000 years, minions tend to move around, but still I would think that the kingdom that first made the pact with the Kittani would have the greatest numbers of them in his ranks.
WB2 cites 11% of the population of Atlantis is Kittani, while DB2 lists them as 25% of the Splugorthian population in the Three Galaxies. DB5 rolls it back to a reasonable a 2% Kittani listing in the demographics for the Kingdom of Rynncryyl. Then DB13 Fleets describes the Splugorth Fleets and spaceship crews as being mostly made up of Kittani, with Kittani leaders, and spaceships entirely of Kittani design. For that matter, every example of splugorthian equipment and vehicles published the dimension books are Kittani in origin.

Where is all the magic in the splugorth space fleets? If the everyday line soldier of the splugorthian armies comes standard with a PA that can cast Impervious to energy and a dozen other enchantments, why don't their space ships integrate magic like the Ark, and Sea Fin sea vessels found in WB7.
Where are the ruin statues, the romanticized classical architecture, the smooth rounded surfaces that remind me of a cleaner-rust-free Jabba the Hutt style.

That's why I made my own line of Splugorthian space ships (a few of which are posted elsewhere on this forum), and relegated the ships presented in DB13 Fleets to lesser Splugorthian powers.


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Unread postPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:58 pm
  

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
It's a retcon in the Thundercloud Galaxy, though Eliakon oversells it. it says that Desslyth once ruled over 1/3 of the Thundercloud galaxy, which did make him that galaxy's local superpower but not exactly it's unquestioned master, and instead of killing him the Kreegor just broke free and started eating up Desslyth's empire for themselves so that now he only holds 9% of it's former glory, a reasonable prize but not overwhelming.


Actually I just read over the Thundercloud galaxy introduction, and on page 10 it says that the Transgalactic conquest of Desslyth's territories within the Thundercloud galaxy is a recent development, and implies that all of the territory taken away from Desslyth (33% of the galaxy) has been captured in the last 250 years, starting a few decades after the Great War (the one that formed the CCW).
It also said that prior to this the Kreeghor avoided the Thundercloud galaxy due to the Splugorth presence there and were "wary of colonizing a galaxy inhabited by the Splugorth and their minion races". This seems to imply that Desslyth was not one of the Kreeghors original masters/slavers.

I always thought that the majority of the territory conquered by the Kreeghor Dominion (precursor of the TGE) were former Splugorthian worlds. The books say that the seeds of the empire were all former Splugorthian worlds, however it never explicit states how much territory they conquered from them in the early years. It seems plausible that one or more other Splugorthian Kingdoms were entirely taken out during these early Kreeghor rebellions, and that a sizable portion of TGE territory in the Corkscrew and Anvil galaxies came from their former Splugorth masters.
I think with all the territory the Kreghor have conquered since becoming independent, it is likely that the TGE controls more territory now than all the Splugorth kingdoms in the Three Galaxies put together had held prior to the rebellion.


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Unread postPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 10:44 pm
  

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Knight

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
If they're blown so only a part of a tenticle remains, then there's not enough left to bring back to life to start regenerating, is the point.

Resurrection mentions it doesn't regrow limbs, where does it say it doesn't rebuild torsos/heads?


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Unread postPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:00 pm
  

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Axelmania wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
If they're blown so only a part of a tenticle remains, then there's not enough left to bring back to life to start regenerating, is the point.

Resurrection mentions it doesn't regrow limbs, where does it say it doesn't rebuild torsos/heads?

I think Resurrection is pretty clear that if the head and torso aren't at least mostly intact then you can't use it.

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Unread postPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:56 pm
  

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BOM151 aside from "missing limbs will remain missing" I take it you might be deriving that from "not a regeneration process but a revitalization", but clearly if you are sealing shut gaping chest wounds, you are regenerating some flesh, so I think that only refers to regrowing severed/destroyed limbs.

BOM62 (Breath of Life) is similar: aside from the description implying that mouth/lungs must still be present, it doesn't say anything about any other required organs like heart/kidneys/liver/etc.

Should it saying it won't regrow limbs necessarily mean it can't regrow non-limb stuff like ears/nose?


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Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:50 am
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Axelmania wrote:
BOM151 aside from "missing limbs will remain missing" I take it you might be deriving that from "not a regeneration process but a revitalization", but clearly if you are sealing shut gaping chest wounds, you are regenerating some flesh, so I think that only refers to regrowing severed/destroyed limbs.

BOM62 (Breath of Life) is similar: aside from the description implying that mouth/lungs must still be present, it doesn't say anything about any other required organs like heart/kidneys/liver/etc.

Should it saying it won't regrow limbs necessarily mean it can't regrow non-limb stuff like ears/nose?


Yes, it does necessarily mean it can't regrow non-limbs either. it's pretty clear it doesn't regrow anything and requires an intact corpse. whatever is missing won't be there after, and if what's there can't really live on it's own, then it just isn't going to work period.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 9:56 pm
  

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Inability to regrow limbs does not mean an inability to regrow other parts. I'm not sure what rare kinds of death you're picturing in which cells have not been destroyed/lost.

Let's say for example, a vampire drinks every drop of blood dry whilst killing someone. Are they resurrected without any blood, because the spell doesn't "regenerate" lost blood?

The limitations you're talking about are more appropriate for the 13th level 275 PPE spell "Restore Life" which explicitly says "not so badly torn apart that not enough remains to repair and restore"

A note like "if the head brain, heart or lungs are missing, the character cannot be resurrected" (also from RL above) is not present in the 14th level spell costing 650 PPE.

Even if you do house-rule that you need brain/heart/lungs for resurrection too, you can regrow internal organs using the 15th level "Ley Line Restoration" spell, I'm sure there'd be a High Lord out there willing to permanently sacrifice 6D6x2 PPE to regrow any of those for Splynncryth, assuming that AIs even have organs like those. Splynncryth permanently losing ~14% of his PPE would be a pretty serious blow in that case, of course.


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Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:24 am
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
It does not indicate an ability to regrow other parts. You can't assume a spell regrows anything unless it says it does, and to assume Ressurection does without saying so is the definition of a houserule, as your saying the spell does something the spell does not say or indicate it regrows anything. Lack of ability to regrow X does not mean ability to regrow Y when Y is never mentioned, so it can't be assumed to be there, so the only canon reading is it doesn't regrow anything at all.

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You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 3:51 am
  

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Are you guys still talking about that severed tentacle resurrection thing?

That guy was blown up like 5-10,000 years ago, ... why are you even...

I mean Axlemania, if you want to take your party through an extended campaign into some ancient ruins on the Imperial Homeworld in search of a 5-10,000 year old decayed severed tentacle and try to perform some kind of weird necromantic ritual in order to raise the former Splugorth master of the Kreeghor, ... than

... actually that does sound like a pretty cool idea for a campaign.

I am sorry I doubted you.


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Unread postPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:13 am
  

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Knight

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
It does not indicate an ability to regrow other parts. You can't assume a spell regrows anything unless it says it does,

You shouldn't assume that it doesn't restore lost cells unless we're told it can't.

Damage pretty much assumes lost/destroyed parts, so HEALING that damage pretty much assumes replacement of those lost/destroyed parts.

If you want to make the argument that resurrection doesn't heal damage, and so it brings people back at whatever negative HP/MDC they were at when they died, and they promptly fall into a coma or die again: I'm 100% on board with you and could see healing spells as a prep/followup complement to resurrection.

If you want to however claim that there is a point at which damage is unhealable, please elaborate more on where you find that. How much MD is "utterly destroyed" for example?

Or is "utterly destroyed" even possible? Is anything truly destroyed, or just broken into progressively smaller pieces, chemically reacted, etc?

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Lack of ability to regrow X does not mean ability to regrow Y when Y is never mentioned, so it can't be assumed to be there, so the only canon reading is it doesn't regrow anything at all.

Whether or not it does seems like a moot point: Splugorth are pretty good at regrowing stuff by their lonesome.

Yes we are only given a 72 hour count for "limbs" which presumably only means their tentacles (main or secondary), meaning they may not be able to heal other stuff (protective eye spines, eye film cover, giant eye) once it is destroyed. Does that happen when they reach 0 MDC each, does that merely cripple them and it requires more to utterly destroy them? I'm not sure...

What specific locations are you thinking depleting to 0 would guarantee unresurrectability? Do you figure the eye is their brain? What if AIs are essentially 100% brain? Reducing robot MDC to 0 shut down bots, reducing MDC beings PE below 0 results in "death" but I'm not sure there's a clearly defined "and then this much more damage to your corpse means there isn't a corpse anymore and nothing left to resurrect".


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Unread postPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 7:05 am
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Axelmania wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
It does not indicate an ability to regrow other parts. You can't assume a spell regrows anything unless it says it does,

You shouldn't assume that it doesn't restore lost cells unless we're told it can't.

Damage pretty much assumes lost/destroyed parts, so HEALING that damage pretty much assumes replacement of those lost/destroyed parts.

If you want to make the argument that resurrection doesn't heal damage, and so it brings people back at whatever negative HP/MDC they were at when they died, and they promptly fall into a coma or die again: I'm 100% on board with you and could see healing spells as a prep/followup complement to resurrection.

If you want to however claim that there is a point at which damage is unhealable, please elaborate more on where you find that. How much MD is "utterly destroyed" for example?

Or is "utterly destroyed" even possible? Is anything truly destroyed, or just broken into progressively smaller pieces, chemically reacted, etc?

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Lack of ability to regrow X does not mean ability to regrow Y when Y is never mentioned, so it can't be assumed to be there, so the only canon reading is it doesn't regrow anything at all.

Whether or not it does seems like a moot point: Splugorth are pretty good at regrowing stuff by their lonesome.

Yes we are only given a 72 hour count for "limbs" which presumably only means their tentacles (main or secondary), meaning they may not be able to heal other stuff (protective eye spines, eye film cover, giant eye) once it is destroyed. Does that happen when they reach 0 MDC each, does that merely cripple them and it requires more to utterly destroy them? I'm not sure...

What specific locations are you thinking depleting to 0 would guarantee unresurrectability? Do you figure the eye is their brain? What if AIs are essentially 100% brain? Reducing robot MDC to 0 shut down bots, reducing MDC beings PE below 0 results in "death" but I'm not sure there's a clearly defined "and then this much more damage to your corpse means there isn't a corpse anymore and nothing left to resurrect".


Read the spell closer. "This is not a regeneration process but a revitalization"

It revitalizes dead people to life.

it regenerates nothing. it's right there in the spell.

Also, at no point I said reducing to 0 means ressurection does nothing. I said if all you have is a fragment of a tenticle, nothing in the spell would bring just that back to life, and trying to read that it would is just a houserule.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:04 pm
  

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I'd like to know what it is you think resurrection does besides changing dead to alive.

Do you think their current amount of HP or SDC changes unless that is specified?

Pg 38 of Rifts Africa has such a guideline for Set Typhon-Tanis' natural ability: they come back with 3D6 Hit Points and full SDC.

Since the spell doesn't mention that, do you figure they should come back at whatever negative HP they died at?

In the case of Set, here is what his ability says:
    also heals whatever it was that killed the character in the first place,
    but does not restore missing limbs or remove scars

LIMBS are the only restriction: so if someone died from having all their brain and all their internal organs being eaten, Set's resurrection should regrow all of those organs, since they are not limbs.

"Regeneration" sometimes specifically refers to the regrowth of limbs, rather than the regrowth of anything whatsoever. The regrowth of some types of body tissue is implied by most HP/SDC restoration abilities, as damage reflects losing those things.

If a healing spell can't restore certain ramifications of damage, it will usually say that. The mechanic reflecting lost bodily parts would be the damage, so repairing that damage before casting resurrection should make life possible once more.

I think you're possibly assuming certain things about Splugorth biology to think that somehow their main body is more important for resurrecting them than their tentacle would be.


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Unread postPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:38 am
  

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DD The Shmey wrote:
Are you guys still talking about that severed tentacle resurrection thing?

That guy was blown up like 5-10,000 years ago, ... why are you even...

I mean Axlemania, if you want to take your party through an extended campaign into some ancient ruins on the Imperial Homeworld in search of a 5-10,000 year old decayed severed tentacle and try to perform some kind of weird necromantic ritual in order to raise the former Splugorth master of the Kreeghor, ... than

... actually that does sound like a pretty cool idea for a campaign.

I am sorry I doubted you.


I would imagine that the Dweller Beneath probably got rid of any remains thousands of years ago.

Remember, even though most of them dont know it, the Kreeghor traded slavery to one Intelligence (a Splugorth) for slavery to another (Dweller Beneath).

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Unread postPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 2:38 am
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Axelmania wrote:
I'd like to know what it is you think resurrection does besides changing dead to alive.

Do you think their current amount of HP or SDC changes unless that is specified?

Pg 38 of Rifts Africa has such a guideline for Set Typhon-Tanis' natural ability: they come back with 3D6 Hit Points and full SDC.

Since the spell doesn't mention that, do you figure they should come back at whatever negative HP they died at?

In the case of Set, here is what his ability says:
    also heals whatever it was that killed the character in the first place,
    but does not restore missing limbs or remove scars

LIMBS are the only restriction: so if someone died from having all their brain and all their internal organs being eaten, Set's resurrection should regrow all of those organs, since they are not limbs.

"Regeneration" sometimes specifically refers to the regrowth of limbs, rather than the regrowth of anything whatsoever. The regrowth of some types of body tissue is implied by most HP/SDC restoration abilities, as damage reflects losing those things.

If a healing spell can't restore certain ramifications of damage, it will usually say that. The mechanic reflecting lost bodily parts would be the damage, so repairing that damage before casting resurrection should make life possible once more.

I think you're possibly assuming certain things about Splugorth biology to think that somehow their main body is more important for resurrecting them than their tentacle would be.


Don't you think all of that is kind of beside the point? I'm not quibbling over -10 HP or 0 HP or whatever, I said you can't take one tenticle and cast ressurection and get a full splurgorth out of it. Nothing you said leads me to even remotely beleive otherwise.

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Unread postPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 2:44 am
  

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Axelmania wrote:
I'd like to know what it is you think resurrection does besides changing dead to alive.

Do you think their current amount of HP or SDC changes unless that is specified?

Pg 38 of Rifts Africa has such a guideline for Set Typhon-Tanis' natural ability: they come back with 3D6 Hit Points and full SDC.

Since the spell doesn't mention that, do you figure they should come back at whatever negative HP they died at?

In the case of Set, here is what his ability says:
    also heals whatever it was that killed the character in the first place,
    but does not restore missing limbs or remove scars

LIMBS are the only restriction: so if someone died from having all their brain and all their internal organs being eaten, Set's resurrection should regrow all of those organs, since they are not limbs.

"Regeneration" sometimes specifically refers to the regrowth of limbs, rather than the regrowth of anything whatsoever. The regrowth of some types of body tissue is implied by most HP/SDC restoration abilities, as damage reflects losing those things.

If a healing spell can't restore certain ramifications of damage, it will usually say that. The mechanic reflecting lost bodily parts would be the damage, so repairing that damage before casting resurrection should make life possible once more.

I think you're possibly assuming certain things about Splugorth biology to think that somehow their main body is more important for resurrecting them than their tentacle would be.


Don't you think all of that is kind of beside the point? I'm not quibbling over -10 HP or 0 HP or whatever, I said you can't take one tenticle and cast ressurection and get a full splurgorth out of it. Nothing you said leads me to even remotely beleive otherwise.

I now want to make an immortaloty obsessed Splugorth trying to use biowizardry and/or gene-splicing to cross themselves with a starfish that can regrow the rest of the body from a single arm so that a single tentacle would be enough to let them survive.

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Unread postPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 11:45 pm
  

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Don't you think all of that is kind of beside the point? I'm not quibbling over -10 HP or 0 HP or whatever,

It very much is the point: I believe damage can represent the loss of certain bodily cells, and healing can represent the replacement of certain bodily cells.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
I said you can't take one tenticle and cast ressurection and get a full splurgorth out of it. Nothing you said leads me to even remotely beleive otherwise.

What do you think are the minimum requirements for that spell bringing someone back, and why?

dreicunan wrote:
I now want to make an immortaloty obsessed Splugorth trying to use biowizardry and/or gene-splicing to cross themselves with a starfish that can regrow the rest of the body from a single arm so that a single tentacle would be enough to let them survive.

Implying we know they don't already operate that way.

The idea here seems to be that after reduction of MDC to main body causes death (beyond negative PE usually, I would assume, like with HP) that at some fixed point, we can declare the damage to the main body to be so much that it can't be recovered from.

Mechanically speaking, Nekira's concept of "the body is gone, the tentacle is left" isn't even definable as far as I can see. Dead body is not nonexistent body.

Even "vapor" is composed of molecules, so unless we're told that "misting" prevents something from working (I recall something along those lines for HU mega-heroes) even misting shouldn't prevent it... if we actually knew at what amount of damage misting occurs, which I can't seem to recall ever knowing. How small a molecular clusture must something be before we consider it mist?

Are we considering this in the sense of "they're so super-heated they liquidified then gasifieid" or in the sense of "they're chopped into such small bits that the breeze lifts them into the atmosphere"?

Whatever the threshold for that is: resurrection only explicitly says it can't do limbs.


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Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:12 am
  

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Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Axelmania wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Don't you think all of that is kind of beside the point? I'm not quibbling over -10 HP or 0 HP or whatever,

It very much is the point: I believe damage can represent the loss of certain bodily cells, and healing can represent the replacement of certain bodily cells.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
I said you can't take one tenticle and cast ressurection and get a full splurgorth out of it. Nothing you said leads me to even remotely beleive otherwise.

What do you think are the minimum requirements for that spell bringing someone back, and why?


Well for one the reason I don't think the HP question is relevent because the spell itself says that it restores all Hit points missing, but also that it's not a process of regeneration.

So right there. It can heal hit points, but only to the extent regeneration is not required.

So the minimum requirements would be "Main body and all vital organs intact, including the head and neck and brain, assuming it's a race that has those seperate from the main body, as splurgorth don't seem to have a head and presmuably have their brain in the main body".

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Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2019 3:19 pm
  

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Nekira Sudacne wrote:
I don't think the HP question is relevent because the spell itself says that it restores all Hit points missing

What it actually says:
    has all Hit Points, memories, abilities, and skills that he had at the moment of his death

Hit Points at moment of death are not likely to be maximum hit points unless they suffer some sort of auto-death spell which ignores damage application entirely.

Someone with PE10 would usually have -11 HP at the moment of death, while someone with PE20 would usually have -21 HP at the moment of their death.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
but also that it's not a process of regeneration.

So right there. It can heal hit points, but only to the extent regeneration is not required.

So what is that extent? Where is that defined? Do you need regeneration to regrow lost skin? To regrow lost muscle? Whose regenerative capabilities are we judging this by?

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
So the minimum requirements would be "Main body and all vital organs intact, including the head and neck and brain, assuming it's a race that has those seperate from the main body, as splurgorth don't seem to have a head and presmuably have their brain in the main body".

We should avoid double-quote marks for something being written from scratch.

I'm not sure that Splugorth necessarily have a 'brain' at all. Think the 2017 film "Life" where EVERY CELL is a brain cell, for example.

Even if they did: how much damage does it take beyond causing someone's death to destroy their brain?


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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:29 am
  

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DD The Shmey wrote:
Warshield73 wrote:
To be honest this was always my biggest problem with DB 2 Phase World. Carella seemed to go really generic for a lot of his demographics and I'm not sure if he had really read the material in Atlantis before he put it in.

Yeah, it always bothered me that Kittani are found in greater numbers and higher demographic percents in Splugorthian kingdoms in the Three Galaxies than they are found within Splynncryths minions. I guess that over 38,000 years, minions tend to move around, but still I would think that the kingdom that first made the pact with the Kittani would have the greatest numbers of them in his ranks.
WB2 cites 11% of the population of Atlantis is Kittani, while DB2 lists them as 25% of the Splugorthian population in the Three Galaxies. DB5 rolls it back to a reasonable a 2% Kittani listing in the demographics for the Kingdom of Rynncryyl. Then DB13 Fleets describes the Splugorth Fleets and spaceship crews as being mostly made up of Kittani, with Kittani leaders, and spaceships entirely of Kittani design. For that matter, every example of splugorthian equipment and vehicles published the dimension books are Kittani in origin.

Where is all the magic in the splugorth space fleets? If the everyday line soldier of the splugorthian armies comes standard with a PA that can cast Impervious to energy and a dozen other enchantments, why don't their space ships integrate magic like the Ark, and Sea Fin sea vessels found in WB7.
Where are the ruin statues, the romanticized classical architecture, the smooth rounded surfaces that remind me of a cleaner-rust-free Jabba the Hutt style.

That's why I made my own line of Splugorthian space ships (a few of which are posted elsewhere on this forum), and relegated the ships presented in DB13 Fleets to lesser Splugorthian powers.


Well, if memory tricks me not, one of the Phaseworld books does mention the Kittani's central role in managing space fleet resources is something specific to Splugorth empires of the 3 Galaxies and a somewhat recent event, something of a "of push to adapt" on their part to debacles like the founding of the UWW, TGE and other changes in balance of power in the 3 Galaxies coming from the "mortal races". Not to mention the major presence of Naruni Enterprises might or not have had something to do with the growth of nations of the Sploogs "lessers" into actual rivals.

Anyway Splugorth empires elsewhere are probably very different. And definitely should not rely on Kittani - and Sunaj - so damn much.

(As an aside, what do Sunaj offer the Splugorth, they could not get from their Tattoo Warriors and some experimentation - beside the vicious joy of "helping" atlantean exterminate atlantean while rubbing it with salt on their faces, that is)


Last edited by SolCannibal on Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:37 am
  

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SolCannibal wrote:
[
Anyway Splugorth empires elsewhere are probably very different. And definitely should not rely on Kittani - and Sunaj - so damn much.


Agreed. I've been trying to create a few Splugorth kingdoms where the Kittani and the Sunaj are either a minority, or missing altogether in favor of other (and new) minion species.

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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:23 am
  

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taalismn wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
Anyway Splugorth empires elsewhere are probably very different. And definitely should not rely on Kittani - and Sunaj - so damn much.


Agreed. I've been trying to create a few Splugorth kingdoms where the Kittani and the Sunaj are either a minority, or missing altogether in favor of other (and new) minion species.


Me, i do simple things, so to speak, tweaking here and there from thee basics.

A Splugorth that really likes tattoo magic and because not only uses a lot of human and ogre slave/worshippers as troops but makes regular breeding and genetic experiments in an attempt to develop an optimized hybrid race, will capture any hominids or mutant human variants - like the psychic RCCs - it can catch in parallel earths for extra guinea pigs and occasionally pursues rumors of Chiang-ku dragons, or at least carcasses in good enough a state to experiment with cloning and such. It's also considering trying to create some twisted minion race (akin to Dyvval's Shock Dragons) out of some of the failures and partial successes of his "Chiang-Ku Recreation" project.

A second one that noticed how close some of the Errta's capacities were to those of a stone master and attempted to breed some smarter ones to use as minions.

A third that made a deal with Splynn that involves sending shipments of Adaroks to Azlum for "behaviour adjustment", who are then shipped back to this associate's dimension, who has been not only using them as troops but intends to study if the changes can be passed to their descendants, either by blood or upbringing.

Also had the one that fought the indian gods (and was somewhat helped by both Varuna and Kali) making use of Rakshasas, Dakinis & Daityas as support forces.

A little bit of this, a little bit of that - a little twists can go a long way with some imagery/history for other people to riff and improvise from.


Last edited by SolCannibal on Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:25 am
  

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SolCannibal wrote:
(As an aside, what do Sunaj offer the Splugorth, they could not get from their Tattoo Warriors and some experimentation - beside the vicious joy of "helping" atlantean exterminate atlantean while rubbing it with salt on their faces, that is)

I'm pretty sure that in Atlantis that this is the main reason given for the Splugorth helping the Sunaj. They get real joy in not just helping the Sunaj but also in mistreating the Sunaj in public.

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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:00 am
  

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Warshield73 wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
(As an aside, what do Sunaj offer the Splugorth, they could not get from their Tattoo Warriors and some experimentation - beside the vicious joy of "helping" atlantean exterminate atlantean while rubbing it with salt on their faces, that is)

I'm pretty sure that in Atlantis that this is the main reason given for the Splugorth helping the Sunaj. They get real joy in not just helping the Sunaj but also in mistreating the Sunaj in public.


Good to know i was not misremembering things. Hmm, just had a funky idea now dealing with this:

Splynn has a deal with clan Aerihman, is the only splugorth doing so and has been using & abusing them for a long time, just waiting for that great exposure to happen.

And it did - and at the same time did not, much to his puzzlement, shock and entertainment - because when one dead assassin was captured by the forces of one of his rivals and autopsy managed to identify it as a True Atlanteans, this rival concluded the Sunaj were cloned Atlanteans, such a delightfully wicked idea and procceded to make up his own "homegrown" Sunaj army.

After a few decades a number of other Splugorth also got on the secret and started to make their own, because it is entertaining way to mess with the True Atlanteans and all beings that respect and support them. Splynn doesn't know if this is incredibly frustrating or even more hilarious.

The "True" Sunaj themselves are definitely not amused, but with time have come to see advantages on this, as the "false Sunaj" provide their own facade with considerable cover, unwittingly helping to preserve clan Aerihman's dark secret. But also an ever growing host of people with the True Atlantean blood, but none of their brethen ignoble scruples and cosmic duty fantasies, for them to spy, exchange info, make allies and bring to their cause. Those other Splugorth are without even knowing providing clan Aehriman with an unique oportunity of growth - through covert contact, diplomacy and the acquisition of converts from the growing bands of "false Sunaj" in the service of Splugorth kingdoms all across the Megaverse.


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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:08 pm
  

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Random Splugorth Minion Generation Charts

“How was I supposed to know the Hr’rk were beholding to a Splugorth?! I thought the eyeball-squids only employed Kittani!!!”

As widespread as the Splugorth Alien Intelligences are, their retinues of followers/minions are more likely than not going to differ in composition from that of Splynncryth’s, especially with regard to species like the Kittani and the Sunaj. For those wanting a more diverse minion composition for their Splugorth domains, here are some general random roll charts to help flesh out the followings of the alien intelligences. Random roll or select attributes for the minion species(using the charts in Phaseworld, Aliens Unlimited, or PFRPG: Land of the Damned) and then roll (or pick) from the following:


A. Role

“We are the Guardians of the Municipal Cloaca! As our ancestors before us have served for unto three thousand generations, toiling in the undercity so that others may enjoy the Light of Our Lord Spaz’dyllath!”

What role does the species play in their Splugorth overlord’s domain?

01-30% Warriors----The minion species has a talent or trait that makes them good soldiers or assassins, the ones who are the spearhead and enforcers of the Splugorth organization.
31-40% Functionaries---The species possesses skills that make them well-suited to running the gears and organization of a society. They may be managers, linguists, scholars, salesmen, or technical personnel , but they keep materials moving, facilitate commerce, and make sure people and things go where they belong.
41-60% Artificers---The species has a talent for creating stuff, be it engraved gemstones or starships. This can extend to the sciences and magic. The Shakdan are a good example of a miinion species sharing this niche.
61-70% Gladiators----The species has some aspect that makes them particularly attractive and entertaining as pit-warriors. They may have a secondary role as soldiers(or not; they may have disciplinary problems taking orders in the field).
71-00% General Laborers---Whether it’s because of superior strength, endurance, environmental tolerances, or sheer fecundity that allows them overwhelm a task with sheer numbers, the species is employed as laborers. Subsets of this class may include ‘pets’(species whose value is their rarity, looks, or skills as entertainers),sex-workers, food-species, or component-species(slaves harvested for body parts).

B. Motivation
“Loot and pillage, set fires across the River of Stars? Perhaps we should be paying YOU for the honor you offer us, Lord Kly’lyth!”

What motivated the species to become minions?

01-40% Conquered People---The species was conquered by the Splugorth and forced at gunpoint to become minions. Their forced service still chafes at them, though many, especially those born into the slave society, resignedly accept their lot. Ryllians are a good example of this. +10% to the Relationship roll.

41-60% Altered---Going beyond Conquered, this species has been subsequently altered by magic or genetic means to become a dependent and better-adapted minion species. The species may be unable to function normally outside the Splugorth minion -society. The Lessons and Altarans are good examples of this.

61-80% Gratitude(LIfe Debt)----The minion-species is working off a life-debt for some great benediction laid upon their people by their Splugorth benefactor. This could be saving their species from a great disaster, protecting them from an enemy, or uplifting them from barbarism, but the species feels gratitude and is(for the most part) willing to work in the service of the Splugorth. The Kydians are typical of this. -20% to the Relationship roll,

81-00% Alliance of Convenience---The minion species willingly joined the service of the Splugorth because they liked what they saw, and saw the opportunity to advance the fortunes of their own people. The minions are willing to set aside some of their own independence to be part of what they see as a winning team, in return for the benefits to be supping at the Splugorth’s table. However, the species sees nothing wrong with working on their own agendas while still in service to their alien lord, and in the most extreme cases may ultimately be planning on betraying their Splugorth hosts when the latter’s usefulness has been used up. The Staphra and the Sunaj are good examples of such minions.

Note that there can exist combinations of the above motivations: the Splugorth Slavers and High Lords can be considered examples of WILLING Altered species that have become so modified that they are reliant on the presence of the Splugorth in order to survive; the High Lords, for example, have essentially become symbiotic to the Splugorth.


C. Relationship

“All Hail the Mighty Mono-Opticon, All-Seer of Fates, Perceiver of Sins, Punisher of Unsightliness! All Hail Lord Sely’yth!!!”
#”....’ Mighty Mono-Opticon’...?”#
“It’s something the high priests came up with to honor you, milord. I can have them executed for disrespect if it offends thee.”
#”No, that won’t be necessary. I was just...surprised...is all. Carry on.”#

How close are the minion species to their Splugorth masters?

01-40% Fanatically Loyal----The minions worship their alien intelligence overlord. There is virtually nothing that the Splugorth may ask or order ot its followers that the species will not do(or at least very seriously consider). Those VERY few who think otherwise and voice objections are seen and treated as insane or criminal.
41-70% Grudging----The species serves the Splugorth efficiently for the most part, but there is some irritation at the terms and conditions of their service. Minor disrespect of their Splugorth overlord is tolerated by the species, but more overt rebellion and dissent is seen as dangerously shaking the apple cart and punished accordingly, Outright rebellious behavior is treated as criminal roguery.
71-90% Resentful----The species regards its status in the Splugorth society as increasingly untenable, and there are frequent rumbles of discontent in the ranks. Small infractions in their ranks are hidden or overlooked, and there may be the organization of resistance or escape cells in the species’ society.
91-00% Rebellious----The species is more often than not willing to resist the orders and the dictates of their Splugorth overlords, There is a concerted effort throughout the species to alter their status and break the terms of their service. This can take the form of subtle coordinated sabotage of their assigned tasks and orders, an organized slave-escape system, and/or supply and weapons hoarding. Increasingly, the species has to be watched and more harshly penalized/disciplined by other minions.

D. (Optional) Regard
#”Be certain that you SUCCEED in carrying out my orders, seneschal. The last of your species to hold your current role did not. He did, however, prove DELICIOUS.”#

How does the Splugorth regard the species?

01-20% Trusted----The Splugorth trusts and favors the minion-species in its role, and sees any signs of rebellion as growing pains, or sporadic problems with individuals, rather than concerted efforts of the species as a whole(and thus is willing to cut the species some slack). In fact, such troubles may be seen as an opportunity to test the loyalty of the rest, and a source of entertainment.
21-75% Casual Disdain---The Splugorth generally remains aloof from the minion-species, taking an interest only when they prove exceptionally meritorious or troublesome. Otherwise, the species is treated with the same regard as office furniture .
76-90% Contemptuous---The Splugorth regards the species as generally untrustworthy without close supervision, and has assigned other minions to keep an eye on them. The Splugorth just needs the right provocation to go ahead and make some spectacular examples of individuals to cow the rest into obedience.
91-00% Outright Derision---The Splugorth sees the species as troublesome and requiring a firm hand(and locked shackles) to keep them in their place. Their constant behavior, be it openly rebellious or just sycophancy-annoying, is begging for some serious remediating by way of culling or wholesale physical alteration at some time in the near future. Casual execution of members of the species is commonplace.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:05 pm
  

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As a complete aside, can someone point me out some race of large (not quite giant like Rahu Men) four armed people thaat could make expies for the Shokan (Goro's) race from Mortal Kombat?


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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:13 pm
  

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SolCannibal wrote:
As a complete aside, can someone point me out some race of large (not quite giant like Rahu Men) four armed people thaat could make expies for the Shokan (Goro's) race from Mortal Kombat?

Offhand I don't know of any...there's a six-armed species(the Jeridu) in Land of the Damned, but they're more acrobat than muscle...You might have to take a muscular species like ogres or trolls and tack an extra set for arms on them(+1 APM) and add some extra P.S..

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:30 pm
  

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taalismn wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
As a complete aside, can someone point me out some race of large (not quite giant like Rahu Men) four armed people thaat could make expies for the Shokan (Goro's) race from Mortal Kombat?

Offhand I don't know of any...there's a six-armed species(the Jeridu) in Land of the Damned, but they're more acrobat than muscle...You might have to take a muscular species like ogres or trolls and tack an extra set for arms on them(+1 APM) and add some extra P.S..


All right. Using with an already existing one would have been a fun easter egg of sorts, but it happens.
Back to the brewing cauldron!

(Alternatively, i could make a literally larger than life parody using Rahu Man and other giant races. Could even mash into my Giant Empire in Greenland, hmmmm....)


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Unread postPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:50 pm
  

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SolCannibal wrote:
[

(Alternatively, i could make a literally larger than life parody using Rahu Man and other giant races. Could even mash into my Giant Empire in Greenland, hmmmm....)


In that case I'd go with a Gigante, since their random mutation table allows for multiple limbs.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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Unread postPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:30 am
  

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Hero

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taalismn wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
[

(Alternatively, i could make a literally larger than life parody using Rahu Man and other giant races. Could even mash into my Giant Empire in Greenland, hmmmm....)


In that case I'd go with a Gigante, since their random mutation table allows for multiple limbs.


That's certainly an option too - in fact that table could be used to make many of MK races as competing clans or family lines within the empire's power pyramid. Yeaah, that could add some interesting angles to the nation's society and politics.


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Unread postPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:32 am
  

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Comment: Palladium Books Canon is set solely by Kevin Siembieda, either in person, or by his approval of published material.
SolCannibal wrote:
taalismn wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
As a complete aside, can someone point me out some race of large (not quite giant like Rahu Men) four armed people thaat could make expies for the Shokan (Goro's) race from Mortal Kombat?

Offhand I don't know of any...there's a six-armed species(the Jeridu) in Land of the Damned, but they're more acrobat than muscle...You might have to take a muscular species like ogres or trolls and tack an extra set for arms on them(+1 APM) and add some extra P.S..


All right. Using with an already existing one would have been a fun easter egg of sorts, but it happens.
Back to the brewing cauldron!

(Alternatively, i could make a literally larger than life parody using Rahu Man and other giant races. Could even mash into my Giant Empire in Greenland, hmmmm....)

What about Aliens Unlimited?
If the entire race has "extra arms" as its power... bam four armed race. You can even toss in Extraordinary Strength and Physical Endurance or whatever you like.
Since AU already talks about combining with Rifts your golden there too.

_________________
The rules are not a bludgeon with which to hammer a character into a game. They are a guide to how a group of friends can get together to weave a collective story that entertains everyone involved. We forget that at our peril.

Edmund Burke wrote:
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."


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Unread postPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:51 am
  

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Hero

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eliakon wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
taalismn wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
As a complete aside, can someone point me out some race of large (not quite giant like Rahu Men) four armed people thaat could make expies for the Shokan (Goro's) race from Mortal Kombat?

Offhand I don't know of any...there's a six-armed species(the Jeridu) in Land of the Damned, but they're more acrobat than muscle...You might have to take a muscular species like ogres or trolls and tack an extra set for arms on them(+1 APM) and add some extra P.S..


All right. Using with an already existing one would have been a fun easter egg of sorts, but it happens.
Back to the brewing cauldron!

(Alternatively, i could make a literally larger than life parody using Rahu Man and other giant races. Could even mash into my Giant Empire in Greenland, hmmmm....)

What about Aliens Unlimited?
If the entire race has "extra arms" as its power... bam four armed race. You can even toss in Extraordinary Strength and Physical Endurance or whatever you like.
Since AU already talks about combining with Rifts your golden there too.


Yeah, but considering my intent is making an adaptation of sorts of Goro's race, a fantasy one goes better, i guess.
Also Taalismn's suggestion of using Gigantes opened some very interesting options in blending with other creations of mine, so i'll probably go with that and see where it takes me.


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Unread postPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:28 pm
  

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Comment: You probably think this comment is about you, don't you?
SolCannibal wrote:
Warshield73 wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
(As an aside, what do Sunaj offer the Splugorth, they could not get from their Tattoo Warriors and some experimentation - beside the vicious joy of "helping" atlantean exterminate atlantean while rubbing it with salt on their faces, that is)

I'm pretty sure that in Atlantis that this is the main reason given for the Splugorth helping the Sunaj. They get real joy in not just helping the Sunaj but also in mistreating the Sunaj in public.


Good to know i was not misremembering things. Hmm, just had a funky idea now dealing with this:

Splynn has a deal with clan Aerihman, is the only splugorth doing so and has been using & abusing them for a long time, just waiting for that great exposure to happen.

And it did - and at the same time did not, much to his puzzlement, shock and entertainment - because when one dead assassin was captured by the forces of one of his rivals and autopsy managed to identify it as a True Atlanteans, this rival concluded the Sunaj were cloned Atlanteans, such a delightfully wicked idea and procceded to make up his own "homegrown" Sunaj army.

After a few decades a number of other Splugorth also got on the secret and started to make their own, because it is entertaining way to mess with the True Atlanteans and all beings that respect and support them. Splynn doesn't know if this is incredibly frustrating or even more hilarious.

The "True" Sunaj themselves are definitely not amused, but with time have come to see advantages on this, as the "false Sunaj" provide their own facade with considerable cover, unwittingly helping to preserve clan Aerihman's dark secret. But also an ever growing host of people with the True Atlantean blood, but none of their brethen ignoble scruples and cosmic duty fantasies, for them to spy, exchange info, make allies and bring to their cause. Those other Splugorth are without even knowing providing clan Aehriman with an unique oportunity of growth - through covert contact, diplomacy and the acquisition of converts from the growing bands of "false Sunaj" in the service of Splugorth kingdoms all across the Megaverse.


I like this idea because it actually does a decent job over filling in the plot hole of why no one has figured out the Aerihman clan are the Sunaj with something like Object Read or Object Read the Dead. Those that have tried have uncovered the clones and not the TAs.


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Unread postPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:34 pm
  

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Hero

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The Beast wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
Warshield73 wrote:
SolCannibal wrote:
(As an aside, what do Sunaj offer the Splugorth, they could not get from their Tattoo Warriors and some experimentation - beside the vicious joy of "helping" atlantean exterminate atlantean while rubbing it with salt on their faces, that is)

I'm pretty sure that in Atlantis that this is the main reason given for the Splugorth helping the Sunaj. They get real joy in not just helping the Sunaj but also in mistreating the Sunaj in public.


Good to know i was not misremembering things. Hmm, just had a funky idea now dealing with this:

Splynn has a deal with clan Aerihman, is the only splugorth doing so and has been using & abusing them for a long time, just waiting for that great exposure to happen.

And it did - and at the same time did not, much to his puzzlement, shock and entertainment - because when one dead assassin was captured by the forces of one of his rivals and autopsy managed to identify it as a True Atlanteans, this rival concluded the Sunaj were cloned Atlanteans, such a delightfully wicked idea and procceded to make up his own "homegrown" Sunaj army.

After a few decades a number of other Splugorth also got on the secret and started to make their own, because it is entertaining way to mess with the True Atlanteans and all beings that respect and support them. Splynn doesn't know if this is incredibly frustrating or even more hilarious.

The "True" Sunaj themselves are definitely not amused, but with time have come to see advantages on this, as the "false Sunaj" provide their own facade with considerable cover, unwittingly helping to preserve clan Aerihman's dark secret. But also an ever growing host of people with the True Atlantean blood, but none of their brethen ignoble scruples and cosmic duty fantasies, for them to spy, exchange info, make allies and bring to their cause. Those other Splugorth are without even knowing providing clan Aehriman with an unique oportunity of growth - through covert contact, diplomacy and the acquisition of converts from the growing bands of "false Sunaj" in the service of Splugorth kingdoms all across the Megaverse.


I like this idea because it actually does a decent job over filling in the plot hole of why no one has figured out the Aerihman clan are the Sunaj with something like Object Read or Object Read the Dead. Those that have tried have uncovered the clones and not the TAs.


That combined with the fact the Aerihman Sunaj make an effort to destroy their bodies in case of capture do end being quite helpful as cover by misdirection for their treacherous actions, at least for now.


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Unread postPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:26 pm
  

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On a little aside, while re-reading WB2, it really got my attention that Mind Bleeders are mentioned among the "Common divisions of O.C.C.s among True Atlanteans" along with Mind Melters. About 5% of the True Atlanteans are Mind Melters and 4% Mind Bleeders (no other psychics in noteworthy numbers, unless you count Mystics). Among the Aehriman the percentage rises to 6% each.

It got me thinking if the True Atlanteans might have some connection to the pressence of those two R.C.C.s amidst humanity too... Or if they have some rare, peculiar O.C.C.s that are mechanically close to either. PF has something called Mind Mage that is similar to the Mind Melter, no?


Also, how do you people feel about the idea of lesser minion alternatives to the Slavers or Blind Warrior Women?


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Unread postPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:49 am
  

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SolCannibal wrote:
Also, how do you people feel about the idea of lesser minion alternatives to the Slavers or Blind Warrior Women?


Depending on the game, and the Splugorth...I'm all for it. I'm eager to see what you come up with.
I'm currently working on a random generation table set for Splugorth Kingdoms, though it won't thoroughly cover all the specific bases(some of which are rather hard to quantify), but it should be a start for story grist and hopefully kickstart people's imaginations if they want Splugorth encounters. .

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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