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Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 12:10 am
  

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Hero

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Avatara wrote:
One more point for the mechanoids is, they harvest planets. All they have to do is get there really big straw and empty one of the lakes out and poor it onto the battle field. Good by vamps


Only if they know that weakness.


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Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 1:55 am
  

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Nightmaster wrote:
Read again Rifts Sourcebook 2 and pay close atention to the description the KS gives about the reactions that a mechanoid would have if outsmarted or defeated by humanoids. Not bizarre exagerations.


What page?

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Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 9:53 am
  

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Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nightmaster wrote:
Read again Rifts Sourcebook 2 and pay close atention to the description the KS gives about the reactions that a mechanoid would have if outsmarted or defeated by humanoids. Not bizarre exagerations.


What page?


I dont have the book here right now but once I have I will post the page, line and paragraph.


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Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 1:16 pm
  

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Nightmaster wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nightmaster wrote:
Read again Rifts Sourcebook 2 and pay close atention to the description the KS gives about the reactions that a mechanoid would have if outsmarted or defeated by humanoids. Not bizarre exagerations.


What page?


I dont have the book here right now but once I have I will post the page, line and paragraph.


:ok:

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 Post subject: Logistics
Unread postPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 12:16 am
  

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There are too many variations and situations to contemplate on this one. If the Mechanoids have limited numbers (suggested by the scenarios of the Rifts Mechanoids sourcebook), then the vampires would likely "win" as the vampires have the resources, numbers, and replenishable numbers.

If the Mechanoids have a whole Mothership or more, the vampires are in jeopardy as the Mechanoids have the numbers and time to figure out a weakness to the vampires (considering that the Mechanoids simply don't destroy the planet from a safe distance). The mechanoids en masse have the time and numbers to eliminate other humanoids, and depriving vampires of blood and replacements.

If we are talking equal numbers and resources, it's the GM's call. Keep in mind that both sides would have "allies", and vampires are more dependant on other races as a source of food and replacements than Mechanoids are.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 5:00 am
  

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kill off the sheep (i.e. us) and you kill off the vampires. a battle of attrition.


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Unread postPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 3:01 pm
  

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duck-foot wrote:
kill off the sheep (i.e. us) and you kill off the vampires. a battle of attrition.


I don't think vampires die from starvation (could be wrong), but would be put into an endless bloodfrenzy that may/maynot be benificial to the mechanoids.

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Unread postPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 12:24 am
  

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dark brandon wrote:
duck-foot wrote:
kill off the sheep (i.e. us) and you kill off the vampires. a battle of attrition.


I don't think vampires die from starvation (could be wrong), but would be put into an endless bloodfrenzy that may/maynot be benificial to the mechanoids.


oh it would be benificial. remember vampires become insane when starved. insane vampires cant use there heads, makes em easier to kill.


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Unread postPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 8:07 am
  

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Glad to see this one still going.

I've read nothing yet that could convince me that vampires could even begin to resist a full on mechanoid invasion (why would the intelligence try? better to jump dimensions and try again)

Ok, you have a vampire dominated world that maintains a sizeable slave stock for food. A mechanoid fleet arrives in orbit and bombards the planet back to the stone age, wiping out the slave stock (use high flying/high speed Wasps to ensure they are all dead) and also destroying the best part, if not all, of the vamp's shelter.

Then wait - a year if needs be - for the vamps not dusted by sunlight to enter a dryed up topor. Land your mechanoid invasion force and begin carving the world into bite-sized chunks.

ta-dah!

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 11:08 am
  

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sHaka wrote:
Glad to see this one still going.

I've read nothing yet that could convince me that vampires could even begin to resist a full on mechanoid invasion (why would the intelligence try? better to jump dimensions and try again)

Ok, you have a vampire dominated world that maintains a sizeable slave stock for food. A mechanoid fleet arrives in orbit and bombards the planet back to the stone age, wiping out the slave stock (use high flying/high speed Wasps to ensure they are all dead) and also destroying the best part, if not all, of the vamp's shelter.

Then wait - a year if needs be - for the vamps not dusted by sunlight to enter a dryed up topor. Land your mechanoid invasion force and begin carving the world into bite-sized chunks.

ta-dah!


There are too many variables to really call this one.

In this instance, the vampires only have 1 planet and no space capabilities...hardly seems a fair representation of a 'vs' match.

In another instance, what if they do have space capabilities and have other means to sustain themselves...what if they are far enough out into space that the sunlight has no affect on them?

who's to say the vampire intelligence can't/won't use magic and psionics to find the mechanoids cloning plant, teleport in, mess with the cloner (hey they use to be humans, who says he can't make mechanoid vampires?) then teleport out?

What if the mechanoids have no idea that vampires are vampires and have difficulty figuring out their weakness?

Which of the groups have first warning? What would mechanoids do if they encounter a group of creatures who are nothing more than floating mists, or psionic wolves/bats who use humans as play things (not sure if there is a duration on being in wolf/bat/mist form at the moment). Vampires are noteriously manipulative, and as shown mechnoids, while dislikeing it, have no problem letting non-humanoid creatures have humanoids as playthings (archie and haggan for example)

For example, the mechanoids on RIFTS earth wouldn't stand a candle of a chance against the vampires on RIFTS earth.

Then again, the vampires on rifts earth wouldn't stand a candle of a chance against the mechanoids from "Mechanoid invasion".

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Unread postPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 6:17 am
  

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Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nightmaster wrote:
Read again Rifts Sourcebook 2 and pay close atention to the description the KS gives about the reactions that a mechanoid would have if outsmarted or defeated by humanoids. Not bizarre exagerations.


What page?


I remember reading this as well in either CB1 or SB2.


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Unread postPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 6:20 am
  

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dark brandon wrote:
...the mechanoids on RIFTS earth wouldn't stand a candle of a chance against the vampires on RIFTS earth.

Then again, the vampires on rifts earth wouldn't stand a candle of a chance against the mechanoids from "Mechanoid invasion".


Agreed.


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Unread postPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 2:03 am
  

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The Beast wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nightmaster wrote:
Read again Rifts Sourcebook 2 and pay close atention to the description the KS gives about the reactions that a mechanoid would have if outsmarted or defeated by humanoids. Not bizarre exagerations.


What page?


I remember reading this as well in either CB1 or SB2.


Again I ask, "what page?"

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Unread postPosted: Wed May 09, 2007 5:14 am
  

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Killer Cyborg wrote:
The Beast wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nightmaster wrote:
Read again Rifts Sourcebook 2 and pay close atention to the description the KS gives about the reactions that a mechanoid would have if outsmarted or defeated by humanoids. Not bizarre exagerations.


What page?


I remember reading this as well in either CB1 or SB2.


Again I ask, "what page?"


If it's in CB1, then it would be one the page where it talks about both Robotech and The Mechanoids PCs. If it's in SB2, then it should be toward the rear where they have a bunch of general descriptions about the mechanoids broken down into bullets. If you really want me to give you a page number though, you're gonna have to wait until December at the earliest for me to give it to you.


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Unread postPosted: Wed May 09, 2007 7:01 pm
  

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The Beast wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
The Beast wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nightmaster wrote:
Read again Rifts Sourcebook 2 and pay close atention to the description the KS gives about the reactions that a mechanoid would have if outsmarted or defeated by humanoids. Not bizarre exagerations.


What page?


I remember reading this as well in either CB1 or SB2.


Again I ask, "what page?"


If it's in CB1, then it would be one the page where it talks about both Robotech and The Mechanoids PCs. If it's in SB2, then it should be toward the rear where they have a bunch of general descriptions about the mechanoids broken down into bullets. If you really want me to give you a page number though, you're gonna have to wait until December at the earliest for me to give it to you.


:twiddles thumbs:

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 2:00 am
  

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Killer Cyborg wrote:
The Beast wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
The Beast wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
Nightmaster wrote:
Read again Rifts Sourcebook 2 and pay close atention to the description the KS gives about the reactions that a mechanoid would have if outsmarted or defeated by humanoids. Not bizarre exagerations.


What page?


I remember reading this as well in either CB1 or SB2.


Again I ask, "what page?"


If it's in CB1, then it would be one the page where it talks about both Robotech and The Mechanoids PCs. If it's in SB2, then it should be toward the rear where they have a bunch of general descriptions about the mechanoids broken down into bullets. If you really want me to give you a page number though, you're gonna have to wait until December at the earliest for me to give it to you.


:twiddles thumbs:


How's that thumb twiddeling working out for ya? :lol: If you're still waiting on me for the answer, I'll be back by Christmas.


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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 8:25 am
  

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The Beast wrote:
How's that thumb twiddeling working out for ya? :lol: If you're still waiting on me for the answer, I'll be back by Christmas.


It'll make a great Christmas present for me.

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:26 pm
  

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Vampires would work behind the scenes helping the humans in any way they could, like intel gathering and assassinating key Mechanoid units.


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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 11:32 pm
  

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Peacebringer wrote:
Vampires would work behind the scenes helping the humans in any way they could...


and then they eat them. :P


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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 6:53 am
  

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If the Mechanoids invaded a planet ruled by vampires, the vamps would wipe the floor with them in the short term. But it'd only be a matter of time until the Mechanoids figure out how to defeat vampires (I mean hell, they've got a whole damn planet full of people in the know who can be captured and tortured for information), and after that the vamps won't have a snowball's chance in hell. After all, the Mechanoids have oodles of resources. It wouldn't take too long to kit out an expeditionary force with high-pressure water cannons.

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Unread postPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:47 pm
  

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Killer Cyborg wrote:
The Beast wrote:
How's that thumb twiddeling working out for ya? :lol: If you're still waiting on me for the answer, I'll be back by Christmas.


It'll make a great Christmas present for me.


Contacted transportation toady. they shuld be bringing the stuff within thenext couple of weeeks


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Unread postPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 4:17 pm
  

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The Beast wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
The Beast wrote:
How's that thumb twiddeling working out for ya? :lol: If you're still waiting on me for the answer, I'll be back by Christmas.


It'll make a great Christmas present for me.


Contacted transportation toady. they shuld be bringing the stuff within thenext couple of weeeks


Whew.

My thumbs are a-gettin' sore.

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 8:47 pm
  

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Nightmaster wrote:
They are schizofrenik to begin off.


Just because they're crazy doesn't mean they're all stupid as well.


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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:03 am
  

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Hmmmrph. :nh: Quickly scanned through the book and didn't find it where I thought it was. I'll have to check all my Mechanoid books more thouroghly now.


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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:59 pm
  

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:badbad: Grrr! The only things I've been able to find are notes on how the free-thinkers tend to underestimate humanoids. Maybe I'm confusing them with some other species, but I don't know which ones would react that way. I keep thinking vampires, but that doesn't make any sense as they normally were human.


Either that or it's one of those things that did happen, but somehow temporally/dimensionally shifted into not happening. Kind of like Mandela dying while in prison.


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Unread postPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:48 pm
  

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The Beast wrote:
Either that or it's one of those things that did happen, but somehow temporally/dimensionally shifted into not happening. Kind of like Mandela dying while in prison.


Yeah, that sort of thing happens to me too.

Darned temporal/spacial shifts in reality. :nh:

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 12:09 am
  

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Y'know, I just realised that there's a veritable superweapon the Mechanoids could use against a vampire-dominated planet.

Ice asteroids. If you've got an Earthlike planet, lobbing enough comets and ice asteroids at it will do several fun things.

- they'll significantly increase the sea level, turning thousands and thousands of square miles of low-lying coastal areas into shallow seas that vampires can't operate in.

- the increase in sea level will lead to an increase in evaporation, which in turn leads to an increase in average humidity and an increase in rainfall around the world. Further, the extra humidity causes a greenhouse effect, raising global temperatures and further accelerating the cycle of evaporation and precipitation. In most parts of the world this will drastically increase the number of nights in the year that vamps just can't operate outside at all due to rain or the risk of rain.

- a big enough chunk of ice will vaporise a city if it drops down from orbit. That's the hiding places of hundreds or even thousands of vampires wiped out in an instant.

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 12:37 am
  

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Rallan wrote:
Y'know, I just realised that there's a veritable superweapon the Mechanoids could use against a vampire-dominated planet.

Ice asteroids. If you've got an Earthlike planet, lobbing enough comets and ice asteroids at it will do several fun things.

- they'll significantly increase the sea level, turning thousands and thousands of square miles of low-lying coastal areas into shallow seas that vampires can't operate in.

- the increase in sea level will lead to an increase in evaporation, which in turn leads to an increase in average humidity and an increase in rainfall around the world. Further, the extra humidity causes a greenhouse effect, raising global temperatures and further accelerating the cycle of evaporation and precipitation. In most parts of the world this will drastically increase the number of nights in the year that vamps just can't operate outside at all due to rain or the risk of rain.

- a big enough chunk of ice will vaporise a city if it drops down from orbit. That's the hiding places of hundreds or even thousands of vampires wiped out in an instant.


Hm.

Good thinking!

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:25 am
  

Champion

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The only real question left is:

If Mechanoids are basically just very mutated humans, could you make a Mechanoid Vampire?

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:31 am
  

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Rallan wrote:
The only real question left is:

If Mechanoids are basically just very mutated humans, could you make a Mechanoid Vampire?


I would think that you could, but that it wouldn't be very effective.
They'd just be like any other vampire, only oddly shaped, and the only way they could be turned would be to tear up their containment suits/armor.
And even if you got some armor intact, I don't know that they could still interact with it in the same way. If they have any actual cybernetics/bionics that allow them to control their armor, turning vamp would mean that the implants would be rejected.

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 Post subject:
Unread postPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:33 am
  

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Rallan wrote:
The only real question left is:

If Mechanoids are basically just very mutated humans, could you make a Mechanoid Vampire?


Hmm. There are vampire elves and ogres in the Old Ones book, and mechanoids are a mortal species, even if they've engineered themselves to where they're at now. I'd say it's possible, but you'd likely end up with a very phsyiclly weak vampire (based of the artwork of their description).


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Unread postPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:35 am
  

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And I see KC ninjaed in the same reply I was going for. :lol:


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Unread postPosted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 8:44 pm
  

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I FOUND IT!


Page 31 SB2, second to last paragraph on the left.


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Unread postPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 10:14 pm
  

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The Beast wrote:
I FOUND IT!


Page 31 SB2, second to last paragraph on the left.


Whew!

I was on my 32nd pair of thumbs!

Here's one of them:

:ok:

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Unread postPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 11:04 pm
  

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Vamps lose. Reasons:
1)Many Mechanoids have See Aura, thus tipping them off to the fact that the Vamps aren't humans.
2)Vamps are not immune to Psi-swords.
3)Human foodstock will rat on vamps looong b4 they die at the hands of the Mechs.
4)Vamps have a host of weaknesses, while the Mechanoids don't(besides insanity and a racial prohibition against using magic).
5)Mechanoids have waaaay better speed on the average, and higher intelligence than Vamps on average.

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 Post subject: Re:
Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:05 am
  

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Killer Cyborg wrote:
Rallan wrote:
The only real question left is:

If Mechanoids are basically just very mutated humans, could you make a Mechanoid Vampire?


I would think that you could, but that it wouldn't be very effective.
They'd just be like any other vampire, only oddly shaped, and the only way they could be turned would be to tear up their containment suits/armor.
And even if you got some armor intact, I don't know that they could still interact with it in the same way. If they have any actual cybernetics/bionics that allow them to control their armor, turning vamp would mean that the implants would be rejected.


I would think that being a vampire in their mutated form would be pretty odd looking.....and kind of cool!

At any rate, a mechanoid vampire would be a pretty creepy villain to introduce in any setting, especially with their unreasoning hatred of all things humanoid..

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 9:00 am
  

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Plus they could go out in sunlight do to the fact that they are incased in an exoskeleton all they would have to do is paint the window black and rely on their hud. dispite that I think a mechanoid vampire would be stupid. And should not be.

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Unread postPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 4:55 am
  

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Avatara wrote:
Plus they could go out in sunlight do to the fact that they are incased in an exoskeleton all they would have to do is paint the window black and rely on their hud. dispite that I think a mechanoid vampire would be stupid. And should not be.


I actually don't think that would be the case. Vampire Kingdoms pretty clearly states that vamps don't wear armor due to their elemental nature after the change and that it inhibits their transformation powers.

I doubt a mechanoid vampire would even bother with an exoskeleton. Small size and transformation powers would still make for a wicked cool, yet odd looking, vamp villain.

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Unread postPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 8:40 am
  

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except for the part where the thing can't walk. But I'd also figure that the mechinoids would be too transformed by the prosses that they became mech's anyway to become a vamp but thats just me.

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Unread postPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 4:55 am
  

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Avatara wrote:
except for the part where the thing can't walk. But I'd also figure that the mechinoids would be too transformed by the prosses that they became mech's anyway to become a vamp but thats just me.


Well, don't the mechanoids have telepathy in lieu of speaking ability?

As far as the creatures being too transformed for a conversion to Vampire, I'd agree with that except (though I could be wrong) don't they have the ability to leave their mechanical bodies for relaxation periods?

Granted, I could be confusing them with the Invid in that regard...

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Unread postPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 8:20 am
  

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well yes they can leave the suit but there kind of like the old villian from the TMNT cartoon and he was not all that good at moving around with out his toys.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 4:12 pm
  

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Avatara wrote:
well yes they can leave the suit but there kind of like the old villian from the TMNT cartoon and he was not all that good at moving around with out his toys.


Yeah, but vampire metamorphosis could help out with that! :P

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Unread postPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 10:40 pm
  

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Grell wrote:
Avatara wrote:
well yes they can leave the suit but there kind of like the old villian from the TMNT cartoon and he was not all that good at moving around with out his toys.


Yeah, but vampire metamorphosis could help out with that! :P

How would the vamp convert the Mechanoid? They don't get out of their suits very often...

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Unread postPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 7:26 pm
  

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Aren't mechanoids cybernetic creatures? As in bonded to their machines? So turning them into vampires would be incredibly useless they would end up as blobs i.e. do they even have a mouth? Though yes, they could stay in bat/mist form pretty much always.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 3:27 pm
  

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Severite wrote:
Aren't mechanoids cybernetic creatures? As in bonded to their machines? So turning them into vampires would be incredibly useless they would end up as blobs i.e. do they even have a mouth? Though yes, they could stay in bat/mist form pretty much always.


If they were bonded to their machines, then no because they'd essentially be considered a full conversion borg. But this line of thought is based on the idea (whether right or wrong) that they have the ability to leave their mechanical bodies, something a traditional full borg can't do.

I don't think it would matter much how weak the mechanoid is physically outside their suit because the vamp conversion is a supernatural process and the creature would be getting new stats anyways (stats that don't take into consideration what form the vamp had while mortal).

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:17 pm
  

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Grell wrote:
Severite wrote:
Aren't mechanoids cybernetic creatures? As in bonded to their machines? So turning them into vampires would be incredibly useless they would end up as blobs i.e. do they even have a mouth? Though yes, they could stay in bat/mist form pretty much always.


If they were bonded to their machines, then no because they'd essentially be considered a full conversion borg. But this line of thought is based on the idea (whether right or wrong) that they have the ability to leave their mechanical bodies, something a traditional full borg can't do.

I don't think it would matter much how weak the mechanoid is physically outside their suit because the vamp conversion is a supernatural process and the creature would be getting new stats anyways (stats that don't take into consideration what form the vamp had while mortal).


Granted, they would be blobs with supernatural strength, but blobs all the same.....I need to go back and reread mechanoids again, I remember them being attached to their machines, so bollocks for me. Anywho, do you have a page number on their outside the cybernetics stats? Sides, even if your supposed to add superhuman speed, would you still add it to a flesh mound? Oh, and do they have mouths to feed?

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Unread postPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 4:53 am
  

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A quick glance doesn't reveal any base stats. They're not cool like the Invid in that regard, though the book does state that the mechanoids metal bodies are more akin to EBA. It suggests that they could be removed from the body for whatever reason.

I'm tired, so I'll have to look more in depth later!

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Unread postPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 9:36 am
  

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go to page 56 of the mechanoid invasion trilogy. There is where you get the description of the mechanoids. it says they are geneticly engineered and infused with cybernetics also that they are clones aswell. as for the suits.

'It appears that the exterior machine shell serves them in much the same way as the Human E.B.A. Unlike the human E.B.A, these metal constuctions serve as a "permanent," environment providing constant stimulation, nourishment, protection, and sensory input.'

As for the fleshy parts "The organisms, themselves, are carbon-based creatures composed of soft, fleshy tissue and an intricate nervous system. This organism may or may not posses tendrils or any other obvios sensory organs."

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Unread postPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 12:26 pm
  

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Well there you have it then!

Still, look at the picture of the digger "without body armor" on page 192 and tell me that wouldn't be a creepy, vampiric little critter!

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Unread postPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 4:55 pm
  

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Grell wrote:
Well there you have it then!

Still, look at the picture of the digger "without body armor" on page 192 and tell me that wouldn't be a creepy, vampiric little critter!

"Little"? Not very, unless you consider Dominator Ships to be "middling-sized".

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